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Amonia Levels Killed One Already!


Guest theerer3

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Guest theerer3

Amonia has not been below 1.0 for the last 2 days...I am so confused right now.

My black moore died this morning.

Amonia is 1.0.

Ph is about 7.4 (was under 7 two days ago but I used Ph Up and it now seems to be fine.

All fish in there now (3 fancies, 2 koi) are swimming around fine like nothing is wrong.

I've put in double doses of Jungle Amonia Clear, and I've made the following water changes:

2 days ago - 40% water change - Amonia was at 1.0, still read 1.0 after change and jungle treatment

1 day ago - 25% water change - Amonia was at 1.0, still read 1.0 after change and jungle treatment

today - 75% water change - Black moore found dead before changing, amonia was up to 2.0, down to 1.0 after water change.

I also set up a hospital tank in case others start to act funny, put in 10 gallons from sink with declorinator, etc. and 1 cup of rocks from the main tank - I just tested this and it's at 1.0 amonia!!!

This makes no sense. I have been running 2 months with no amonia problems whatsoever. I think when I cleaned out my filter thoroughly I killed the beneficial bacteria and I'm re-cycling (what an idiot).

It makes NO sense the hospital tank has any amonia - could the test be wrong? But the one fish died and was very lathargic for several days....

Also have a 72 gallon main tank, has been working great for a solid month now, just battling algae, but that's not a bad thing.

Thank you, I didn't get many responses under the water quality post, and this is getting serious!!!

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  • Regular Member

Hey!

This is not my best area by any means, but I also see that this is quite an emergency..

My knowledge on this is limited, so you will want to take what I am about to say more as a thought or guess than fact, and wait for someone else. But I think it may have to do with the Ph change you mentioned the other day.. In a lot of cases with a PH crash, the ammonia starts to rise.. Why it happened, that's beyond me.

The PH Up and Ph down can be tricky.. They are not very stable. However, you were right in needing to get that PH back up.

This is what I would do while you are waiting for a mod/other member. Test the PH of your tap water, and post back.. If it's above 7 I would say to move the fish temporarily, and do a 100% water change, to get ALL of the ammonia out. I also would feed very lightly if at all for a few days so we don't add any more ammonia.

If the PH is lower than 7, then I would suggest you order Buff It Up from Goldfish Connection.. Stabilizing the PH seems to be the most important thing in your case.. (And of course figuring out what caused it to drop, but again, thats not my department LOL)

In the meantime you can try to raise the PH with baking soda. It's safer than the PH UP.. It will work as a temporary fix until you can get the Buff It Up.. I would experiment in a bucket with the baking soda, not your tank. Once you have an idea what you need to add I would move the fish into a bucket with his current tank water, then do a 100% water change, and add the baking soda to get the PH higher..

You can also try something like Prime, which will convert the ammonia into non toxic form for 24 hours..

Post back with your tap water PH asap.. Thanks (hope I helped some??)

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How old is your test kit? It is possible that you are getting inaccurate results because it has expired. You ARE using a drop-type test, right? Strips are useless in a situation like this.

Your tap water should not have ammonia in it, but it would be a good idea to test the water straight out of the tap and see what you get.

You can ask a moderator to combine your two threads, but it makes thing confusing to everyone to get multiple threads going on a single problem.

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I just went back and read through your other thread.. You are getting great help from Acupunk, she is REALLY good! : )

I agree don't be afraid of the larger water changes.. They are going to help you in this case, not hurt you.

Also, now that I've read your thread, I see that you've already been trying different ammonia reducers etc.. And they seem to be making things more confusing.. So I'm not sure about the Prime, like I previously said. It does get a bit more confusing with two threads, so hopefully these can be combined..

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Guest theerer3

Thanks, I tested the water right out of the tap:

Ph - 7.5

Amonia Read 1.0 mg/L (i wouldn't think that was possible!, plus I've been using this same water for 4 months and haven't had amonia problems)

Test Kit is API drop test kit and it's no more than 3 months old.

Sorry about the double posts, I was panicking and thought I would get a bit more attention in this "prime realestate" since things have escalated.

Can a moderator please combine my two threads? I have no clue how to do that

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The ammonia in your tap water may be a new thing -- there may be some sort of problem in the water treatment or storage facility. You might try calling your water utility and asking if there is some sort of issue (although they will probably not acknowledge it to you, even if there is one). It is permissible for there to be a small level of nitrate in drinking water, but ammonia is a no-no.

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Guest theerer3

Okay, so I dropped a amonia clear tablet in the little hospital tank and it dropped the amonia to about .25.

So that proves the drop test kit is still working, and the amonia is coming from the tap water.

So, what the heck can I do??? I can't afford to constantly supply my fish tank with pellets.

Should I "cycle" the fish into the smaller, low amonia hospital tank? or put 2 fancies in there?

