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Dropsy And Distress


amoonklein

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Okay skimmed through..

So you did the epsom and metromeds before. How long did Mr. Wendell have the metromeds?

I think I would like to see you try the Jungle AntiParasite Food in your case for him now if he is still eating well. You can find that at most pet stores including pet s mart.

Maybe its me but it seems we are seeing more and more cases of dropsy that are internal parasite related and in your case it could very very well be one of them. The stringy poo while could be a bacterial thing, could also indicate digestive problems and could be arrising due to internal/intestinal parasites.

I also suggest this because your case is so similar to mine. Dropsy that went down with Metromeds but then returned after the metromeds stopped. But then it wasn't until the fish were fed with Jungle AP food that contains the Prazi and levamisole as well did the issues seem to resolve fully. The piping and esp the yawning makes me think all those fish could use more Prazi. Do you have prazi alone in the meantime? Because if so I would def treat the main tank with that again.

If Mr. Wendell is eating well then I would like to see you start the AP food on him and see how he does. I think that if he responds to it, we might consider feeding it to the fish in the main tank as well. But I think it would be wise to start him on it alone in the QT tank first. I would also dose the tank he is in with prazi in the water as well..

Hang in there.. Keep up with the water changes and keep hope!!! You're doing really well and do NOT beat yourself up over not seeing the signs sooner because you DID see the signs. You took note of his behavior changes and then were able to catch the dropsy relapse as SOON as you saw it. You are on top of this! :-)

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Thanks amynmitchell for your support and thank you Sue for the super fast response.

I'll stop by store on the way home from work and pick up some of the Jungle AP food for him.

Yes to prazi. I have Aqua Prazi from GFC that I can use... I was reading somewhere on the forum that others have used Liquid PraziPro instead. I can take a peek while I'm at the store to see if they have any of that available cause it would so much easier to administer than trying to get the Aqua Prazi to dissolve... it's practically impossible. If I can't find it, I'm happy to use the Aqua Prazi.

Also, is it OK for me to add Martini (finally decided on a name) into the main tank to free up the QT tank or should I try to find another solution for her?

Thanks again. I'm going to stay positive and do everything I can to get everybody healthy again.

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Allie I'm so sorry to hear about Mr Wendell. :( I think you got great advice from Sue, she had great success with fish who had recurring dropsy, so she knows what she's talking about. :)

I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you and Mr Wendell. I want to see more pics of him healthy. :heart

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lol Yeah I know how hard it is to get that prazi to dissolve. I use the liquid now too. I got way to impatient to sit there shaking bottles over and over and over, just to not have it dissolve all the way ANYWAY lol

Also, is it OK for me to add Martini (finally decided on a name) into the main tank to free up the QT tank or should I try to find another solution for her?

First, I have a Martini too!!! :) Great name! hehe

Second, like Amy said if he has gone through the QT process (Two weeks of salt @ 0.3% and prazi on and off for about a month) then yeah you can go ahead and add him. If not then you should def find another plan. Maybe set up a rubbermaid or something. Either way Mr. Wendell needs his own hospital tank again so you can give him the medicated food and epsom.

Thanks again. I'm going to stay positive and do everything I can to get everybody healthy again.

I know how hard it can be to stay positive when it seems like everytime things settle down, there is a problem again.. I've been there SOOO many times. But try if you can to think good thoughts and not give up! I really hope Mr. Wendell (and all the other fish) pull thru this for you.

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Hi ladies.

First, I have a Martini too!!! smile.gif Great name! hehe

Yay Sue!! The more Martini's the better biggrin.gif

I was able to pick up the Jungle AP food and some Liquid Prazi Pro (yay) after work and was feeling pretty good when I got home. Then, I ran into a minor roadblock... at least I'm hoping it's minor.

