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caitie

Bandit Might Be Dying

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[*]Test Results for the Following:

[*]Ammonia Level? 0

[*]Nitrite Level? 0

[*]Nitrate level? under 5

[*]Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 8.0

[*]Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 8.0

[*]Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? nutra fin drops

[*]Water temperature? 76

[*]Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 5 gal running 2 yrs (small but only for qt)

[*]What is the name and size of the filter(s)? Aquclear 20

*]How often do you change the water and how much? 60-70% daily

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size? 1 fantail under 2inches

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners? aquaplus

[*]What do you feed your fish and how often? Usually homemade gel food; peas; occasionally fruit gel. Fast once a week. Right now Jungle antibacterial food

[*]Any new fish added to the tank? No

[*]Any medications added to the tank? Salt 0.2% - First dose of Prazipro on dec 7th

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Finrot and red streaks in all fins. His gills under his chin look red and inflamed.

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? Was floating until the 7th now bottom sitting, barely responsive, can't eat anymore spits eveything out.

I've already posted in diagnosis and received help from Trinket and Lupin but now he seems so much worse. Since he isn't eating he isn't getting any antibiotics and I don't know what to do to help him. He can barely swim anymore but I wonder if that is because his tail is almost all gone? Is there something to help with the finrot? Should I raise the salt or use melafix or pimafix? And if you think he is too far gone please be honest I don't want him to suffer for nothing. I love him too much for that. :cry1 I've posted three pictures to show the quick decline. The first two were taken last night and the third this morning.

DSCF3739.jpg

DSCF3788.jpg

DSCF3778.jpg

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That's really worse than I thought.doh11.gif I am so sorry Bandit had to go through this whole ordeal.:( My gut feeling is telling me even if we add 0.1% of salt, it may not help much with his current condition but we've got to try though. Is the prazi still there? It's so unfortunate he would not eat anymore so it seems Jungle Antibacterial food is out of the loop.

I'm a bit on the dead end here with most options already useless.:( Trinket, any further thoughts on this?

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I'm so sorry you have to see him like this sad.gif I had a fish who's tail just fell apart in hours, it was awful sad.gif I've not read your other thread (will investigate now) and I'm not a mod/helper or anything but considering he's not eating he looks very swollen, is it possible he is a she and egg bound? or worms? Just trying to maybe get some ideas out there, sorry if they've already been covered. He just strikes me as very plump considering. I really hope you can get this sorted, hang in there. 00001649.gif

Edit: you mentioned weight loss? Just something for Trinket and Lupin - I had a 2 inch fantail about 8 months ago who went very quiet then lost a lot of weight and his tail fell apart, Trinket's opinion then was possibly internal worms, I'll try and find the thread. Unfortunately I found out too late and I lost him.

Edit 2: found it! http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/77158-fast-decline-lost-a-lot-of-weight-and-tail-shredded-within-hours/page__p__861689__fromsearch__1entry861689

Sorry if this is no use :( Just trying to bounce some ideas around :(

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my gut feeling is telling me even if we add 0.1% of salt, it may not help much with his current condition but we've got to try though. Is the prazi still there?/quote]

Yeah sadly that's also what my instinct is telling me. I'll add the extra salt this morning just in case, and tomorrow I do the wc and add the second dose of prazi. I've never seen something go this quickly. Last thursday he was fine swimming around with the others. Now I'm worried it might be something catchy. The blackmoor who was with him in the main tank is doing fine so far but the other fantail, Hercules, had white stringy poop last night and this morning he had some reddish scrapes on his side. I don't know if he injured himeself or if he is coming down with the same thing Bandit has. The main tank has salt at 0.2% since November 19th because the moor had some white stuff around his eye. Today I'll do a huge wc and start treating with prazi. I hope that will stop any nasties in that tank.

considering he's not eating he looks very swollen, is it possible he is a she and egg bound? or worms? /quote]

Thanks for helping Devilduck. I think it is still too young to be egg bound but worms could be a possibility. He has only stopped eating since yesterday morning and he is only passing teeny little white stool, very very thin so maybe he hasn't digested everything he ate the day before? Before this started at the weekend he only suffered from floating issues. This came out of nowhere.

I tried feeding him earlier by crushing the pellets into a powder then I mixed it with some tank water and I used a pipette to spray it near his mouth. He did catch some particles and he chewed for a while. I doubt he can get much this way but it is better than nothing I guess.

Thank you both for caring.

Edited by caitie

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First dose of prazi was December 7 and water changes done daily at 60-70%...I wonder if the prazi failed to work well as the water changes must have rendered it useless.unsure.gif Did you redose the prazi after each water change?

Very thin white stool could only indicate possible bacterial infection. I know this seems frustrating but are you willing to continue doing what you did with the pellets turning it into powder? If you could, you might manage to feed him the Jungle Antibacterial food. There seems hope here that I can see if he is chewing a bit.

