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Red Cap Oranda Vs. Fin Rot


Desiree

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Hello everyone! I've been away for quite some time, but I all ready see some familiar names around here. Anyway, here's my current situation and some back story: My two Orandas were purchased together and I have had them since February 2009. When purchased my Red Cap Oranda was tattered and thin-- yet I purchased her anyway. Within a few short weeks my Calico Oranda began chasing her around relentlessly attempting to breed. Eggs were layed, yet thankfully none fertilized. Needless to say, she suffered from even more tears in her fins and a few lost scales.

She recovered well but has always looked a bit banged up compared to my Calico Oranda. She has put on some weight and does not look as thin as she had previously. Throughout the year I have treated her with Medi-Gold and Metro-Meds, separately, for two weeks at a time, with decent time in between treatments. I have also tried a couple rounds of Pima-fix and Melafix together as well as applied BioBandage to her fins directly.

Today, I noticed when looking at the two small fins directly under her tail-- one of the fins is long, flowing, yet ragged. The other is nearly completely missing. Also, I've noticed the red in her wen is going away. It seems to be fading to white in sections. I know this is common, but the formation of it seems odd. It's not disappearing in a consistent way. It's like her wen is becoming polka dot. Thoughts?

[*]Test Results for the Following:

[*]Ammonia Level? 0

[*]Nitrite Level? 0

[*]Nitrate level? 5

[*]Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 7.4

[*]Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? Haven't tested

[*]Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API Master Test Kit

[*]Water temperature? Heated to 72F

[*]Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 30 gallons, 1 1/2 years

[*]What is the name and size of the filter(s)? Penguin Biowheel 350

[*]How often do you change the water and how much? 80-90% weekly

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size? 2 medium sized, 4 1/2 inch Orandas (not including tail)

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners? Prime, Buff it Up, Aquarium Salt

[*]What do you feed your fish and how often? I alternate between Pro-Gold, Salad Supreme, and Hikari Lionhead once daily. They are occasionally fed broccoli, spinach, and oranges as well.

[*]Any new fish added to the tank? No

[*]Any medications added to the tank? None currently. Previously treated with Pimafix, Melafix and Biobandage

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Consistently frayed fins, recently losing sections of color in red cap.

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? No

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Edited by Desiree
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Seems like things may have changed around here. A few years ago I would have had 10 responses within a day. Now, it's been a few days with not a single response. I understand my issue isn't severely pressing; I'm just a bit surprised.

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It is weekend...sorry! :heart

How much salt and for how long? Your parameters look good though! :)

FYI salt shouldn't be used for long period of times, just for medicating.

Frayed fins...should clear up with .2% salt for a few weeks. Should see healing very quickly actually! If you could please let me know about how much and how long it would be very helpful.

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Thanks so much for the reply! Too be honest I've always struggled with trying to calculate salting to any percentage. Math was never my strong point. For the last month I have been adding 1 1/2 teaspoons of API Aquarium Salt at each weekly water change. I also have Epsom Salt on hand, but have never used it. I would imagine this is a very low dose of salt. To be honest I'm kind of nervous about salting. I'll have to check out some previous posts before I do it. I know it's a great solution for a variety of problems-- but it makes me nervous, especially since I have snails. My Oranda's fins look especially frayed today-- I think it's getting worse. Looks like I'll be working on this later tonight!

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Hmm...Ok that much salt isn't going to do much. 1 teaspoon per gallon = .1%

I can understand why you would be nervous...we all have to start somewhere. :)

However, salt has helped me out of a bind on more than one occasion....and it is safe for fish and cycle! It heals fish pretty quick. If you would like I can PM a mod to see if they could ease your nervousness!

I remember when I first came to Kokos! I had added medicine to uncycled tank and managed to kill all my brothers fish! Then figured hey they are gone I will get some more...not good idea! But that is how I found Kokos! Me and my fish are very thankful. Salt is easy and I could walk you through it! The fin rot will clear up and most likely the red splotches!

Let me know...what you want to do. I just want your fishies to get better!! :heart

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Thanks so much! I'll do a water change tonight and begin salting the tank. My only concern is my two snails. Any suggestions? I don't have a quarantine tank at the moment to put them in.

