Pop-eye, Blister At The Y Of The Tail

[zookey]

[*]Test Results for the Following:

Ammonia Level? 0

Nitrite Level? 0

Nitrate level? always < 20

Ph Level, (If possible,KH and GH and chloramines)? 7.6-7.8

Ph Level (KH/GH) out of the Tap? 7.6-7.8

Brand of test-kit used? (strips or drops?) Marine Enterprises Fresh Water Tests (Drops)

[*]Tank size (How many Gals) and How long has it been running? 55 Gallons since May

[*]What is the name and size of the filter/s? Emporer 350 & another filter I don't remember the brand of but it filters 300 galons per hour

[*]How often do you change the water and how much? Weekly 25-50%

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size? 6 Goldfish ( 1 ~ 4 Inches Oranda Cross, 1 Moore, 1 Oranda, 2 Ryukins ~ 2.5 inches, 1 Perlscale ~ 2.5 - 3 fat inches)

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners? Specialty stuff from local DNR

[*]Any medications added to the tank? no

[*]Add any new fish to the tank? no

[*]What do you feed your fish? Omega One sinking pellets

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as

"grains of salt",

bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Really fat face, white fleshy rings around the eyes on the Oranda X, the Pearlscale had a blister at the Y of the tail

[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating,ect..? NO, always active, never lethargic, fins always erect and happy

Above are the answers to the questions from the top of the page.

My questions are: 1.) What is popeye? Is that when the EYE itself is protruding or when the flesh around the eye looks swelled or larger or thicker than it used to be.

2.) What could cause a blister like thing at the Y junction of the tail? It has "popped" or healed now but am currious as to what causes the blister.

My largest fish is an orange Oranda X and for the past month or so has been developing more wen (not dramatically but it has gotten alittle thicker) and face fatness. S/he appears to have white rings under his eyes but they seem to be the face flesh that has been getting thicker that I am seeing. He HAS deffinately developed more jowels than he used to have. His EYES themselves are not protruding at all, in fact it looks as if his/her eyes are more sunken than they used to be. So would this be considered Pop-Eye or is this something that is related to his genetics of being an Oranda X? I am considering purchasing MetroMeds to have on hand, but not sure it this is Pop-Eye. I have looked for pictures of Pop-eye but they usually show an eye that looks like a Moores eye, the whole eye and socket protruding and that is much more severe than ANYTHING I am seeing in my tank.

My Pearlscale also had what looked like a blister at the Y-junction of her tail about a week or so ago. It was really hard to see and could only be noticed when her tail was in just the right possition. She is a calico and I wasn't quite sure if there was something there or if it was colloring, but now that it has since dissapeared I am assuming it had been a blister that has now popped and healed. I am wondering if this is something that will reaccur if it has to do with my tank or a sign of a hidden illness. She is also a very active fish, never sitting still and her fins are always held errect and never been clamped.

I will appreciate all of the help/advise you guys can offer.

[koko]

I would order MetroMeds. Also if you can get me a photo of both fish.

What is the temp of the tank?

This is what Dede looked like when she got popeye let me know if it looks some what like it

[zookey]

Koko,

I assume Dede's normal colloring around the eye was orange? Was her's both eyes or just one? Seems as both Spike's eyes have the same look as the other but neither of them look like that. I have tryed many times to get a picture but it never shows up on the photo. I will see what I can do for the white ring.......... as far as the Pearlscale's blister, it has totally dissapeared now. I have been keeping an eye on her and if this blister like thing were to reappear I will try to get a shot then.

Thanks Koko, for the offer of help.

How long does MetroMed's last on the shelf? I am thinking about getting some just to have on hand for "just in case" if this isn't something to treat with meds.

[koko]

Yes she was an all Orange Oranda, both eyes were like that. It showed up small at first this shot is the full blow look A pic would be great I can really tell with a photo

The meds will last 6 months to a year. If you have a vac seal unit you can seal bits of the food into it and it will last to a year that way. Keeps the air out of the food

[zookey]

MetroMeds vs MediGold

What is the difference? Would MediGold work as well? (I have some of that on hand)

I am going to place an order while online, just curious if MediGold would be as effective. I read that MetroMeds is for dropsy or thin fish and there is no sign of pineconeing and if this fish is "thin" I don't think he would fit in A tank if he were "filled out"!

[koko]

Personally I like using MetroMeds for Popeye and Dropsy it always seems to work better with them. If you do use Medigold dont switch to Metromeds in the middle this isnt good they are 2 different kinds of medicated foods. You can use it will work I just found that Metromeds do the best job.

Also what is the temp of the tank? Do you have Epsom salt?