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Did you redose the prazi after each water change? /quote]

I put back in what I removed with the wc.

I know this seems frustrating but are you willing to continue doing what you did with the pellets turning it into powder? /quote]

I will definately keep doing that. I just have to do it often since he isn't getting much. Good thing I'm off work for a while! :)

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Ahh...Seems we're on the right track so far, hun. Please keep us updated and let us know how it goes with the food.heartpump.gif

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Just a quick update on Bandit. I raised the salt to 0.3% and I added the second dose of prazi today. I've been feeding him the crushed antibiotics every two hours. Last night seemed a turning point for him, he is swimming a bit more although since he has hardly no tail left he can't control his swimming much, but he isn't crashing into the gravel anymore and he can just about make it to the top of the tank. The red streaks a re not as bad anymore. I assume he is eating the crushed pellets since he is pooping massive amounts although his poop is still white. I am keeping my hopes up but I wonder if his tail will be able to regrow since he also seems to have lost the rays? :(

Thank you Lupin, devilduck and amynmitchell for your encouragements because I was pretty much convinced he had to be put out of his misery. :heart I know he isn't saved yet but he seems to be giving it a good fight. :)

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Don't lose hope on the fins possibly regrowing, hun! But what matters is as long as he can swim well and actively able to recover himself, it'll be all good.bighug.gif

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I am keeping my fingers crossed for you two.

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Caitie how is he?

Im sorry I couldnt get online. I am wondering if you should try kanamycin but it is an antibiotic that impacts the bbs and can kill the cycle. He doesnt have floaty issues does he? Are you feeding Jungle antibac? These are compatible with kanamycin. (e.g Kanaplex:by Seachem)

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He is still very weak but I see a slight improvement, more reactive, swimming a little bit. I have to crush the jungle antibac food very fine for him to be able to absorb it. And I feed it very often so hopefully he is getting enough of it. The redness in his fins is reducing slightly and his gills are not as swollen. Do you recommend I try to find some kanamycin tomorrow or should I wait a few more days with the salt and prazi? Also I wonder if the Kanamycin will be effective with my high PH (8.0) I remember that quite a few antibiotics are not effective with that PH?

I always appreciate your help Trinket. :heart

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DSCF3825.jpg

This is the part that is still red under what remains of his poor little tail. But the redness on his gills under the chin and elswhere on his body seems to be gone. By the way he isn't headstanding in the picture, that's where I sprayed his food. :D His appetite seems better.

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Jungle antibac seems to be working a little. Perhaps it was primarily bacterial after all. However prazi must be done on all fish so never mind. Contrary to tetracycline Kanamycin is extra effective at high pH and in low salt too as it happens. Combined with the Jungle meds it is quite good for peduncle disease which this is looking like it could be...

I think I would stagger tho. Salt down to 0.1% and finish the prazi course. Get some Kanaplex in and if he makes little improvement I think you should try it.

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Oh Caitie,he does look so much better :heart I'll keep my fingers crossed and both of you in my prayers here :heart

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I always think it's a good sign they're willing to shove their faces in rocks to chase food :) I really hope his tail grows back for you

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Thanks For the encouragement guys. :heart

I always think it's a good sign they're willing to shove their faces in rocks to chase food

I do to, he was always such a little piggy, stuffing his mouth so full that he couldn't chew and then he would see more food and rush to it and drop all the food he already had. :rofl:rofl

I really hope his tail grows back

I hope so because it breaks my heart to see that tiny little nub of a tail. Honestly I can't recognize him, he is the fish in my avatar! He was so pretty. But he is fighting to live. :)

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I'm so glad Bandit is on the mend :) He looked so sad in the photos, it gives me some hope that my Rico may pull through too. Fingers crossed Bandit makes a full recovery :heart

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I wanted to give you guys an update on Bandit. :) He is swimming around alot although it is usually head down tail :oops: up. He eats his crushed food well so I am confident he is getting his meds in. :D One thing I'm not sure about under his little nub of a tail it is very red. I am including a picture taken a few minutes ago. I would really like it if someone could confirm if it looks worse than in the picture taken yesterday. And if it is worse should I wait and see or start adding Kanaplex to the water?

Yesterday

DSCF3825.jpg

Today

DSCF3861.jpg

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It looks redder in the second one to me...but for all I know that might be a sign it's healing so I'm not much help there :D Stick with him :)

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Hi Caitie, It actually looks better to me today :exactly The 'focus' of the camera is not as sharp in today's pic,but just color-wise,it looks to me like it has faded slightly :):heart I sure,hope so :heart Just the fact that he's swimming around more is very hopeful to me :heart Sorry,I don't know about the med you asked about,but I'm sure someone will soon. I know,it can seem like an eternity when you are waiting for a reply :help1 Hang in there,sweetie :k055:

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