Cycling Woes

[flutterbudget]

So I think I have the magic un-cycle-able water. This is day 40 and still no nitrites. Sigh. I've been using Stability for about ten days. So far no change. New fish finished QT and went in a couple days ago. Two fish now, still no nitrites.

Also I am starting to see some green/brown (I can't tell for sure?) spots on some of the rocks. Could this be algae? I didn't think algae would show up in an uncycled tank? Or is it maybe something else that I should be worried about?

[Captain Findus Goldfish]

What testers are you using? I know about uncyclable water! I did a fishless cycle for almost 3 months!!! Talk about patience!

What is your pH?

[flutterbudget]

I'm using API drops. Ph is 8.2 and temp is about 70*F.

[Captain Findus Goldfish]

you can take up the temp slowly - that should help. I cycled my fishless tank with 30C. But you can take it up to about 25 with the fish (77F)

I think high pH makes the cycling slower. I have 8.4 and it literally took ages!

[CatfishSoup]

i hope what you assume is algae .. is algae. if its brown or green then itsmost likely algae. maybe the rocks had it before? i dunno if you transfered them or sometrhing but who knows. i hope the cycling goes well! my friend had an issue with cycling all his fish pretty much died and he had to redo his cycle all over again after months. thank god i have had luck with mine

[number20121]

Algae doesn't grow in uncycled tanks?

[flutterbudget]

I don't have a heater in there right now, but I guess I could think about adding one. My temp has been very stable, just low.

The spots on the rocks look like algae to me. They look brownish green, but are tiny so it's hard to say for sure. I have smooth river stones for substrate, bought new for this tank, and some larger decorative rocks. They were all sterilized before going in the tank, scrubbed and boiled and soaked. I didn't think algae would show up in an uncycled tank, but I could be totally wrong. I don't even know where I got that from. Maybe something about not having the right nutrients? But I have nitrates in my tap water, so maybe that makes a difference?

I also have at least traces of ammonia in my tap water, sometimes almost .25, so it's impossible for me to keep the ammonia down as far as I'd like with water changes. I'm thinking about using zeolite in my aging tub since I have to age my water for ph reasons anyway. Maybe?

[koko]

i have an ammonia of .25 in my tap water, i just make sure I use prime or amquel to bond it.

What is your nitrates?

[flutterbudget]

Nitrate is 5 ppm.

[koko]

and your nitrites are the 0 hun?

if so for the most part your cycled

[flutterbudget]

Nitrites are 0. But the 5 nitrates comes from the tap water already. And the ammonia isn't dropping. so I don't think I'm cycled. I wish, though.

[koko]

How many gals in the tank?

But see the ammonia will never really go 0 if its in your tap water. i have it in mine and my ammonia is always at .25, so I just use Amquel to keep it safe from them...

How high is the ammonia?

[flutterbudget]

It's a 30 gallon tank. Two small fish. The ammonia usually tests around .25. I never let it get up to .5, but there have been a couple times where it was over .25.

Really? Why don't the bacteria process the ammonia all the way to zero once they are established? That is weird to me. So you never get a zero reading at all? And isn't Prime only active in the water for 2 days or so? So if you change water once a week, do you add Prime to the tank every couple of days to make sure that ammonia stays bound? Or do you do more frequent water changes always?

[koko]

The reason it cant go to 0 all the way hun.....

1. you do a water change but the ammonia is in the water already and being replaced.

2. The goldfish produce the ammonia and the cycle is trying to keep up.

3. When we add prime or amquel it binds, but is still there, just not harmful to them.

i try to do 2 40-50% water changes every week on my tank and just make sure the ammonia stays at .25 and is bond. if not 2 times i will do one 50% water change

[flutterbudget]

Hmmm. Well, do you think I should still see a nitrite spike, or is it possible that I would have missed that? My nitrates are going down, I think, since I added some plants a few days ago.

[koko]

I have cycled tanks from old tanks and sometimes the nitrites never showed up at all cause of the BB's in the filter media....

[flutterbudget]

This tank wasn't seeded with anything. Brand new filters and media, started from scratch. I really expected I'd see nitrites. I've been testing pretty frequently, too. So I just don't know. Thanks for the info, koko, I'm glad to be aware about your ammonia levels.

[koko]

You know you could add "cycle" to the tank, this will add extra BB's to the tank and to make sure its cycled...

[flutterbudget]

Another thing I had wondered. I know generally the bb's don't live in the water itself, but... We are on a well (not chlorinated), and within sight of a river. So, I wonder if it's possible that bb's come in with the well water?

[flutterbudget]

You know you could add "cycle" to the tank, this will add extra BB's to the tank and to make sure its cycled...

Sorry, you posted while I was typing!

I've been using Stability by Seachem. It's the same type of thing.

[koko]

You would get minerals from the well water but not bb's hun...

Oh so that will explain some of the reason you have seen the nitrites, that stuff helps to cycle the tank, if you been using it all the time, it is quite possible the tank cycled. I used stuff like that when I had a ph crash and lost the cycle, in about 4 days my cycle was back to normal

[flutterbudget]

I've been using it for about two weeks now.

[koko]

I would if the ammonia stays below 1.0, not clean the filters and when you do a water change dont do a gravel siphon. Lets see if the nitrates go up and more brown algae grows. If this is the case it means your tank skipped the nitrites and its cycled, just you have just like me the ammonia problem.

[flutterbudget]

With my ph at 8.2 I didn't think it was safe to let the ammonia rise very far. So I may have just been changing the water and not really seeing that it was stablilizing somewhere. I haven't seen the nitrates rise at all past the 5 that is in the tap water, but since I recently added plants that could be a factor there. I'm doing a large water change tonight. I won't do anything to the filter or substrate and then I'll just keep an eye on things some more. I do think the algae is brown, and it's definitely spreading in the last couple of days.

[flutterbudget]

A little more than 48 hours after the last water change and my parameters are testing .25 ammonia, 0 nitrite, >5 nitrate. I think the plants are sucking up nitrates because it's 5 in the tap water. Otherwise, it's pretty much the same readings I've been getting for weeks now. Impatiently waiting to see if that ammonia level keeps going up.

The brown algae is spreading, and I think I see some green now too.