[zookey]

My tank temps are usually in the mid 70 range. Somedays alittle warmer dependant on the weather, but normally about 72-76.

I haven't started them on the MediGold I just happen to have it in the cabinet. I did email Rick to see what he thought -- I will wait with the order until I get a response from him. I guess I need to know the difference in the meds so I know what they are good for prior to feeding them to the kids (fish).

I will try to get a picture of the eyes tonight. Thanks Koko for all of your help. I appreciate it.

[koko]

Okay, if he doesnt respond by tomorrow I think you can call him too. Havent talked to him in awhile .

Yes that would be great on the photo, just to make sure what we are dealing with here. Dont want to feed them something they dont need.

Do you have another tank?

[zookey]

Yes I have a Rubbermaid I could use as a QT if that is what you are thinking. But isn't popeye usually caused by a bacterial infection? And wouldn't the rest of my fish have been exposed? Shouldn't I be treating all of them then?

Oh, you asked about Epson salt, yes I have that also. Are you thinking dropsy? He shows no sings of pineconing, though.

[koko]

Well once I can see the fish, I will be able to see how or if its Popeye, and to treat that is about the same way is dropsy. The reason for a QT with them is that the temp has to be raised to 80F with Epsom salt. If other fish arent showing signs you dont need to do this to them since Dropsy and Popeye are not necessarily contagious some times it just the fish having bacterial infection that doesnt spread. Dede had this and never did it go to the other fish and she was placed into her own tank once I knew what was going on

[zookey]

Should a fish with popeye caused by a bacterial infection also have stringy poo? (other signs I have seen associated with bacterial infoections) He does NOT. Really he seems perfectly healthy other than the fat face and ringlets on the eyes.

Well either way I will try to get a picture of him tonight and get it posted. Thanks again for all of your help Koko.

By the way and WAY off topic....... what do you do for a living (or education) that you know SO-O-O-O-O-O much about fish? Just wondering.

[koko]

In the beginning they wont always show you the white poop, When I saw it on Dede she wasnt showing that kind of poop until a few days later. Reason I know this is that I watch my fish everyday for atleast 15-30 mins to make sure they are all okay.

As for info in my head Dropsy and Popeye are my specialty When I lost a few fish before Dede I decided that when she got it I was going to find a cure for this horde problem since most people havent been able to cure it. So I set out got as much information as I could then started working it out and working on her... She made it through and got it 3 more times cause her kidneys were very damaged

As for fish information, I been raising fish in general for many many years, I still learn new things everyday, but its a Passion to learn about goldfish and my saltwater fish and to help others out.

Oh and many many many books

[zookey]

Koko,

I tryed for most of 3 hours to get a picture of the Oranda's eyes to no avail. A friend of mine who works at the DNR hatchery happened to stop by to drop off more of the stuff we use to treat the water for the fish -- he looked at the tank and told me that the fish (most in the tank) are suffering from a form of infection! I really thought my tank was healthy

He advised me to order the MetroMeds (after looking at them online) or he could get me the stuff they use in the hatchery but that is in big chunks that slowly get eaten by the young fingerlings and he wouldn't know the dosage for a small tank. He said that it is an exterior bacterial infection that is uncommon but the hatchery has experienced it a couple times this year in different holding tanks and all fish show different signs ........... Long story short ....... he did some scapes and slides and called this morning and told me that the fish are still in the treatable stage and all they need is a good antibiotic, the tests show that it hasn't progressed to internal infection yet but the best course of treatment is to get them on the MM and treat the water with salt.

The oranda does NOT have popeye...... this bacteria will irritate delecate skin and apparently my oranda has delicate facial skin so it is just swelled and it will return to normal when treated with MM/salt.

I know I had posted about this same issue with this oranda X acouple of times but it would seem to clear up and come back then clear up........ Apparently this bacteria will flurrish and then almost all die out then flurrish again causing his irritation (swelled cheeks) to come and go.

I just wanted to thank you for the offer of help and let you know what I have found out. (I wish I could get a picture of him for your reference) but I will go ahead and treat the whole bunch with MM and have my friend check on them regularly since he is the one who knows what he is looking at. If I can, I will have my friend write up the description of this infection and the pictures he can get on his microscope and send them to you koko and you can post it or do with it what you will.

Thanks again for your help.

PS The best news was since he did a scrape he could tell me if they have flukes or any other fishy nasty and NONE of them do. Just this one issue and when it is gone it really will be a healthy tank!

Edited July 31, 2008 by zookey

[koko]

That is great that some one was able to look at him, things like this are much easier to tell what is going on if you can look at it and getting a scrap is the best way.

I would love to get the infomation and photos. Please let me know how hes doing.....