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Parasite?


SolidAir

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Hello all this my first post been keeping goldfish for about 8 or 9 years now i have delt with ich flukes etc..

Prams are normal for my tank ammonia 0, i live in a softwater area tapwater is 7 so i use oystershells in my filter keeps the water about 7.8

nitrite 0, Only nitrates are ever a problem but i do weekly water changes and that keeps them down

I add 1tsp of salt per gallon and use a standard declorinator during water changes changing around 20% and cleaning one of the filters in tank water.

The tank is 240ltr or 55uk gals, i have an ehiem 2080 and a 2227 for filtration.

The tank is being treated with melafix at the moment because ive bought a new fish which had a touch of fin rot

5 fish in total all fancy one about 6inch two at 3-4 and 2 at 1-2 inches

The problem im having is that my 6inch one Eddie has a growth on his side the growth is the same colour as him, its nearly a cm long now thought it was a tumor but now one of my other fish patrick seems to be developing the same thing, starting by a scale going red underneath then raising and now it seems to be growing

Could a parasite be causing this i cant see any other reason?

I was thinking the tank with a broad range treatment like sterazin?

Any ideas would be great!

Many thanks SolidAir

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Since you have such good experience..I wouldn't doubt it..but pardon me, may I please ask, if you got the new fish with fin rot and added it directly to the main tank with Eddie??..was the new fish quarantined??

That could have been the source of the problem...I maybe wrong...a moderator/member with a lot more experience maybe able to help you with this more...that was just a thought...

and.. :welcome

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HI SolidAir, and welcome to koko's!! :)

I see you've given your general water information, but were these readings JUST taken, or just what they generally are? If these readings are not current, (taken today) could you please retest the water and post your results?? What type of test kit are you currently using? Actually, although you've given most of the infomation, would you mind copy & pasting the following questions and answering them next to the question. I know it might seem silly, but it really helps the moderators/members sort thought the information.. (You should have seen the long paragraph I wrote when I first came here... Everyone kept saying "please please PLEASE copy & paste the box!" LOL

[*]Test Results for the Following:

Ammonia Level?

Nitrite Level?

Nitrate level?

Ph Level, (If possible,KH and GH and chloramines)?

Ph Level (KH/GH) out of the Tap?

Brand of test-kit used? (strips or drops?)

[*]Tank size (How many Gals) and How long has it been running?

[*]What is the name and size of the filter/s?

[*]How often do you change the water and how much?

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size?

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners?

[*]Any medications added to the tank?

[*]Add any new fish to the tank?

[*]What do you feed your fish?

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as

"grains of salt",

bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus?

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating,ect..?

Also, any chance you could provide a picture??? Even a blurry picture might be able to help :)

Thanks so much!

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[*]Test Results for the Following:

Ammonia Level?0

Nitrite Level? 0

Nitrate level? 25

Ph Level, (If possible,KH and GH and chloramines)? 7.8

Ph Level (KH/GH) out of the Tap?7.0

Brand of test-kit used? (strips or drops?)drops interpet

[*]Tank size (How many Gals) and How long has it been running?55uk gal 3 year (moved home)

[*]What is the name and size of the filter/s?eheim 2080+ 2227

[*]How often do you change the water and how much?25% once a week

Hope that is better for you, Eddie is my oldest fish had him for about 9 years now and this lump is big i would hate to loose him.

And now it seems patrick one of my newer fish is getting the same!

Is there a parasite that could cause this?

Or is there some kind of cancergen in the water!!!!

The new fish were added from the qt tank after a week one had some fin rot that had started to heal.

Added a new filter and it started to mature finrot got worse so i put them in the main tank.

Eddie has had this for over a month now and lost colour to begin with but started to regain it again after medi gold but the lump still grows!!

And now patrick seems to have the same any ideas ?

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size?one 6inch two 3inch and two 1-2inch

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners?king brittish safe guard+salt 1 tsp per gal

[*]Any medications added to the tank?melafix and just added another 1 tsp per gal

[*]Add any new fish to the tank? yes

[*]What do you feed your fish?Hikiri ,peas ,dried live food soaked and gel foods

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as

"grains of salt", Lumps, eddie had streaks in tail but went with antibiotic food

bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus?

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating,ect..? only with the new additions

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Thanks so much!! It just makes things easier, everyone is used to this format, and it covers all of the basics.

I'm still fairly new to the site. Unforunately I'm not experienced enough to help you with this one. (Outta my league! And you yourself sound like you have a good amount of knowledge).

Things are a bit hectic right now for some of our moderators, but they usually pop on a few times a day and check out this section.. Most likely if you can hold out for a little while Trinket will be on at some point soon, and she is very experienced when it comes to all types of fish disease.. She is great with diagnosis, and medications, etc.

In the meantime if you could try for a photo that would be really helpful..

Hang in there, it might take some time, but someone will be on to help you out shortly. Thanks again for answering everything : )

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ah...awesome..Experience speaks..I don't know why I didnt notice that the questions have not been answered.. :wa ..i need this...Sue you really are awesome...

SolidAir...dont worry..things will be fine....someone will answer soon... :tou

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Hi SolidAir and welcome. Just a few more Qs. Hang in there while we get the full picture please.

Are you in the US ?

And are the lumps appearing on the lateral line of the fish, the line that passes around the circumference of the fish when horizontal?

Are the 2 affected fish still eating?

Any bottom sitting or abnormal behavior like flashing or gulping at the surface?

One week is not long enough to QT a fish really, did the lumps appear after introducing the new fish or before?

