Obligatory Intro Post O:

[Cappeh]

Hello! I've wandered over here after mostly hiding out on betta forums.. I have a spare 10g tank and am considering getting a goldfish for it. I haven't bought one yet, but thought I'd sign up here and gather more information before bringing one home.

Sooo, hi!

[Lupin]

Welcome to KGW!

I would not try a 10g for a goldfish alone. It's not that big enough to house one on a permanent basis. Bear in mind, a lot of fancies grow on an average of 6-8 inches in size. Stunting them though will not do them any favor at all since it only deforms them and even shorten their lifespan. Is it possible for you to get at least 30g? You can then freely house one or two fancy goldfish in there. I would NOT get comets, shubunkins or hibunas (common goldfish). All three grow much bigger than the fancies at 12-18 inches in length.

[Cynders]

Welcome to Kokos!

I think you would be better off starting with a 29 gallon tank. You would be able to fit 2 fancy goldfish in there with lots of room and will allow plenty of growth room. That spare 10 gallon will be a perfect quarantine tank. Generally you will probably want to start with the biggest tank possible Goldfish keeping is addictive!

[number20121]

Hello! Good that you came here and get more information

But yeah, goldfish need more room. I started with a 10 gallon tank but upgraded asap after I found this forum, and am using the 10 gallon tank as quarantine/hospital tank

[dogsbykat]

Welcome A 10 gallon is perfect for a betta or a school of small tropicals. I agree with a 29 gal for a pair of goldies; they are social, so it's nice to have a friend

[Cappeh]

Thanks for the input, guys!

I can see what I can do about a 29gal.. I already have one, but at the moment it's housing eight land hermit crabs. I was leaning towards fancies anyway, I like the look of them more.

And yeah, fishkeeping in general is addictive.. I started out with one betta in a 5gal, and now I have four of them in their own tanks. e.e My room looks more like an aquarium than a bedroom, haha.

[Lupin]

Any pics of the land hermit crabs? I wonder how these ones look.You already have a good start with the hobby!

If you have any more questions, please continue asking. There are lots of things to know about fancies since they happen to have their own challenges much more than most people would think.

[number20121]

My room looks more like an aquarium than a bedroom, haha.

Absolutely nothing wrong with that I got three tanks running in my living room myself. Don't even need to turn the ceiling lights on anymore, the tank lights are illuminating this room perfectly

[Cappeh]

I don't have any photos of the hermits on this computer, but if you guys want to see them I'll upload some here tomorrow. (: I was given the 29gal after my friend's father passed away.. at the time I already had five of them, and so I moved them in with the three I got from them. They're really fun, but they've already slowed down for the winter, haha.

Okay, so aside from tank size, I haven't been able to find solid information on general goldfish keeping. Sites "dedicated" to goldfish (like the ones for bettas) just don't contain reliable information.. I'm so glad I stumbled across this forum. I know they're not tropical fish, they need filters.. do they require air stones as well, too? Do you guys cycle your tanks before you add the fish, or do a fish-in cycle? What sorts of plants do you use? I have a combo of real/silk for my bettas, will that work for goldfish as well? Are there any good brands of goldfish out there that aren't full of fillers, wheat meal, etc?

So many questions, haha.

[Hidr]

[Captain Findus Goldfish]

hi and welcome! you have come to the right place

Regarding filtration we like the 10x per hr filtration rule. Very good (and cheap) for goldies are the Hang On Back Filters (HOB). For a 30gal make sure the filter is giving you a 300gal per hr turnover.

I personally like to do a fishless cycle. You stress the fish less and are more likely to start of on the right foot.

Also, even if you just get one goldie - it is good to 'quarantine' him for a month when you get him. The QT regimen is usually one month at 0.3%salt and 4 Prazi (PraziPro) treatments (for gill flukes). This will help you exterminate most parasites so you can avoid most problems in the future

as for the deco, I personally like a bare bottom floor (just because it is way more sanitary since goldies are poop machines, and it prevents gas build up that happens with gravel). I have live plants attached to rocks - anubias and java ferns (the 2 best plants for goldies as they do not think of them as a salad bar!)

as for the food I love SakiHikari. And it is always good to supplement their diet with veggies such as peas, spinach and broccoli oh and frozen foods if you want too.

hope this helps!

[Lupin]

I don't have any photos of the hermits on this computer, but if you guys want to see them I'll upload some here tomorrow. (: I was given the 29gal after my friend's father passed away.. at the time I already had five of them, and so I moved them in with the three I got from them. They're really fun, but they've already slowed down for the winter, haha.

Okay, so aside from tank size, I haven't been able to find solid information on general goldfish keeping. Sites "dedicated" to goldfish (like the ones for bettas) just don't contain reliable information.. I'm so glad I stumbled across this forum. I know they're not tropical fish, they need filters.. do they require air stones as well, too? Do you guys cycle your tanks before you add the fish, or do a fish-in cycle? What sorts of plants do you use? I have a combo of real/silk for my bettas, will that work for goldfish as well? Are there any good brands of goldfish out there that aren't full of fillers, wheat meal, etc?

So many questions, haha.

I find nothing wrong with asking too many questions all at once.

I'll answer your questions one by one.

