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Oh My God...flukes Again?


npila1

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I was just posting another topic about fin rot on my comet and now I saw one of my commons, Sparkle, who is in the naughty tank right now, twitching and scratching on the gravel :(:(:( They were treated with prazi for flukes for 7-8 weeks (because they were still yawning by then) and I last added prazi about 4 weeks ago. I still saw him yawning after I stopped the prazi, but because I had been adding it for so long, I stopped the treatment thinking the yawning was because of something else. This is the first time I saw him do this since the prazi treatment ended. Does this mean he has flukes again/still? I'm leaving for a week in 9 days, so this is a nightmare :(

[*]Ammonia Level? 0

[*]Nitrite Level? 0

[*]Nitrate level? 0

[*]Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 7.5

[*]Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 6.8 (buff it up)

[*]Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? api drops

[*]Water temperature? 72

[*]Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 5 gallons, naughty tank, 1.5 months

[*]What is the name and size of the filter(s)? aquaculture 10 gallons

[*]How often do you change the water and how much? every 1-2 days, 50%

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size? 1, 2.5-3 inches

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners? prime

[*]What do you feed your fish and how often? twice a day, progold, peas, freeze dried bloodworms, corn

[*]Any new fish added to the tank? no

[*]Any medications added to the tank? prazi last added 1 months ago

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? no

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? somewhat less active than usual, but no bottom sitting, great appetite. Occasional yawning and now saw him scratching on the gravel for the first time.

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Maybe it's too small for him? If he's been in there 1 and a half months I think his naughtyness would be done by now. Maybe do a deep gravel vacuuming. I doubt it's flukes. Sometimes fish yawn for a variety of reasons including to clean their gills. Link does it sometimes, I guess it's hard to breathe since his huge wen is on his gill plate.

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What about the fact that he's twitching and scratching on the gravel?

I vacuum the gravel every day when I do water changes. I was hesitant about putting him back in the other tank because as I said I will be away for a week soon, so I won't be able to see what is going on. I was going to wait until I was back to put them all back together again.

Edited by npila1
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personally, seeing as it's a small tank qt/naughty i would recommend you remove all the gravel in 2 water change stages. then i recommend you up your water changes to daily as he's a medium fish in half the tank size that is recommended.. i would do the water changes daily for a week once the gravel is completely removed and see if that makes a difference to him.. hopefully you will see some improvement before you leave.

consider to change feeding to once every couple of days. this will help with water quality.

is there anyone to help with waterchanges whilst you're gone? seeing as it's such a small tank, there shouldn't be too much effort envolved?

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Will removing all the gravel in 2 water changes (i.e. within 2 days) cause a cycle bump? I just started getting nitrates (0-5 ppm) and my ammonia and nitrites have been at 0 recently, so I just want to make sure I don't mess up the cycle. I have been doing pretty much daily changes for a while now (at least 5-6 water changes a week). I will keep doing the daily water changes, but what are the possible reasons for the twitching and scratching?

I have someone that will be feeding them, but he won't be able to do water changes.

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if you are concerned about your cycle, then i would remove the gravel in 3 lots.. is there much gravel in there? hopefully once it's all out, it will be healthier for the fish whilst you're gone.

re the twitching and scratching, i can only suggest flukes as the most probable cause.. unless you can see ich forming at all? some have said that they can get mouth flukes too, have you checked inside his mouth to see if there is anything not right happening there?

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if you are concerned about your cycle, then i would remove the gravel in 3 lots.. is there much gravel in there? hopefully once it's all out, it will be healthier for the fish whilst you're gone.

re the twitching and scratching, i can only suggest flukes as the most probable cause.. unless you can see ich forming at all? some have said that they can get mouth flukes too, have you checked inside his mouth to see if there is anything not right happening there?

The gravel is not that much. About 1 cm thick.

Yeah that's what I thought about the flukes. No I don't see ich forming. I haven't checked inside his mouth but when he opens it I don't see anything strange inside. So if it's probably flukes (because of the twitching and scratching), the only thing that will treat this is prazi right? Should I start the treatment?

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Well since you used the prazi for so long, I would wait until all of the gravel is out and then do one dose before you leave and see what it's like when you get back. Sounds like he's surface gulping.

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Well since you used the prazi for so long, I would wait until all of the gravel is out and then do one dose before you leave and see what it's like when you get back. Sounds like he's surface gulping.

He yawns several times a day but doesn't surface gulp that much - usually after feeding. So, if the twitching/scratching continues after I take out all the gravel, I should only add the prazi once the day before I leave (=not follow the "standard" schedule suggested on kokos)?

