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Sunshine Got Popeye


jyoti411

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Does this look like popeye..I noticed it this morning...Okkkk..and please bear with me...as I may be on the verge of losing my job..I may be insane and seeing things...

I got fresh Epsom salt...A rubbermaid of 18 gallons...and a 40 gallon Aqua clear filter...to be safe...This is a continuation of this thread

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/...showtopic=71625

I have been treating my goldies for Ich...and now Sunshine has this new development... :krazy: ..Please follow the link below...I have gone absolutely nuts and am unable to attach photos here...

http://picasaweb.google.com/jyoti411/SunshinePopeye

Please Please help...I am taking the readings and will fill in the details in a minute..this is just to get an idea..if this really is popeye...water parameters coming up in 5 minutes...please bear with me...

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hope dis link works for you.it has a quick shot remedy dat wont hurt the fish but read from top to bottom to get wat is happening.and has other links to help you if dis doesnt.

http://www.fishdoc.net/faq/faq_details.php?faqId=3412

Edited by Franky
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[*]Test Results for the Following:

[*]Ammonia Level? 0.25-0.5 (Last night it was 0)

[*]Nitrite Level?0-0.5

[*]Nitrate level?0-20

[*]Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)? 7

[*]Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)?

[*]Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? APi drops for Ammonia and Test strips for the rest

[*]Water temperature?

[*]Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running?20 gals, has been running for around 2 months

[*]What is the name and size of the filter(s)?

[*]How often do you change the water and how much?For the past few days 50% everyday to treat Ich...

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size? 2 fish each of 1-1 1/2 inch in a 20 gallon tank

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners? KoiRX conditioner (from GFC..got it by mistake)...Aquarium Salt 0.3% for Ich

[*]What do you feed your fish and how often?Lionhead pellets, spinach, peas (few veggies and fruits as well), Krill from GFC, frozen dried Topfin Bloodworms

[*]Any new fish added to the tank? Added Lionhead on 245th April...I didnt quarantine him for 2-4 weeks..only observed him for 2 days

[*]Any medications added to the tank? No medications...but Sunshine has started MetroMeds last night

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Ich is gone...this is the 4th day of salt after the last grain fell off..Well the blood streaks from Ich on Sunshine's caudal fin is still there...the caudal fin had its edges gone away..but are healing at the moment...

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.?Yes it is definitely Popeye...Sunshine has been sleeping and resting...Dorsol fin is still erect...I had helped her throw up a tiny particle of plastic last night, that came from the salt container..she wants to eat..and has been eating but needs to be fed out of my hand..rest of the time she is just resting..I think she also looks a bit fatter today...could she be egg bound???..I think she is a female..You can also get a gist of the plastic in my Ich thread..those are the last few posts...Lynda helped me there..Thnks to her it was late night and she was with me thruout...

Sue, Imogen, Kathy and Amy were there thru the Ich..Thanks to all of you..and all the forum members..for all the help and everything that will come up..Thanks so much...

Is a water change necessary right away??Shud I do a 50% water change???

Edited by SunshineGurl
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Hey J!!!!!! I haven't read everything yet but just letting you know that I am here, but I haven't read it all yet..

Thanks so much hun...Just the last few posts from last night...and chk out the pics...those eyes are huge...Thanks for being there...The water params are up too..lemme know.. :(

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Hey I just wrote back on your Ich thread.. did you get my PM last night? I see you started her on the MetroMeds last night.. Do you happen to havea picture of her to compare it to, before the pop eye? And you said you do have a rubbermaid right, so you could move her into there, but leave Chikoo yes??