1. Do they require airstones?

If your filter is producing vigorous surface agitation, it is not so much of a necessity otherwise it should be. Goldfish take in a lot of oxygen and much more than tropicals do. Therefore, they do require a lot of oxygen. You just have to make sure the surface agitation is adequate for gas exchange.

2. Do you guys cycle your tanks before you add the fish, or do a fish-in cycle?

Fishless cycle is better than using the fish to cycle the tank. The presence of ammonia and nitrite can intoxicate and even kill your fish even in minute traces. If you don't have a test kit yet, I'd suggest getting API liquid test kit as it is one of the most reliable brands to have.

3. What sort of plants do you use?

You'll learn that goldfish are omnivorous so they will eat even plants. You need to make sure the plants either reproduce enough to avoid being completely obliterated or they're tough enough to avoid damage. Low lighting plants are nice to have. The likes of anubias, Java ferns and cryptocoryne are pretty much compatible with them. These plants are very tough. Duckweeds and Egeria densa can be used if you can get them to produce quickly before any of your goldfish eat them completely. These ones require moderate lighting and nutrients although they are still easy to grow. You just need to make sure they produce quickly or the goldfish will finish everything.

4. Are there any good brands of goldfish out there that aren't full of fillers, wheat meal, etc?

Hikari Lionhead and Saki Hikari are good choices. You just need to make sure they're NOT floating or consisting mostly of starch, both of which can cause your fancy goldfish to float since fancy goldfish are so prone to floaty issues. Omega brand is also worth a try. Actually, your goldfish will do better with gel foods, vegetables and fresh foods. More info on foods can be found in Goldfish Foods section under General Goldfish Discussion forum here.

Hope this helps.

[Cappeh]

Thank you! This helps.

So in addition to flukes and floaties, are there any other health issues that come with fancies? My favorite betta is a tailbiter and it currently fighting off finrot because of it.. does that exist in goldfish as well?

[Lupin]

Tailbiting is not a common issue with goldfish. They may nip each other's fins but I rarely see them biting their own tails.

1. Flukes

2. Floaty issues

3. Ich

4. Anchorworms

5. Fish lice

6. Dropsy

All these are common issues with goldfish. All except no. 2 and 6 are parasites. The parasites are the number one trigger of secondary infections such as dropsy which can be bacterial, viral or internal damage in nature. As long as you quarantine properly every new fish you get for a time period of 3-4 weeks, no shortcuts, then you should be able to avoid a majority of these issues. Federica already mentioned the quarantine period and procedures of quarantining to you earlier.

[Captain Findus Goldfish]

ugh I have a tail biter betta too.

I think also you can avoid many goldie issue if you remember to keep their tank clean (including the filter, gravel (if you choose to have it) and ornaments (don't put any hollow ones)).

[koko]

There is a few articles here about how to cycle with goldfish or with out them

http://www.kokosgoldfish.com/cycle.html

Also another thing with goldfish, is I highly recommend no hollow ornaments or logs in there tank, they have a problem with stagnant water and my cause dropy's or popeye

[Cappeh]

Thank you so, so much, everyone.

I'm actually in the process of rehoming some or all of my hermits.. if I get down to three I can keep them in that 10gal, and just revamp their former tank for fish use. For now I'll be lurking on the forums and reading up on everything before I bring any fish home. Thank you again!

[rai-nbow]

Welcome to Koko's!!!!!~~ It looks like everyone else has already set you up with some awesome info, so I'll just leave with a nice big WELCOME!! ^.^

[Cappeh]

Okay, one more question post, I lied. xD

I found homes for all of my hermits with experienced crabbers, so I'll be able to convert the 29gal into a goldfish tank. If I use the 10gal I have as a QT (I'm getting tiny ones, I know they'll grow eventually), do I need to cycle that or can I do 100% changes daily while they're in there? Can I bring them home to QT while the larger tank starts its cycle? I'm going to get two 150 gph filters for the 29gal.. can I use one of those in the 10gal when it's a QT tank?

Managed to find PraziPro on sale at the store today, grabbed some so I have it. (: Need more AQ salt, but I can pick that up later this week.

Sorry if any of these sound dumb, but I'd rather ask and find out the proper way to do it before I have fish to worry about as well. I have both a mmm and a smaller pet store on the way back from college (commuter, yay!).. stopped at the smaller one and was excited to see they have black moors! The tanks were clean, no dead fish, no ich.. talked to the fish guy and asked where they got their fish from, when they got deliveries, etc. I'll be getting my pair from there, that's for sure.. the guy in charge of the fish actually knows what he's doing.

Anyways, sorry for the long post, thanks in advance for any info you guys can offer up. <3

[Captain Findus Goldfish]

you can QT them in an uncycled tank. I like to QT fish separately tho.

Also, I prefer to do like 2x daily water changes of 50-80% in an uncycled tank. the only issue of this way is that every time you have to re-dose the salt and the prazi.

[Cappeh]

Awesome, thank you.

I don't mind redosing and changing the water, it keeps me busy and once I get it down it doesn't take that long. (:

I do actually have a second 10gal that I can put the other in (if you mean QT each fish seperately), it just doesn't have a lid, and I'd have to give it a good scrub. If that's better, though, by all means I can do it.