While getting Martini's QT emptied and cleaned, I opened the filter and saw what looked like itty bitty dried/dead worms on top of the filter floss... eww. sad.gif I definitely couldn't put her in the main tank so I ended up cleaning and setting up a 10 gallon QT in the bedroom. I have a heater in there right now, and an extra Whisper 40i filter. It was super late and I didn't have a chance to pull old media from the main tank so it's totally not cycled. I also have to run to the store on lunch to pick up some more airline tubing so I can get some bubbles going.

This might sound gross, but I saved some of the wormy looking things to try and get a picture of them later... I have no clue what they are. What should I be doing for Martini to help her out?

As for Mr. Wendell, he looked a little worse last night but is still happy and perky. He's set up in QT with epsom and I fed him some of the medicated food last night. He has some issues seeing food sometimes and is so used to bottom feeding that it's going to be kinda difficult for him to find and eat the food since it floats but we'll make it work. Also, should I follow the instructions on the bottle and "Feed exclusively for 3 consecutive days a week for 4 weeks. Do not use other foods during these 3 day periods." or should I feed it to him every day for the 4 weeks?

When I get home tonight I'll add the prazi to get him started on that too.

Figures that something else would get thrown into the mix... when things happen, they sure do HAPPEN.

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I am betting the dried worms are planeria from overfeeding. Are they white? Those are harmless.

I always follow the directions on the bottle for AP food, but because you are dealing with dropsy issues, it might be daily. Let's see what Sue says.

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I did a google image search on planaria and they kinda look like that. The ones in the filter were kinda beigy... but not quite brown and super tiny, like maybe .25 mm.

I sure do hope that's what they are... then I don't have to stress out about it. Should I still try to get some pics and post them for confirmation? I say try because I don't think the macro setting on my camera is THAT good at getting things so teeny.

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I have no personal experience with planaria but I do know they can be diff colored not just white and it sounds VERY much like what you are seeing. Planaria thrive in environments where the organic load is high. Which means you may have been feeding a bit much, or just not cleaning out the filter/media as well as you could be. I do think that's what you are seeing here and I suggest a GOOD filter cleaning. (again in old tank water, not tap) Maybe begin changing out some of the filter media a little at a time if it's gunky and gross..

Do see if you can get a photo though! I don't think it's gross that you kept some! I've done that before! I took pictures of anchor worm, and I've taken pictures of the insides of fish after they have passed because I wanted to know what something was. It might sound gross, but really you are just trying to be thorough!!!

When you get a chance get some media from the main tank in their to help it cycled and just watch those water parameters closely. Really, you cannot underestimate the importance of a good clean tank especially when it comes to dropsy.

As for the Jungle Food - I've used it before to treat dropsy and what I did was feed the Jungle exclusively for 2 weeks (as you would with metromeds) and then after that was done I feed it 3 days a week for 2 more weeks. It worked well for me. That was purely a judgment call on my part, but I thought it made the most sense.. I've used it since for parasites/internal worms and followed the instructions exactly but I think when using it for dropsy its better to give it every day for 2 weeks.

Glad you found the liquid prazi :-) That makes life simpler doesn't it?

As for feeding Mr. Wendell. I've found that if you put the food in the tank and let it sit for a minute or so, then gently rub the pellets between two of your fingers for a second they will float to the bottom. Works perfect for my fish Hurley who is sunk to the bottom. How is his appetite today once he finds the food?

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I have no personal experience with planaria but I do know they can be diff colored not just white and it sounds VERY much like what you are seeing. Planaria thrive in environments where the organic load is high. Which means you may have been feeding a bit much, or just not cleaning out the filter/media as well as you could be. I do think that's what you are seeing here and I suggest a GOOD filter cleaning. (again in old tank water, not tap) Maybe begin changing out some of the filter media a little at a time if it's gunky and gross..

Yes, the QT filter was due for a cleaning... I was originally kind of hesitant at doing a gunk removal cause I was cycling the QT tank and I wanted to keep as much bacteria as I could. It has been 2+ weeks since I've taken it out and cleaned it in old tank water. This will be a good lesson not to do that in the future. That's what I get for being lazy!

