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Amquel Plus Is Poison


Guest kbusschau

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Guest kbusschau

I have posted this elsewhere but also wanted to alert Koko's Moderators of danger of Amquel Plus. I found out the hard way (nearly lost my Oranda). I went through so many treatments and corrections to save her. When she started to turn black more and more everyday I took her to local Exotic Fish Store and they went over everything I did and everything I put into tank. As soon as I mentioned the Amquel Plus product, they said to throw it out immediately and do 75% water changes everyday until the black stopped spreading. I took about 2 weeks for her to get back to normal color and all the other things cleared up as well (swim problems, constant infections like Ich and red fin infections). She's not had an infection since and is (I swear) so happy to see me when I come to the tank. I wonder if she KNOWS I saved her. She would just sit at bottom and look at me and not move. Now she does loopty-loops and side swims and wiggles when I am in front on tank. I'm SO glad I was told about danger of using Amquel Plus.....can't remember what exactly I was told was so toxic about it but I remember store expert told me that some of the ingredients are on toxic list EPA cites as toxic. Thanks also to this site who helped me out when I was having other problems with Wanda (stuck pea was really a scare). My best to all of you who volunteer your expertise and concerns for us who just don't know enough to immediately help the water pets we have come to love. Anyway, could you warn people when you see in their parameters that they are using the Amquel Plus product? I only use the Amquel now. Sincerely, Kristin (and Wanda too)....

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  • Regular Member

I've used AmQuel+ for over a year and never had any problem at all. It sounds like your fish was suffering from ammonia burns due to an uncycled tank... IMHO, it was the 75% water changes that saved your fish, and not the removal of the AmQuel+.

I would like to hear more experienced users weigh in on this. :)

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It certainly does sound like ammonia burns, but you never know. Without specifics though (what chemicals would cause damage, any published information) it is difficult to prove claims like that about such a widely used and popular product.

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http://www.novalek.com/kordon/amquel+/index_more_info.htm

Here is an interesting artic about Amquel+. If you wish, you can also see the chemistry makeup of Amquel. From the chemical standpoint, everything that is shown to be in the original formula should do and seems to do everything advertised. There are no parts in the formula that should cause any adverse reactions.

You do need to realize exactly what Amquel and Amquel+ are actually doing and how to use them, however. If used for the proper reason and in the proper fashion, they do exactly as advertised and cause NO harm to the fish. I have used this product (as well as "Prime" and a number of other things to work for me in many capasities.) They do exactly as advertised and work splendidly.

There are a few problems in expectations that can lead to real problems. The first is that you cannot properly test the "binding" action of the product with commonly sold ammonia/nitrite test kits. Commercially - professionally and with proper chemistry knowledge, it is possible to test for the break point in nitrite "binding" - but ammonia level break points can be tested with the type of test kit called a Nessler Test - typically a "dot" of chemically infused paper that is used to detect "free" ammonia. Most common test kits are "Salicylate" type tests - drop tests that give you a color to "read" the level of ammonia in the water. It will read correctly for total ammonia - but not free ammonia. Amquel+ and Amquel do not REMOVE the ammonia - they simply bind it in a chemical fashion that does not bother the fish. It is still there - and available for the beneficial bacteria that make up the nitrogen cycle to utilize.

Amquel+ binds VERY little nitrite and even less nitrate. It can only be used for a small amount for these toxins - and should not be relied upon to do a huge detoxification. It will do a very nice job on ammonia - but still needs water changes and attention to prevent the fish from harm.

It is not a good idea to spread news of a "poison" that is commerically available unless you have the chemical background to prove your accusations. In this case, I truly feel, as do others, that something else is going on in your tanks. We need to see if we can help you sort out what is going on - and how to address it. It may simply be a matter of expecting more from a product that is possible for it to achieve

Amquel+ and Amquel have worked for me for YEARS with no bad sideeffects to the fish. I have used it with fry and adult fish. I have used it in transport. I have used it at shows (or its equivilant)- as do all the water experts at shows. With the proper testing, we can hold the show tanks at perfect parameters for a given time.

The product works and works well, within a given set of parameters and usage.

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Ah..... I found the article I was looking for. I have finally slept and life seems better again.

http://www.kokosgoldfish.com/Amquel.html

Amquel+ has released chemical makeup formula since I wrote this article. It does, basically, as it purports.... but will bind only a small amount of nitrite in a tank in the recommended dosage.

If I had to take a guess, your fish were adversely impacted by high nitrite values and potentially a dropping pH caused by the Amquel+.