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I can't believe I've been keeping goldfish (as an adult) for nearly ten years and I have never used salt as a treatment. Ha! Guess I haven't dealt with much fin rot. Sadly, it's always been dropsy that have gotten the best of my fish. Well, I've got one more question... Should I bring the dosage up to .2% immediately? Or should I initially bring it up to .1% tonight, then raise it to .2% tomorrow evening? Also, you mentioned red splotches-- my fish doesn't have red splotches. However, it is losing it's red in it's when in what appears to be spots. :)

Thanks for all your help!!!

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Okay, just finished up! I did a 90% water change, added 30 teaspoons of aquarium salt to equal 0.1%. They seem to be responding well. I will increase the salt to 0.2% tomorrow morning then up to 0.3% tomorrow evening. I also treated the tank with Melafix and Pimafix and began feeding Medigold in case of bacterial infection. Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated! On a side note, I think the affected fish, a Red Cap Oranda, is turning into a Lemonhead...

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Typically you would want to stay away from any medications until after trying other methods first. However, since you started you need to feed nothing but medigold for 14 days. All fish have different immunities! Our first thought is usually to throw the medicine cabinet at them and hope for the best.

Get the salt up to .3%. Should keep salt going for 2 weeks...then re-evaluate! You will have to do a water change in between so make sure you keep a chart. How much salt comes out will have to go back in. :)

Please post back with updates!

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Yep, got it! Yeah, I usually wouldn't treat with salt, meds and medicated food-- but it seems to be getting worse rapidly. I appreciate all your help! And, thanks for the reaffirmation! I'll definitely keep you posted! :)

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Dosing up to 0.3% tonight. So far so good! I haven't noticed any fins healing, but it's still early in the process. Might I mention that my goldfish are wolfing down Medigold like it's some kind of treat! They love that stuff! Hahaha!

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Hey I was just perusing your thread here and wanted to offer some words of support since you seem to be doing everything excellently, so here they are: Way to go! Woot! Huzzah! etc.

Also wanted to see if you found a place for your snails - they will not be happy (or living) campers with all that salt in there! I've killed so many snails that way accidentally in my pre-Koko's days... poor things.

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Thanks so very much! Actually we came up with a temporary solution for the snails. They are currently living in large mason jars with algae covered rocks. I've been making sure to change the water in the jars daily. I know it's not ideal, but I don't have a quarantine tank right now and I didn't want to run the risk of killing them with the salt treatment. Thanks again for your encouragement!

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Tonight marks the half way point of treatment. I'm doing a 90% water change, bringing the salt level back up to 0.3% and continuing with the Melafix and Pimafix. I will also continue feeding Medigold for the next week. So far, so good. Her fins seem to be getting better. They're not as ragged as they were. Should I expect them to clear up completely within the next week? If not, should I continue to treat for fin rot until they do? This problem has been pretty chronic and I'm afraid if I don't treat until she is 100% it will only regress and become ragged again in a matter of weeks. Might I also note, my other Oranda has been periodically chasing her around again. Seems to look like attempted breeding behavior-- or maybe just some flirting. ;) I've been keeping a close eye on this and thankfully nothing has come to pass.

Any thoughts, suggestions, etc are greatly appreciated!

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Here are some pictures I took tonight to show the progress of recovery. As I've mentioned, things are improving but are by no means better. I hope the pictures aren't too big.

Shredded tail

finrot1.jpg

I think she's decided to go blond...

finrot2.jpg

Notice one of the anal fins is almost completely missing.

finrot5.jpg

And because she was so patient with all the picture taking...

finrot4.jpg

Thanks!

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Hey folks! So, Tuesday will mark two weeks of the salt/ Melafix/ Pimafix/ Medigold treatment. So far, my Oranda's fins don't look any better than in the pictures above. I'm curious if I should continue with the treatment for an additional week? Please, please, please let me know what you think! Thanks so very much! :)

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I do 90% weekly water changes, just did an extra one last night-- so my water is in top shape! :) My latest water parameters are consistent with previous readings, with a slight bump in nitrates-- Ammonia: 0, Nitrite: 0, Nitrate: 10, PH: 7.4. I'm really getting concerned her fins aren't getting much better, I feel like I've tried everything.

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I've definitely seen him swimming really close to her tail and I've definitely seen some head butting. But, I haven't seen any fin nipping. I guess I could try to find a tank divider. Hmmm, not a bad idea! Thanks so much!

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