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Peepers Is Sick Again


jody

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Well it's time again for this discussion :(

[*]Test Results for the Following:

[*]Ammonia Level?

0

[*]Nitrite Level?

0

[*]Nitrate level?

0 (Green Water)

[*]Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)?

PH 7.6-7.8

KH 50

GH 60

[*]Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)?

PH 6.8

KH 10

GH 20

PH is controlled with crushed coral and PH matched water during a wc. The reason i am going back to Goldfish Plus water conditioner(see below) because it contains a buffer and changes the water to 7.6 during a wc which helps me match the PH.

[*]Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops?

Hagen, API - drops

[*]Water temperature?

75 F

[*]Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running?

27 Gallon - running 2 years

[*]What is the name and size of the filter(s)?

2-aquaclear 50 (400 gph)

[*]How often do you change the water and how much?

80% weekly

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size?

1 fish 6 inches including tail

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners?

Prime and Nutrifin ph stabilizer - phasing both out for Nutrifin - Goldfish +.

[*]What do you feed your fish and how often?

Feed twice daily. Fed Metro Meds dec 21 - Jan 3, Jumpstart Jan 4 - Now. Fed peas once and frozen blood worms once yesterday.

[*]Any new fish added to the tank?

No

[*]Any medications added to the tank?

Pimafix

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus?

Fungus between eyes

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.?

No unusual behavior, acting fine, sometimes a little floaty after the feeding the jumpstart but I have chalked that up to his sole diet of pellets as of late

I have a bad feeling about this one. I'll try and tell the whole story here, sorry if it gets a little jumbled. Peepers went through a bad case of bacterial infection about a month in a half ago. I would call it dropsy but some have corrected me before saying dropsy is just a condition that is caused by bacterial infection. My other telescope Google died of this infection with real bad pineconing. I treated with a number of thigs,while diagnosing the situation - salt, prazi, Marcyn 2, and Metro Meds. The Metro Meds worked fine and everything seemed okay. He developed some fungas on his dorsal fin and tail fin lately, not much at all so I decided to treat with Pimafix, it has been in the water for 4 days now.

A side note here I have had some green water for a long time now and cured it the first time with a cheap uv sterilizer. When I started the Prazi I removed it and never used it agin until last night about 14 hours ago because my green water is getting out of control again. I didnt sterilize it as I wasent really thinking and now it could of contained some bacteria from last bout of ilness. But I would think it would take more than 14 hours for symptoms to appear. The fungus between his eyes I noticed this morning (it wasent there last night) when I got up and it is quite prenounced. It is in a symetrical pattern on each side of the eyes. This has me worried because it is right near where he has had a rough raised (not discolored) patch between his eyes since the initial infection. What makes me think the infection is back is that I have noticed the past several days some white stringy poop in the tank. Not exclusively white poop as he still poops solid poop the same color as the Jumpstart.

Right now I am going to start the salt at .1% after a huge 80% wc, maybe even a 100% change. I want to start the metro meds but can you start them back to back like this?

As always I would really appreciate your advice and help so that we can get Peepers healthy again. :)

peepers-2.jpg

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Omg...you should look at my thread called "white spots on chaos" in this same DD section. She still has the spots and hasn't been treated for anything yet. Her spots have become much much larger since the last pic added.

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It could very well be a wen. The spots are right above the rough patch between his eyes which kind of looks like a mini wen. I'll try and get some better pics tonight after my wc when the green water is mostly changed out, I find I can get better pics when the water is clear.

He has some bubble eye in him so a wen is possible as he seems to be a mix.

Edited by Hawaiian Crush
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I am not sure if it is the same thing, but Dr.House would get these things between her eyes once in a while. they would go away a few days after. how long have they been there?

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Things are progressing. I did a 80% wc two days ago and have been treating with pimafix. No salt yet, however I am going to start it I think. The white is covering all of the top of his head. I think I can see some orange or red in there as well, not sure if it is an open wound or just coloring. Here are some shots I got, it is so hard to take pictures of this little bugger because my camera does a little flash before the flash and he runs away. I am forced to not use the flash which makes it hard to get a half decent picture. Here are the best I got out of 50:

peep4.jpg

peep3.jpg

peep2.jpg

peep1-1.jpg

Any advice would be great :)

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He has that white stuff all over the top of his head and just behind that near the top of the gills, also on his tail fin a little. Today I am worried, he is cuddled in a corner facing the back of the tank motionless. He wont come out. Iam treating with the Pimafix and .2% salt right now. Is it okay to start the Metro Meds?

Edit: Here is a picture I got of him in the corner, you can see the affected area on his head. I coxed him out of the corner with my hand, he is very lethargic and went right back in the corner.

peep5.jpg

Edited by Hawaiian Crush
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Sorry about all the posts but I have been researching and all the symptoms are there for Hole in the Head disease.

I am about to feed MM, bring the salt to .3%. and turn off the tank light.

