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White Spots On Luna


Sakura

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I am glad you have a plan of attack here, Sakura. I would also do a bleach job on your plants and rocks and add them again after you finish the salt treatment. I would do a two minute 19 to 1 water to bleach ratio, then soak them in fresh water for the next week while you are treating the tank. Your plants will be ich free and should be able to handle that just fine.

That is the thing that always amazes me about ich...you can see a tank with ich in it at a LFS and half the fish are covered and a few are completely spot free.

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Its kinda like having members in your home with colds but others dont.... i think its more of an immune system thing :(

and if you dump the water that the fish come from in your tank with the other fish with out QT you will get ich if other fish from where you got it from had ich....Also plants and such. :(

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They aren't feeling better today :( I'm still worried.

Chiba and Grindle are hovering lethargically with dorsals down, and all the others are sitting on the bottom and breathing hard. There are no spots at all on any of them. How can they be suffering so much if there are no ich spots on them?

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pH is still 8.3 like always. I haven't been able to really see their gills too much. These ones aren't very hand-tame yet so I'm not comfortable with picking them up to look in their gills. Sometimes I do see little flashes of red gills as they're swimming, but that's about it.

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Ich is a protozoan parasite with a complex lifecycle. When the cysts (trophonts) drop off the fish they drop around 1000 tomites each (the free swimming stage of ich) into the water.

The free swimming tomites cannot be seen and will then seek a live host and bury themselves into and under the skin of the fish. This is what you are treating.............with salt...the tiny larval forms that are swarming all over the fish and buried in under their slimecoat invisible to us. Slowly the salt should kill them BUT ONLY if the water is absolutely perfect and the salt is at 0.3% for a sustained period.

It is also very possible that your fish have a secondary internal infection for which I recommended Medigold.

Does this answer your question Sakura?

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Yes, it does thanks Imo. I actually have just Serafina on metromeds right now. Do you think metromeds would work well, or is medigold better? I have both.

I just made a vet appointment for wednesday. I want to have a scrape done so that I can know for sure what parasite is going on here, although it's probably ich. I could have had a house call, but that was $160, so I went for the office visit which was "only" $70. :doh11: I'm just going to bring one fish in- probably whichever one seems the most up to traveling. It's not a long ways at least.

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Yes sure do get a scrape done.

Remember 96% of parasites including epystylis (which looks a little like ich spots) and costia and chilo are killed in salt. So I would stick with sustained salt till then.

Metromeds is okay but the ingredients are bacteriostatic meaning they do not kill bacteria, just inhibit growth...a very good choice therefore for fish that have kidney issues or are floaty. Medigold is stronger in a way containing kanamycin which is bactericidal meaning it is harsher but kills bacteria dead. Both meds have a broad range. I would go with MG here. They must be fresh and unopened.

Im really sorry this is all getting so expensive for you. At this time of year too :(

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Yeah it's getting spendy :( I think I can pull it off, but hubby's not going to be pleased!

Okay the Medigold I have has been opened and used before. Shoot, it looks like I didn't mark the open date on the bag either. I would guess it's from a few months ago, and it's been kept in a cool and dry place. Okay to use, or no?

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i recently used MMs that were a few months old - not the best, but better than nothing. I think if they are less then 3-4 it should be okey.

I really had good results on it so I think you will too :) It should fix up their fins well too.

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i recently used MMs that were a few months old - not the best, but better than nothing. I think if they are less then 3-4 it should be okey.

I really had good results on it so I think you will too :) It should fix up their fins well too.

Do you mean Medigold?

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Uh oh, Imo? I am seeing some other symptoms. I noticed Loki (the black moor) seems a little "bigger" looking, so I took a closer look from above, and sure enough... he is slightly bloated and the scales are slightly lifted behind his gills only. What should I do about that? Also, Grindle has a fluid-like ring beginning around his eye- probably the beginning of pop-eye. Dang I wish my vet had an earlier appointment available.

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Uh oh, Imo? I am seeing some other symptoms. I noticed Loki (the black moor) seems a little "bigger" looking, so I took a closer look from above, and sure enough... he is slightly bloated and the scales are slightly lifted behind his gills only. What should I do about that? Also, Grindle has a fluid-like ring beginning around his eye- probably the beginning of pop-eye. Dang I wish my vet had an earlier appointment available.

Did you have a pH crash recently? Something has weakened your little ones immune system so much that they are getting other diseases. Have you considered treating with anitbotics? Or is that too extreme, I know a lot of people on this forum don't normally do that. I have you and your fishies in mind :/

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Sakura......its a tricky thing. I think Metromeds do keep longer (and this is all assuming they are stored in an airsealed pack with dry dark conditions.)

I had a bad experience using Medigold that was several months old. Different antibiotics have different stability range, meaning they can drop in efficiency over various time lengths. I think kanamycin maybe less stable than oxytetracyline in MMs. I can check all this as I forget right now...multitasking here...

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Sakura......its a tricky thing. I think Metromeds do keep longer (and this is all assuming they are stored in an airsealed pack with dry dark conditions.)

I had a bad experience using Medigold that was several months old. Different antibiotics have different stability range, meaning they can drop in efficiency over various time lengths. I think kanamycin maybe less stable than oxytetracyline in MMs. I can check all this as I forget right now...multitasking here...

Okay. I know you're busy right now and it's fine if it takes you a while to respond, but I wanted to make sure you saw what I wrote in my last post. I'll re-post it:

Uh oh, Imo? I am seeing some other symptoms. I noticed Loki (the black moor) seems a little "bigger" looking, so I took a closer look from above, and sure enough... he is slightly bloated and the scales are slightly lifted behind his gills only. What should I do about that? Also, Grindle has a fluid-like ring beginning around his eye- probably the beginning of pop-eye. Dang I wish my vet had an earlier appointment available.
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Thx for re-posting, I did miss that. Any chance of a picture?

Meanwhile stay with the salt. If this is parasites that have internalized then you must stay covered for that...if its gone bacterial I dont believe salt will hurt. Get onto the food meds asap and I would feed METROMEDS.

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Hey, Sakura, if you have time tomorrow, you might call your vet and plead for them to fit you in. If they say they can't, then maybe they'd be willing to call if they have any cancellations. If not, you're in the good hands of Trinket, but I know you are worried, so from a peace of mind point of view seems like it might be worth checking first thing in the AM to see if they can squeeze you in there. Often, vets will try, esp. if you tell them matters are getting worse and there are new symptoms indicating secondary bacterial infections. I do hope they begin to get better soon, Sakura.

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Hey Spillie

Yeah I did ask for them to call me if there were any cancellations. The thing is, my vet has a house call in the morning, then one appointment, and then an emergency surgery to do. So she is pretty booked tomorrow early in the day, and then I have a final to go take in the evening. :( It's just all around bad timing.

Ken just called, and I did win that awesome calico, btw! He's holding my three fish until further notice because he feels bad for me and wants everything to get worked out before he ships them.

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Yea sorry I was talking that I recently used the MMs that were older. I have never used older MediGold so I cannot say :)

Now anyways it seems you will be on MMs.

But at this point, if they seriously start to pinecone I would get the water tested ASAP! It is impossible that it keeps happening to you for it not to be water related like Susan said.

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Well I am thinking there is some pathogen that got introduced into the tank at some point. I think right now that's more likely than it being an issue with the water. When I go to the vet on Wednesday though, I'll try to remember to ask her if she thinks it's possible there's an issue with the water or pipes in my apartment, and if she knows of a good testing place. If it's too expensive though, I won't be able to have it done right now anyways. :(

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