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Sometimes fish do what looks like flashing or scratching when they are frustrated in a smaller tank. A bit of weird swimming here and there and occasional yawning wouldn't worry me. I would also tend to wait a bit here and see if it is space related.

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Sometimes fish do what looks like flashing or scratching when they are frustrated in a smaller tank. A bit of weird swimming here and there and occasional yawning wouldn't worry me. I would also tend to wait a bit here and see if it is space related.

Before yesterday, he was extremely active and happy all the time, and it didn't look like he had a problem with the space. And in fact, he's still active and playful. But I'll remove the gravel and watch him to decide what to do next.

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I vacuumed and removed half of the gravel and changed 50% of the water. He is clamping his fins a lot, he is less active than usual, he yawns, occasionally surface gulps, and twitches a bit (but only saw him scratching on the gravel that one time). I feel like all these symptoms clearly point to flukes. And if I'm going to be treating for flukes with prazi, I'd like to do so as soon as possible, since I'm leaving in about a week from today. So, my question is: is it IMPOSSIBLE for him to have flukes, given that I did a 6-week prazi treatment that ended about a month ago? If not, then I'm pretty sure he does.

Edited by npila1
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no, not impossible, sometimes flukes take 2-3 full course treatments if they've latched on good and proper. i still think it may be space related hence trying to get you to maximize his space by removing the gravel..

is it possible for you to buy a 10 gallon rubbermaid tub? i hear they're cheap over there at your local clearance stores.. and i guess once he's in there and the treatment for flukes, things should improve? naturally your filter would be onpar with the water quantity.. and perhaps even a bubbler..

what do you say?

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Hi, thanks for the reply. I don't mind buying a rubbermaid tub (I don't care about spending money, I just want them to be healthy), but the problem is that I don't have a car and I don't know exactly what I would be looking for as far as "rubbermaid tubs" are concerned. I tried searching for them online in the past too but I couldn't figure out if what I found was what people on kokos were talking about.

To treat for flukes with prazi for a second time, should I repeat the suggested 35-day treatment below? Or should I do something else?

Day 1 -- remove carbon, perform water change with vacuuming, and add prazi to tank

Day 2 -- add prazi

Day 3 -- do nothing

Day 4 -- do nothing

Day 5 -- do nothing

Day 6 -- add prazi

Day 7 -- add prazi

Day 8 -- normal partial water change with vacuuming

Day 14 - normal partial water change, then add prazi

Day 21 - normal partial water change, then add prazi

Day 28 - normal partial water change, then add prazi

Day 35 - normal partial water change, add carbon, treatment is complete

Can I start the prazi treatment now and move him in a bigger tub if I manage to get one?

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okay.. i will get someone to post links for the rubbermaids..

i recomend picking the cycle for the time you will be away for instance, the longest period of time to not add prazi or performing a water chabge is day 8 so, day 8 will be when you leave. does that make sense? i think then you will be back on day 16/17? and i am sure you can pick up the routine from there, but i strongly recommend the rubbermaid.. if the money is okay with you, then perhaps you should go a 15-20gallon rubbermaid? the water will stay cleaner for longer:

Day 1 -- remove carbon, perform water change with vacuuming, and add prazi to tank

Day 2 -- add prazi

Day 3 -- do nothing

Day 4 -- do nothing

Day 5 -- do nothing

Day 6 -- add prazi

Day 7 -- add prazi

Day 8 -- normal partial water change with vacuuming

Day 14 - normal partial water change, then add prazi

Day 21 - normal partial water change, then add prazi

Day 28 - normal partial water change, then add prazi

Day 35 - normal partial water change, add carbon, treatment is complete

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Thanks I'll be waiting for the links for the rubbermaids.

Yeah that's what I thought about the schedule which is why I wanted to start right away (I leave next Monday, so if that's day 8, it means I have to start the treatment today).. I will be back on day 15..

So, I guess I should go add the first dose right now (since I did a water change and vacuumed a couple of hours ago)...?

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Rubbermaid

The only problem I see with this fluke treatment is you've already done it for so long before. I would do it once a week let it deactivate and let the flukes run free. So a four week treatment = once a week.

Fish will also sometimes yawn to clear their gills, not necessarily becasue of flukes. I'm wary about doign another fluke treatment especially after such a long one you did.

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Fish will also sometimes yawn to clear their gills, not necessarily becasue of flukes. I'm wary about doign another fluke treatment especially after such a long one you did.

I understand that but yawning is not the only symptom he has. As I wrote in my previous post, he is also clamping his fins, scratching/twitching, and much less active than usual. If I do what you suggested, then I will add prazi once today, then next sunday for the second time, etc, until I have added four times, right? What do I do with water changes in that case?

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