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Problem With Bruce's Eye


Guest stephc

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Test Results for the Following: Sorry no test results now as I don't have time before bed, usually water is fine though. 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 10ish nitrate, PH 7.5

Water temperature? 18C

Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 18-20 gallons, 16 months approx.

What is the name and size of the filter(s)? Fluval Plus 3 - 185 Gal/h

How often do you change the water and how much? Weekly 50%, but hasn't been changed for 11 days at the moment as I was away on holiday, next chance I will get is tomorrow afternoon (can get test results then too)

How many fish in the tank and their size? 1 Oranda, 3-4 inches head to tail

What kind of water additives or conditioners? Nothing, just King british safe guard into the tap water when I do water changes

What do you feed your fish and how often? Flakes, most nights, sometimes will leave a day or 2 between feeds. However while I was on holiday he has one of those holiday blocks in. he's had them before with no problems.

Any new fish added to the tank? No

Any medications added to the tank? No

Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? He has a kind of blister around his eye. Like a fluid filled sack I suppose is the best way to describe it. Only 1 eye (right) and only really around the top half. It's only around his eye, isn't actually pushing his eye out or anything.

Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? He sometimes sits on the bottom of the tank for a while, but is lively most of the time and is eating fine.

As I said, the next time I can change is water is tomorrow afternoon, I will also be able to get test results then and I can try and get pictures if it will help. I can't do anything at the moment though.

Any ideas what's wrong and what I can do to help?

Edited by stephc
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Well without everything you are going to post tomorrow......pics and levels. Yikes, not much.

But does it look like a blister or perhaps wen growth? That is all I got! Just thought I would post and let you know I am rooting for you and your Oranda....I kinda like those fishies!

:idont post back when you get your levels!

Only other thing I got is to do a big water change :hummm

Edited by newbiefishgirl
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Ok, got test results:

Ammonia: 0

Nitrite: 0

Nitrate: 5-10 (nearer 10 though)

Ph level: 7.5

This is the best I could do for pics (sorry if they are a bit big):

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/maj...ilms/Fish/2.jpg

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/maj...ilms/Fish/3.jpg

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/maj...ilms/Fish/4.jpg

I think the redness in that first one is just shadows/a bit of orange behind the blister, I don't even notice it when just looking at him.

It doesn't look like any sort of wen growth I've ever seen before. It seems to be slightly worse than last night too. Still no other symptoms of anything else though, swimming fine, no gulping/yawning, not at the surface for any length of time, not flashing or scratching. Hmm, his poop is a little stringy and also floating (has air bubbles in it)...I just noticed that.

About to do a 50-75% water change.

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Hi Steph! Is he any better today?

Just from those pictures, I'd guess it's popeye -- off the top of my head it's the only thing I know of that would make parts of his eye swell up with fluid....

If that's the case, you might want to start treating the tank with salt while you wait for a More Knowledgeable Poster to come and second my diagnosis.

There is a link here about how to correctly salt your tank. Remember to stir the salt really well in a separate container so it dissolves completely *before* adding it to your water; and if you do a water change, you'll need to re-add salt to make up for what you've taken out. If it does turn out to be popeye, you'll want to increase the temperature of your water up to about 80 degrees. You might also want to consider buying MetroMeds online -- I'm pretty sure those help.

I'm sorry I can't be more definite about whether or not it's popeye for sure! Hopefully someone else will be along shortly to help you out further.

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Bruce is about the same today, no worse but no better either.

I will salt the tank tomorrow and see if that helps.

Not sure how easily I could get Metromeds as I'm in the UK.....think I've looked into it before and it just wasn't really possible. I do have Baktopur direct but I think that's a bit too much for this...I used it when his tank mate got dropsy a few months ago. But if this turns out to be something more serious it's there to use straight away.

I'll try salting and see how that goes.