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what ever you do DO NOT mix epsom salts with regular salt that is used for ich ..the 2 do not mix well ...I just wanted to put that out there if you did not know ...so you started the metromeds last night ?? when you feed the mm's make sure that is the only thing she is eating ..nothing else ...do think she is pine coning ??? hopefully a mod will chime in soon I would go ahead with a waterchange just make it as less stressful as possible

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what ever you do DO NOT mix epsom salts with regular salt that is used for ich ..the 2 do not mix well ...I just wanted to put that out there if you did not know ...so you started the metromeds last night ?? when you feed the mm's make sure that is the only thing she is eating ..nothing else ...do think she is pine coning ??? hopefully a mod will chime in soon I would go ahead with a waterchange just make it as less stressful as possible

Oh yeah I would never do that...I haven't mixed anything..she is still in regular salt...No no pine coning but yeah looks a bit plump...she is able to balance herself...so yeah not lying on any side or anything...but just kinda not active...and yes she is bloated...I ll start with the water change...Do you think and as SUe says..SHould I separate Sunshine in the rubbermaid..In my main tank I also have a smaller sized filter pad..that has been there for ever..I could transfer it to her rubbermaid once I set it up??...Any ideas..I will wait for advice..won't do anything until told to...

Sue, I got your PM last night..No worries...I have this link to compare her from before having popeye..I have movies of her..but not sure if you would be able to make out how she looked before..Never did a close up of her like I have now..But I do see the difference..check it out here...

http://picasaweb.google.com/jyoti411/MyFishies

The first one is her exclusively..

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Alright J. Here's my thoughts..I hope you got my PM last night. If not basically I said that given the situation being sooo similar to Sheldon's and that you had the Metromeds I would try them..I also said that of course the best advice always comes from the mods, and anything I say at this point is just based on the experience I had with Sheldon, or what I would do. Not that it means it's what you should do.

Sunshine and Sheldon have followed the same path up until now.. Almost identical.. (Which is why I suggested getting the Metromeds and having them on hand just in case)... Other than the plastic, they seem to be showing similar signs,and have gone through similar problems. In the end Trinket recommended the espom and Metromeds for Sheldon, but it was too late. Based on that, I do think the MetroMeds is a good idea right now. I am also thinking, that if you got the rubbermaid,and are able to, set it up for Sunshine only,and leave Chikoo where he is.. As Hi-D said, you can't use epsom at the same time as regular salt. IF IT WERE ME (gotta keep stressing that I am NOT even close to knowing everything in this department), I would leave Chikoo in the reg salt, and let him follow through with the remaining days of salt.. Regular feedings.. He does not need Metromeds if he is not showing symptoms.. Recently, my fish Samantha needed MetroMeds and was weak, bottom sitting,and her eyes popped. The metromeds helped her, and I only fed them to her, even though Miranda was in the same tank (used a divider). Miranda was okay. SO I don't think Chikoo needs any changes right now.

As for sunshine I would set up the rubbermaid... Match the temperature, and then add dechlorinator.. Then instread of reg salt, I would try her with the epsom salt... 1/4 teaspoon per ten gallons. You can dissolve it like the other salt, it should dissolve easier.. I would continue with the Metromeds.. If she is in her own container, you don't have to worry about Chikoo getting them. And if a few bits go to the bottom, maybe she will eat them later.

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I would say a definate difference ..I would seperate her so it is already done and if you needed to add other meds one step is already taken care of and no time is wasted ..you have her on the metro meds which is good ..do you have an extra filter??? or just a pad?? she should have filtration

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Alrite Sue and Heidi..I am setting up the rubbermaid..I have a 40 gallon Aqua Clear filter...and I ll add the extra little pad there..the rubbermaid is 18 gallons...I ll separate her..and add epsom too...One more thing to match temperatures can I use hot water out of the tap directly??..I usually use a heater in a separate bucket..since we dont have the leisure of waiting..can I use it directly out of the tap???

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JC, I would go ahead this time and use water out of the tap to get to the right temp. As you said, you don't have the luxury of waiting right now.

Good luck, hon!

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Ok...Maybe I am blind..but what is the dosage for Epsom salt??..I have 15 gallons of water in the rubbermaid... :krazy: ...dont know where and what to see..ok..by the time I fix the new filter..please reply....

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Ok...Maybe I am blind..but what is the dosage for Epsom salt??..I have 15 gallons of water in the rubbermaid... :krazy: ...dont know where and what to see..ok..by the time I fix the new filter..please reply....