If it is confirmed that they are planaria, would it be OK to officially move Martini to the main tank? She will officially complete her QT process on the 20th. Maybe I should hold off a few more days just to be on the safe side.

When you get a chance get some media from the main tank in their to help it cycled and just watch those water parameters closely. Really, you cannot underestimate the importance of a good clean tank especially when it comes to dropsy.

I will do this when I get home tonight for both QT tanks.

As for feeding Mr. Wendell. I've found that if you put the food in the tank and let it sit for a minute or so, then gently rub the pellets between two of your fingers for a second they will float to the bottom. Works perfect for my fish Hurley who is sunk to the bottom. How is his appetite today once he finds the food?

That's a great idea. His appetite is still super strong and I can tell he just wants to find that food and hoover it into his mouth... your trick will come in super handy.

I'll post later tonight with an update on how he's doing and hopefully with some wormy pics.

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Okie dokie.... I removed some filter media from the main tank (ceramic rings and the white filter floss stuff) and added it to Martini's tank and Mr. Wendell's tank. Mr. Wendell ate all his food tonight. He hooveredf them up before I even got a chance to let the food soak for a few so I could try to squish them to the bottom. I consider that a very good sign smile.gif

I'm going to go do some water tests to make sure params are OK, but in the meantime I wanted to post pics of those wormies:

Here's a few next to a dime so can get an idea of how small they are

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IMG_5877.jpg

IMG_5871.jpg

IMG_5872.jpg

This was as close as I could get

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I was thinking the same thing Amy. :) Those don't look like worms at all, they look more like some sort of larvae. Maybe someone else will know exactly what it is.

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I've never seen them but then again I've never HAD experience with them so I really wouldn't know!!!! All I know is GROSS!

Can anyone else confirm if it is in fact planaria???

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Yes, it definitely grossed me out... especially having to put them on a piece of paper and take pics. A planaria photoshoot is sure to make you feel all itchy and in need of a shower ill.gif I'm glad that the consensus seems to be planaria. No reoccurence so far, fingers crossed.

Mr. Wendell seems to be doing better. He is less bloated and his scales are almost flat again krazy.gif

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Hi ladies.

Mr. Wendell's scales are completely flat! Hooray! banana.gif

There is a new development, however. Boo. He has this red line under his left cheek:

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What is this?

He is on day 5 of the Jungle AP, day 5 of epsom salt, and day 3 of Liquid PraziPro. His current water params are: Ammonia 0, Nitrites 0, Nitrates 5.

Since his scales are flat, I'm thinking it'll be OK to remove the epsom salt... he's due for a big water change anyway cause after 3 days on the PraziPro, he gets 4 days off.

So... what do you guys think? Do a 100% water change to remove everything and perhaps start adding aquarium salt (.1% a day until I get to .3%) to see if I can help heal whatever is going on with his cheek?

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Hiya... a quick update:

I've done a 100% water change and have yet to add any salt.

He's floaty right now. He has been surface gasping off an on for the past few hours... and seems to be having difficulty keeping his balance. Right now he's resting upside down at the surface. Is there anything I can do to help him out or is this just the result of taking in too much air?

Thanks.

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No... not that I can recall. Do you think I took it out prematurely? The only reason I took it out was because he wasn't bloated and his scales are totally flat. I can add it back in asap if you think that will help him out.

Do you think his floatyness could be related to the redness under his cheek? I'm not sure what that is.

Thanks, Edith. Your help is appreciated, as always :)

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Usually we remove the epsom salt as soon as the scales are flat but if it stopped him from floating maybe you can add it back in and then remove it slowly in a day or two so that he adjusts to the change.

Th Ap food sometimes make them float so maybe the epsom was helping him that way.

About the red thing on his cheek I would wait and see what Sue says about that. Usually I would say go for the aquarium salt but with a fish who has a tendency to dropsy I don't think that would be a good idea. But Sue will know. :)

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