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I know that Jungle makes antibacterial food too -- is that available in the UK? I know Maracyn Two can be used as well if you decide to actually medicate and don't want to go with the Baktopur, but that med is light sensitive, so you'll have to be sure to keep your tank either covered or in a darkened room.

Until then, though, definitely warm the water up to around 80 degrees farenheit (I'm sorry, I have *no* clue what that is in Celsius), use 1/4 teaspoon of epsom salt per gallon, and hopefully that'll bring the swelling down!

Also hopefully, a mod will get over here and give you some potentially-better-than-my advice! :D

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I don't think any kind of medicated food is available in the UK....I even had to get the Bak D from Germany.

Have to wait until tomorrow to heat the tank as all local pet stores (well, the 2 of them that are nearish) are closed so can't get a heater. I used to have one but it broke so took it back and as it was the summer I just got a refund, kinda wish I hadn't now. Although the tank is a little warmer today but still only 68F.

I have epsom salt so that's not a problem.

The swelling has definatly gone down a lot today though. I don't know if that's a good or bad thing though considering I haven't actually done anything yet. I seem to remember Ash's popeye going down just before he got dropsy. I know that might not be the case here but past experiences always stick in the mind.

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I agree with you that it definitely does not look like wen growth!!!

It looks really red to me in that first picture. Is it?

If it is red, then from my experiences..."red means infection."

I think we need a mod in here!

I am sorry this is happeing to you and your fish. Hang in there.

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It looks red in the picture but not really when I look at it. Especially not now it's gone down a bit.

I've been tied up all day with family things so salting his tank is going to have to wait another hour or 2. No other changes since this morning though.

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It's great that the swelling has gone down by itself! Hopefully it means that he's getting better, rather than your thought that maybe he's about to get dropsy... :unsure:

I think I would still suggest that you salt him and heat him, just to be on the safe side -- in a WORST case scenario, if he's about to come down with something horrible, at least you're prepared for it and are probably going to be keeping a way closer eye on him that you'd normally be doing. That way, you can medicate him as soon as he starts showing other symptoms.

Remember to keep the water as insanely clean as possible -- that, more than anything, is going to be a huge help in keeping him from getting sicker.

Keep us updated! :D

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Whew still no mods? Trinket must be feeling TERRIBLE otherwise I know that girl would be here :)

Hmm I agree, looks like fluid built up causing pop eye, and I agree with the choice of epsom salts and raising the temperature. Not regular salts, and definitly do not use both salts at the same time.

I believe their are some places that are willing to ship the metromeds.. I found it a few days ago, I can't remember the site.. BUT the problem Pixiefish said was that it's expensive to ship and often people don't want to spend the amount knowing that the package may not pass through customs anyway..

As always, the fact that it is going down appears to be a good sign, so hopefully things will continue to improve.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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Here is a good thread about the treatement/causes of popeye: http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/...opeye&st=20

I find it best when a mod or helper isn't around to go dig up some great advice already given!

I'm not familiar with popeye, so I can't help more than that!

Good luck!

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Thought I'd use this thread instead of making a new one. Bruce now has drospy :-(

The popeye went away, and up until this morning he was fine. Water has been fine and he's been acting fine, but this morning he was pineconing slightly. It's not a huge amount but it's definatly there.

I put some bacteria control stuff in earlier as I was too busy to do a water change, I'm doing a 100% water change at the moment. What's the best treatment for him?

I have aquarium salt, I think some epsom salt although I'm not sure, some King British Bacteria Control, and some Bak D. I'd prefer not to use the Bak D for now as (as far as I can remember) it would mean I'd need to cycle the tank again and I simply do not have the time at the moment so could end up not helping him at all.

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Thought I'd use this thread instead of making a new one. Bruce now has drospy :-(

The popeye went away, and up until this morning he was fine. Water has been fine and he's been acting fine, but this morning he was pineconing slightly. It's not a huge amount but it's definatly there.

I put some bacteria control stuff in earlier as I was too busy to do a water change, I'm doing a 100% water change at the moment. What's the best treatment for him?