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Oh no! I hope the treatment works. Sorry that you have to deal with this and I hope Peepers feels better soon.

:angelstaf:

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Oh poor thing :(

Have you already used PrimaFix on them? I know that when I used it on Humphrey she totally freaked out.

I would almost do a huge wc and just raise salt to 0.3. I think most fungi would die in that alone. Unless he is now sensitive to salt? Dr.House got very sensitive to it after she had dropsy.

As for the MMs I think they don't work for fungi but I am not sure. MediGold I think is more appropriate, but way harsher on the kidneys.

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Thanks Guys :)

I have been using the Pimafix for about a week now, the little bottle I bought is almost all gone. He seemed to handle it fine, but it never helped with any of the fungus type stuff. He didnt used to be sensitive to salt, but I just did raise it to .2% last night and now today this bottom sitting.

Medigold I can get here in about 3-4 days if I order today. Stuff is going to run me $40 bucks but you say it is better for fungial eh? Do you think I should run MM for the 3-4 days until MediGold?

Not sure what do you think? Salt and MM, or MediGold alone.

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Do you think he is bottom sitting from the salt or the fungus getting to him?

I know that after the dropsy House always bloated with salt. I couldn't use it on her anymore.

Primafix I don't think works as an only resource.

MMs are good for internal bacteria but I am not sure if they are for fungus. For sure I wouldn't just do 4 days and then change-that will lead to resistant bacteria.

I am also not sure you can use medigold since he has had dropsy so maybe his kidneys are weaker.

How many waterchanges are you doing weekly?

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I think he might just be bottom sitting as a result of the disease. He doesnt seem bloated. I am about to do a 50% wc, all I have time for before work, and bring the salt to .3%. And keep up with MM and see how that goes.

Waterchanges have been pretty consistent at 80% weekely.

Oh yeah and I used MM not too long ago, is that going to lead to resistant bacteria?

Edited by Hawaiian Crush
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I would do more frequent water changes and then raise the salt to 0.3% if it was my fish. I am not too sure about Metro killing fungus - even less if you just used it.

I think you should wait for a Mod before starting any medicated food so soon after the previous.

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Okay I just did a 50% wc and brought the salt to .3% ( I already had it at .2%)

I did do a feeding of MM a couple of hours ago. I will wait for a mod about continuing with that though. i'll pm one tonight if I havent heard then.

I am off to work...

Thanks :)

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oh then if you started the MMs I am not too sure you can stop - since it is an antibiotic. How much did you feed?

Yea def wait for a Mod. If he is still depressed tonight I would think it is related to the salt tho.

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He does seem better now since I got off work. He is still on the bottom but he gets up when you come close to the tank and begs for food. Which is better than this morning when he wouldnt get off the bottom at all. I want to feed the MM again tonight, he had a feeding this morning. I am still wondering if he can be started on this again.

I'll certianly up the wc while he is sick. But for maintence I hear lots of members do 80% a week and that is enough. His Nitrates are always low and I have good filtration. Two 75% a week seems excessive for one fish in a 27 gallon.

Thanks for all your help and concern :)

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Hi Jody. I'm sorry Peepers is causing you worries again. first of all, the orange color appearing on her eyes is quite normal, some of my black teles have that ...

and so is 'some' wen growth on teles after several years. My first "to do" thing would be to see if you can rub off the fungus spots/spores. True fungussy stuff will rub off with a gentle rub.

If it wont budge then it is probably bacterial- also called fungus confusingly. You can put your hand in and cup her gently in the water to do this, no need to take her out.

If you have started on another course of MMs you really should stay the course. How many days has she had of MMs this time?

The salt is excellent for this..0.2% should be enough.

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Thanks Trinket for responding to my PM, it is well appreciated :)

I tried to rub some off gently but nothing came off. It could be because there is not much there now, just a thin layer, I think the salt is working. He is much better today swimming around normally, a big change of how he was yesterday. I fed the MM for a day and a half now.

Here is an updated pic (a little blurry) but I think you can see the fungusy type stuff is getting better.

Thanks again :)

peep6.jpg

Edited by Hawaiian Crush
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tooo cute:whatjust: and good job!!

Salt is a miracle for those skin things. Sloughs it off.

I love the color change going on, very pretty.

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:) lol, glad you guys like him. I'll pass it along ;)

Yeah things are going well. He is back to himself on his fins. So really possibly it just could have been fungus and a wen growth instead of Hole in the Head? Do ya think? I don't know why the bottom sitting though. Either way it's been two days on the MM, so I have to stay the course with that. I didnt know it could be used a month apart, which is good to know, unless I got that wrong :hummm

as always thank you :)

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good he is getting back to normal!

It probably wasn't hole in the head. it isn't very common in goldfish. and it is usually caused by an internal parasite Hexamita I think - would have been weird for him to just get it now.

maybe he just caught the fungus because his body is still weak from the dropsy :)

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