1/4 teaspoon per 10 gallon of water. So 15 gallons would be 3/8 teaspoon.

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thank you thank you thank you so much....ok I have the salt in there..the filter is working and everything is set up...

Yeah and definitely she has swollen up from both sides...the scales are not yet pine coned...but they have become a bit bigger.. :cry1 should I go ahead and transfer her right away???

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Hey hun! Sorry I keep popping in and out.. Shane & I have been fighting ALL day..We actually started a HUGE fight during my last post on here.. (Let me tell you it sure didn't help that I was like "hang on, J needs help with her fish, let me finish this post! LOL

Yes if everything is set up, I would transer her right now!!! Chikoo is still doing good right????

I could have sworn I typed in the epsom dosage but things were so crazy that I might have missed it.. Anyway yes, the dosage Jack gave is the one I used for Samantha.. Sam is bigger than Sunshine. I gave Sam about 10 Pellets a day.. Sunshines is really little but we wanna make sure to get enough meds in her, so I would try giving her 2-3 pellets a few times a day.When is the last time she ate?? Is she in the rubbermaid now? How is she? Sorry I was gone right in the middle of all this! UGH.

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The stats of her new tank...

Temperature-79 F (exactly as the main one)

Ammonia-0-0.25 (my tap water has this ammonia reading too)

Nitrites -0

Nitrates-0

pH - between 8-8.5 (The main tank is at 8...I read incorrectly before...checked again)

more heat..or 79 is good..since the main tank she is in has a temp of 79...is that much ok??..or more???

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Hey hun! Sorry I keep popping in and out.. Shane & I have been fighting ALL day..We actually started a HUGE fight during my last post on here.. (Let me tell you it sure didn't help that I was like "hang on, J needs help with her fish, let me finish this post! LOL

Yes if everything is set up, I would transer her right now!!! Chikoo is still doing good right????

I could have sworn I typed in the epsom dosage but things were so crazy that I might have missed it.. Anyway yes, the dosage Jack gave is the one I used for Samantha.. Sam is bigger than Sunshine. I gave Sam about 10 Pellets a day.. Sunshines is really little but we wanna make sure to get enough meds in her, so I would try giving her 2-3 pellets a few times a day.When is the last time she ate?? Is she in the rubbermaid now? How is she? Sorry I was gone right in the middle of all this! UGH.

No No its alrite...sorry u guys are fighting...I am so sorry...Chikoo is fine..I need to change the water in the main tank...the last she ate was a few hours back..hey but the pellets are too hard...I soaked them..cut them into small bite sized pieces..still hard...so I keep them soaking in water..they kind of become too soft...I was always under the impression those were flakes...she has had 3 until now...I am trasferring her now..hope she makes it..she is swollen..although able to balance herself...I saw u had typed the dosage...Its kinda crazy here too..missed out on tht...ok..I am gonna put her in the rubbermaid..I haven't put the filter pad from the main tank...cus it have some ich in it left that cud probably hurt her??...I am so out of luck at the moment I dont even wanna try something new...

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Hey... I think 79 sounds okay.. Usually around 80 is good..

I know the pellets are tricky, especially for small fish... I had the same problem feeding them to Sheldon. Will sunshine go after food? If you drop them in, will she try to get them? If you haven't already (I think we talked about this is a different thread, not yours) you can hold the fishes mouth just above the water line. It should open it's mouth and you can drop a piece of food in.. Try cutting up the pellets with a knife if you have to to make them really really small. I know what you mean, once you soak them, they sorta start wasting away and turn into a little cloud of pieces.. But big they are too big for little fish...

You mentioned the filter pad, because of the Ich. But also, if you remove the filter pad, then Chikoo will be left with no pad correct? Or did you end up putting in two of them?

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Yeah the pellets are tricky...I have them soaking and cut into small pieces...I had read the thread abt holding the fish and putting the pellet in its mouth..oh22 she tries to go after them..but she is heavy now..definite pine coning has started...yeah but she cant get to them..so I have to hold her and direct the pellets into her mouth...but yeah she eats them without any problems...touchwood...she in the rubbermaid...and trying to swim...I think she has bloated so she cant stay at the bottom..but she is able to balance herself..so she keeps swimming a bit...Its sad to see her like this...Needless to say..more water changes...I am so done with this..no more new fish..I just hope these two live a good life with me...