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Guest kbusschau

I'm sorry but I had all my parameters checked throughout the month long ordeal by myself and the Exotic Fish Store and they were perfect. I had been doing water changes throughout in between Maracel and Ich treatments. I also had the owner of Exotic Fish store tell me to throw out the Amquel Plus because of his experience and other customers who brought fish in. If this is entirely inaccurate according to what you believe, I;m sorry -- the end result though was I had perfect water quality - no ammonia, only a tad bit high in nitrates at one reading -- I was taking this measurements every other day. The black was brought on by "stress" not ammonia burns (store visually looked at fish and said it was not burn) so it's hard for me to believe that now. A week later she the black was all gone. The 75% water changes was to remove the Amquel+. So I'm at a loss about this new information. Again, if it's slander, I apologize. I, however, will never use the product again. Thanks for your input and advise.

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Guest kbusschau

I just checked out suggested website about Amquel. Here's what it said about the Plus product:

Post Script: I have been seeking formulae for AmQuel Plus, and the older product AmQuel Dry. The former is a newly introduced product designed to "Remove Nitrite, Nitrate, Ammonia, Chlorine & Chloramines" as well as "fishes" toxic pheromones". It is purported not to affect the pH of a tank. Because it is "patent pending", the formula is not being released, however I suspect that it works much the same as AmQuel works, with an added buffer. If this is true, then it, too, is a fine product. Other than the tendency to obscure biological cycle effectiveness, a product that can reduce nitrites and nitrates might be very useful! I will report when I have additional information.

Again, I'm not upset with Amquel. I love that product, just the Plus product. Next time I'm at Fish store I will ask the owner what exact chemicals he thought should not be on the market and try to check with EPA what their position is. Again, I am positive it was not water quality, I checked and store did too. He looked at Wanda and said it was not burns, it was "stress" alone. She's been fine since -- no more infections or any problems. It was like a miracle the way she recovered after discontinuing one product. Again, I'm sorry if this disparages a product, but I remain convinced this was a problem for my Oranda. He said he stopped using it and several other customers who had problems brought it to his attention more. He has discontinued selling it.

If this helps one person from what I went through, I'll be glad I said something instead of staying quiet. I'll report back if I have any further "proof" of principle from more chemical analysis from store and EPA. Thanks again for all your help and input. I truly appreciate it.

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Guest kbusschau

Might need to clarify that my complaint and problems may have resulted from using AMQUEL PLUS alone for water changes, instead of regular Amquel (which I've gone back to using) Possibly that created a very high concentration of certain chemicals or factors over time. I had been using this Plus product instead of regular Amquel for about 4 months. Up until that time, Wanda had never had any problems. When I discontinued her black blotches disappeared. I tood her into Fish Store and he said it was from stress not ammonia burns. The ONLY reading that was off abit was Nitrates but he said they would not create that kind of stress, and it was only for one parameter reading that corrected nearly overnight. So again, it's difficult to think it was ammonia related. Maybe I should not have used the Plus all the time and ONLY occasionally when certain parameters were high and needed to be corrected quickly. I will report back after I see Fish Store owner again and ask him what chemicals he specifically told me were of concern in their formula and check with EPA as he suggested about why they re of concern. I don't believe the product's website is going to say anything about "risky" ingredients, but the Fish Store owner was adamant about not using it, especially all the time like I did. Again, sorry for any confusion, but until further investigation, I feel convinced something went wrong from using this product when it was the only known cause etc. Thanks much....

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Blackness on a fish is normally due to ammonia burns on the fish, so if your tank was cycling the ammonia levels were to high. The only thing Amquel does is bond them not take the ammonia out of the water. i will have to agree with others that it was your water changes that helped your fish and not the removal of the amquel.

Sorry :( I dont agree with you.

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Guest kbusschau

Koko--thanks for your input, but I had already been doing 50% water changes for most of the month or so that things were bad for her and still things went worse for her. I always add CYCLE to new water as well as minimum recommended addition of salt. But the new water I was adding had Amquel Plus (and Novaqua) added to it. Flushing out this nearly new water 75% for 3 days is when she made big recovery. Ammonia was at 0 every other day in which I was testing, so it's difficult to blame that on what happened. But I conceed that you all have far more expertise than I do, so remain confused....but so grateful Wanda is still alive and getting bigger.

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Well part of me thinks that adding Nova Aqua and Amquel Plus at the same time isnt a good thing, and also I dont like Nova Aqua due to the fact it adds extra slim coating to the fish, this can make them breath harder....likes like adding slim to them, to much can be bad :(

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I too have used Prime, Amquel and Amquel Plus and never had any problems with any of the products. I too would have to agree with either ammonia burns, what was your water changing regimen during this cycling process? Could also have been due to melanaphore migration which sometimes displays as irritantant to salt.

Edited by newbiefishgirl
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