I have aquarium salt, I think some epsom salt although I'm not sure, some King British Bacteria Control, and some Bak D. I'd prefer not to use the Bak D for now as (as far as I can remember) it would mean I'd need to cycle the tank again and I simply do not have the time at the moment so could end up not helping him at all.

first off, if you haven't added anything except for decholorinator wait! Let me see if I can find a mod!

2nd...can you please post parameters of water ASAP so that when a mod pops in they can help you better? You know, answer all the questions above like starting fresh!

I am keeping fins crossed! Please post back!

Two cents...no aquarium salt with epsom it is a very bad, bad combo. One or the other. If you have dropsy, you will want to get any aquarium salt out!

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Just done water change so nothing in there apart from the tap safe stuff.

Answers are the same as before except the temp is nearer 20C now. Water tests are:

Ammonia: 0

Nitrite: 0

Nitrate: 5-10

Ph level: 7.5

Last time water was changed was 1 week ago, about 50%.

No new fish. Same food as usual.

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A topical application is prob all you need here Steph. Do you have iodine? I am sure you can get it at a chemist.

If not hydrogen peroxide. The kind used for humans. Just lift him slightly out of the water and swab it on with an ear bud soaked. Then let it dry for the count of 5 and let him back in the water.

Transient pope eye is just a sign of bacterial build up in the water or media that needs rinsing often.

Im glad he looks fairly good and is eating well, I remember your fish :heart

EDIT: double post. If he is now pineconing you do need a medication. Baktopur is as good as any you can get there. Are you sure he is coning? The last pics looked not too bad..also NO salt, just the epsom.

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Those pics were from a while ago, no pineconing then but there is some now, although it isn't a massive amount. The popeye seems to have gone completely. This happened with my other oranda Ash, he got popeye, it cleared up, then a few days later he was pineconey......suppose it's why I'm extra worried as Ash didn't make it that time.

Is it ok to use Bak D and epsom at the same time? If not, which is the better treatment?

He seems a lot happier since I changed the water. He had been bottom sitting for a lot of the day but hasn't really stopped swimming about since I finished the change.

I don't think I'm going to be able to do anything more tonight though, 3am isn't the best time to be sorting out treatment.

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If hes swimming well now you have changed the water...wait. Wait a few days. A recent pic would help, meanwhile just use the epsom not the Baktopur.

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Best I could do for recent pics for now:

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/maj...sh/DSC02757.jpg

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/maj...sh/DSC02769.jpg

Can't really tell how much he's pineconing on it though. It's still not much, mainly the white scales near his head, less so the orange scales.

He's still swimming around and hasn't been bottom sitting at all (at least not while I've been up) and the pineconing certainly looks less than before (although it's hard to tell as he won't stay still now)

So for now I'll use epsom salt, 1/4 teaspoon per gallon. If that works, how long should I wait before another water change, and how much water will I need to change then?

Edited by stephc
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So for now I'll use epsom salt, 1/4 teaspoon per gallon. If that works, how long should I wait before another water change, and how much water will I need to change then?

Stephc, I'm pretty sure epsom salts dosage is 1/4 teaspoon per 10 gallons not per gallon.

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:unsure: I just got that from an earlier reply in this thread....I assumed if it was wrong someone would have corrected it :krazy:

1/2 teaspoon for my 20gal tank doesn't seem much :unsure:

I've already put it in....what can I do?

Edited by stephc
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:unsure: I just got that from an earlier reply in this thread....I assumed if it was wrong someone would have corrected it :krazy:

1/2 teaspoon for my 20gal tank doesn't seem much :unsure:

I've already put it in....what can I do?

I don't usually read this forum but took the notion to look in and saw it. Probably got missed due to so many being tied up with X-mas stuff. Probably going to need to do a big water change (oh joy). I'm not sure which mods might be on right now but pm'd koko for you. hopefully she see's this. Hang in there. Will keep trying to find someone for you on this.

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