The filter pad is an extra one..that came from my 5 gallon tank in the beginning..It helped cycling this 20 gallon...but I never took it out...so it has extra bb on it...Chikoo will still have the main filter pad...but then again..I dont wanna try it..it wud be much easier to watch Sunshine's water params and then keep changing the water like in a QT...

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Okay gotcha when it comes to the filter pad.. That's your call.. If you move it, it might help establish the bb's, but I know it worries you so just do what you feels right to you.. She is a small fish in a good amount of water.. Daily water changes will keep the water safe, especially since i know how devoted you are to the water changes.

Okay I am glad she is eating.. I hope she is keeping enough of it to work.. You must be so relieved you bought those Metromeds!!!!! You were able to give them to her as SOON as there was a problem so it might not be too late!! She is still trying to swim, which is GOOD. She is still eating which is good. I am hoping sunshine will get a little miracle...

Ya know.. The epsom should help greatly... When I noticed Samantha get the popeye, she was hardly moving. She looked soooo bad.. The perked up a bit with the metromeds. Then the epsom really helped and between the two I saw a major difference... Epsom is the same as the salt replace it with water changes... . I'm thinking you could do 5 gallon water changes. That would be a nice easy number and you always know to add back in 1/8 teaspoon. Either that or 10 gallon if the ammonia/nitrites get too high, because then you can just do 1/4 teaspoon. Whatever works for you..

Glad Chikoo is okay : ) Remember, just because sunshine got it doesn't mean he will..Let's keep our fingers crossed : ) I've been reading and a lot of times one fish will dropsy, but the others are okay. It's not like Ich where once one gets it, the rest automatically do..

I have to find another thread for you.. BRB..

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You've already been reading this thread I know, but in Jeana's thread about Buster, Jack writes:

Temp to 80F.

Pristine water.

Epsom salt. Make sure there's no aquarium salt in there.

Pristine water.

Maracyn 2.

Pristine water.

Exclusive diet of metromeds.

Pristine water.

Jack: should she be on the lookout for the Maracyn Two in case she needs it?? And also, this is the medicine that is light sensitive correct??

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As for sunshine I would set up the rubbermaid... Match the temperature, and then add dechlorinator.. Then instread of reg salt, I would try her with the epsom salt... 1/4 teaspoon per ten gallons. You can dissolve it like the other salt, it should dissolve easier.. I would continue with the Metromeds.. If she is in her own container, you don't have to worry about Chikoo getting them. And if a few bits go to the bottom, maybe she will eat them later.

Well, everyone beat me to it. This is exactly what I would've suggested.

I would say a definate difference ..I would seperate her so it is already done and if you needed to add other meds one step is already taken care of and no time is wasted ..you have her on the metro meds which is good ..do you have an extra filter??? or just a pad?? she should have filtration

Yes, the poor little thing definitely has some bulgy eyes there. See, that happens when fluids build up inside the body. The areas of least resistance swell first. Epsom salt is a diuretic. It will pull fluids from the body. The fluids are a result of an infection. The MetroMeds will work wonders for the infection.

Ok...Maybe I am blind..but what is the dosage for Epsom salt??..I have 15 gallons of water in the rubbermaid... :krazy: ...dont know where and what to see..ok..by the time I fix the new filter..please reply....

1/4 teaspoon per 10 gallon of water. So 15 gallons would be 3/8 teaspoon.

Perfect calculations!

I haven't put the filter pad from the main tank...cus it have some ich in it left that cud probably hurt her??...I am so out of luck at the moment I dont even wanna try something new...

No, if there is even the slightest suspicion of ich, you don't want to use the filter pad. Uncycled water and needing to do large daily changes is a much better option.

That's good advice Sue gave via Jack, but do hold off on the Maracyn 2 until we get it confirmed from a Mod.

Edited by Lynda Von G
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