UGH, just when I had things going for me. Maybe i should try another faucet??

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I have ammonia in my tap water as well.. It's about 0.50.. For me I've been dealing with it by adding Prime to the new tap water, which will detoxify up to 0.75ppm of ammonia for 24 hours. In a well cycled tank, 24 hours gives me plenty of time for the ammonia in the tap to be converted to nitrite, then to nitrate, so by the time the prime "wears off" the ammonia is gone, and there is no problem.

Another option I have thought about, and you might think about too, is keeping a rubbermaid set up just for water change water... If you have an extra filter, you could put it on the rubbermaid, and use AmmoChips (zeolite)... You don't want to use this on the main tank, because it removes the ammonia and then there is no source of ammonia for the benficial bacteria, so your biological filter is never established. But if you use it on the rubbermaid, you can hopefully use it to get ammonia free tap water (use a heater to keep the temp the same as your tank, or keep it in the same room if possible). Then test that water before use and if it's ammonia free, you can safely add it to your main tank.

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Guest theerer3

weird i didn't seem to have this before. I guess clearing out the filter kept the beneficial bacteria from taking care of the levels from my tap water?

Is 1.0 tap water harmful to drink??? Should I wine to our condo people about that?

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Your condo people probably can't do anything about the water supply. Just to be sure, I'd get a Pur filter and put it on your sink faucet. This could also solve the ammonia problem for your fish.

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Guest theerer3

So, the amonia is still chillin' at 1.0. Water changes aren't going to help since my water is incoveniently at 1.0 also. I'm going to the store in the morning to get the better quality AMquel + everyone is talking about and hopefully get this crap until control until the tank does its cycle thing.

If the fish are swimming fine, fins are up, etc. does that mean they are handling it okay? THe one that died spent a good 3-4 days on the bottom before he went.

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What's your tank temp?

With a pH of 7.4, and an ammo level of 2.0, any temp above the high 60s is in the danger zone and any temp above the high 70s, it will be lethal.

With a pH level of 7.4, an ammo level of 1.0 should be fine...except for maybe the most sensitive fishes. However once your pH starts to hit the high 7s, then even a 1.0 level will become lethal.

Edited by Jack of Hearts
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Guest theerer3

Okay, thanks. The Ph is right about 7.4 right now and tank temp is between 76 and 80. I can do a better job of keeping that down if that will help.

Do you think salt would help in this case? Reduce some stress on the guys. Shockingly they really seem to be normal.

Hopefully they can stick it out through the cycling phase. The tank was already cycled before I had this many fish in it, which is why the amonia was probably never really an issue.

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Okay, thanks. The Ph is right about 7.4 right now and tank temp is between 76 and 80. I can do a better job of keeping that down if that will help.

Do you think salt would help in this case? Reduce some stress on the guys. Shockingly they really seem to be normal.

Hopefully they can stick it out through the cycling phase. The tank was already cycled before I had this many fish in it, which is why the amonia was probably never really an issue.

Remember higher the temp and the pH, the more lethal the ammonia. If the pH is 7.4 and the temp is 80, you are starting to come close to the warning zone at 1.0 and you are definitely at the lethal zone at 2.0 so be very careful. The pH affects the ammo toxicity more than the temp. This is one of those times that erring on the slightly lower side of the ideal pH of 7.4 is better.

The salt will help with the nitrites.

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Guest theerer3

Okay, so I semi screwed myself by upping the Ph two days ago....should I try to drop it back down some???

The amonia stuff is working a little and it's now around .75 so I"m getting there. I hope when I get the amquel + tomorrow I can really knock it down fast. Do I have to be concerned about "dosing" the water too much???

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One thing: It can be really difficult trying to bring PH down quickly and safely. The PH down products can burn the fish if not used very very very carefully..I've been told many times to avoid them.

Have you read this thread:

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/...showtopic=70825

It's all about the pros & cons of different ammonia detoxifiers.

I also think you might want to pick up a Seachem Ammonia Alert. It's around $7 and it measures free ammonia (toxic ammonia). It is supposed to last about a year, and myself and a few other members have had good luck with it, when used as a backup to the regular ammonia tests.. Because ammonia detoxifiers can mess with your ammonia test readings, it can be confusing wondering how much ammonia in the water is in a safe non toxic form, and what is harmful. SO far this product has been very reliable for me.. It might really help you until your cycle is back to normal.

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Guest theerer3

My "Prized" Goldfish are two fancies that my wife and I had since we've been married. So, I realize 10 gallons isn't enough, but maybe even putting on of them in the hospital tank which is currently at 0 amonia might be good for them to be sure they are safe. Maybe it's not worth it, but then again, if I see them floating I would not be a happy camper.

I wish I had a good person to sell at least one of the koi to.

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