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Im in the U.K, Eddie has had the lump for over a month so nothing to do with the new fish they were put in about four days ago .

I had to put them in the nitrites were through the roof and the finrot was really bad did not want to put them through the stress of a cycle.

The lumps are not on the lateral line no gasping and eat up like normal fins not clamped no out ward signs.

Patrick was easier to see hes red and white the one white scale started to go red underneath i thought he just took a knock but the scale started to rise and now the growth is poking out the side!

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Its most likley a bacterial ulcer or anchor worm. Descriptions are tricky..A picture would be wonderful and we could diagnose much more precisely with one. You can open a free account at www.photobucket.com and drag the IMG tag pic into the post here. Thats what most people find easiest.

The stuff oozing out is it a worm? Does it look like the fishes sores in this pic:

Fishanchorworm.jpg

By the way unless you have a ready cycled empty tank to QT in, QT treatment usually means 100% water changes daily. There should not be nitrites this way.

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Ive never had a fish with anchor worm but i know you can see them hanging from the wound and there is nothing.

Eddies lumps are not red, they were to begin with but are now the same colour

Am raising the salt to 0.3% to see if it helps

Am gonna work on the photos bare with me

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Ah yes, I can see Patrick's, its still red right and theres a point like a pimple head? Is that how Eddie's was and then pus oozed out of the point? If so, its a bacterial thing not parasitic. These kind of boil like lesions or furuncles in freshwater fish (not marine) are usually the work of either the pseudonomas or aeromonas type bacteria that are rampant in tanks that have recently had a lapse in water changing or filter maintenance. Its a sign of bacteria- contaminated water. The stuff oozing out is a mixture of necrotised organisms, live bacteria and visceral fluids. The main thing to note is the stuff coming out is the source of perpetuating the disease since it is still chock full of live dangerous organisms..these will also be in the feces.

So best control for stopping this going farther is taking out bacteria loaded water in very large amounts daily. All your fish are at risk otherwise. Ideally, the two infected fish should be treated separately with daily 100% water changes to rid the water of shedding bacteria. Salt will help at low doses but don't let the fiddly business of adding salt prevent you from these very much more urgent large water changes.

Luckily your fish are behaving fine so you have caught this early. Watch out for blood red poo which indicates more serious internal damage. If you have any more fresh Medigold I would run another course of it to prevent this. The very best medication (after 100% water changes while the boils are erupting) for these kind of lesions is usually a sulfamix antibiotic treatment which I don't believe are available in the UK.

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There is no puss or a pimple i can only relate it to wen growth in texture but it comes from under the scale slowly raises it then grows outward and looks like wen.

I fed them medigold when it first started on eddie it stopped the redness but the growth just kept growing.

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Recap: Please correct all the wrong parts:

1. So you had 2 fish (?) and added 3 new fish. The new fish had finrot. The older fish (9 years) had a lump that went away but has now come back. That was prob. bacterial.

This suggests that the stress of the new company and a whole lot of new bacteria on those fish brought back the infection that he had been fighting..are you sure that the lumps are the same kind? It is quite possible -almost inevitable in fact- that the new fish brought in flukes and the new sores are caused by flukes and bacteria.

2. Salt will not kill flukes. Most other parasites but not flukes. How are the new fish behaving? Any bottom sitting/spitting food out/flashing/scratching?

3. What are the 5 kinds of fish you have there?

4. I am seeing 2 different kinds of spots on your fish, a red bacterial sore type surface spot on your white/red fish and ain internal raised lump on your calico. Are you saying these are the same and that the calicos lump started like the red spot?

Sorry not to get this clear, please take your time to answer all these points carefully so I can help you best.

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Sorry ill go over it again

1.I had three fish to start with and added two 1inch fish, my oldest one devloped a lump a month ago that started the same as patricks i treated it with medigold and the redness calmed down now left with a lump that is still growing.

2.Fish are eating and seem fine no flashing rapid gill movement.

3.All fancy goldfish ryukin, oranda, calico fantail

4.Patrick is the matt white fish so you are seeing behind the scale the way eddies did but it was harder to see eddies due to his colour not on the surface untill it grows out the side of the scale from under it.

Hope this is clearer :unsure:

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The lumps that dont burst are sometimes a trouble to treat because they are beneath the surface of the slime coat so "internal" and harder to access. Medicated food is prob the best treatment. In older fish, these kind of swellings happen a lot in pond fish (exposed to more variation of bacteria and parasites than aquarium raised fish). Are all 3 original fish 9 years old btw?

I can't give you an exact name on this as a disease, but I am fairly sure you can eliminate parasites -given behavior- as cause and consider this systemic bacterial. Unfortunately our UK Mod is away at present so I dont know what kind of meds you can get there. I know you can get Bactopur direct so if med food is not possible that would be something to try.

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This is something i have not come by before ether. Eddie is the oldest patrick and pickles are just just a year old

I have started to treat them with sterazin and salt is now at 0.2/5%

I did feed eddie with live food from the garden when he was younger untill i found out about all the probs with that

Am trying to feed them garlic but they only eat it when they are really hungry will look for Bactopur and see if i can get it

Had to send away for the medigold imported cost alot!! None left!

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have ordered the treatment will keep them on the sterazin for the moment you never know cabbage our new fish could have flukes

And sadly that could be true ive lost my new ryukin lulu she had the fin rot like i said but her gill plates seemed to stick out recently, she was hiding away.

Checked out her corpse and she looks like she had a bacterial gill infection not the right colour at all!

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