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Fish Floating Upside Down


Guest TBunny

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Guest TBunny

Test Results for the Following:

Ammonia Level? 0

Nitrite Level? 0

Nitrate level? 10

Ph Level, (If possible,KH and GH and chloramines)? 7.6

Ph Level (KH/GH) out of the Tap?

Brand of test-kit used? (strips or drops?) API dropper</FONT></FONT></B>

[*]What is the name and size of the filter/s? Emperor 350, 350 gallons per hour

[*]How often do you change the water and how much? 2X a week 80%

[*]How many fish in the tank and their size? 2 (fantail & oranda), both 3.5 inches

[*]What kind of water additives or conditioners? Aquasafe

[*]Any medications added to the tank? Epsom salt

[*]Add any new fish to the tank? NO

[*]What do you feed your fish? ProGold, Omega One, & peas once a week

[*]Any unusual findings on the fish such as

"grains of salt",

bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? </SPAN></SPAN>[*]Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating,ect..? Fantail has a huge stomach, floating on top

Henrietta has been floating upside down now for 2 days. I added 1/2 teaspoon of epsom salt yesterday and she doesn't seem to be any better. Her stomach is huge and when she rights herself she is occasionally gasping at the top. I fed her peas once yesterday and was hoping for a smaller tummy today but no such luck. Her body has always looked deformed because she has small fins and a giagantic belly but now it looks like it is going to expode.

I feel so sorry for her. This cannot be a good QOL. I have MM and MediGold on hand. Ugh...this is so stressful!

Thanks!</SPAN></SPAN>

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Guest TBunny

BUMP! Looking for some guidance please. Used epsom salt (1/2 teaspoon for several days) and fed peas but no such luck. I did see a big poo in the water but Henrietta still floats upside down at the top most of the day. Any help would be appreciated :(

upside2.jpg

upside.jpg

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What was the lead up to this? Has she had any previous problems or odd behavior? Gasping, bottom sitting etc? Did she suddenly just flip over or slowly tilt and then flip?

Have you seen any poop recently? Could she be constipated if not?

Can you see her gills. Do they look brownish?

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Trinket...thank you! Leading up the complete flip and bloat was the use of aquarium salt about 2 weeks ago. I salted because Henry the oranda has had a persistent case of fin rot. Within 2 days of the salt ramp-up Henrietta was beginning to flip. Last Thursday I did a large water change (95%) and then added 1/2 teaspoon epsom salt and fasted her. She floated upside down for several days and then I fed her peas for a few days. There was a large greenish poo on the tank bottom yesterday and I'm almost certain it was from her. Henry's poo is a lot thinner. I did notice today some pale-clear stringy poo coming out of her.

Prior to her being totally flipped she did gasp for air a lot. Her gills look pinkish to me. No odd behavior to report in the past other than her odd body shape.

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Just wanted to stop by and lend my support. Sorry you were overlooked there for a while, but Trinket is here now and should be looking in on you again this evening. She's in Japan, so she comes on at a very different time. If anyone can get you through this, Trinket will. :hug

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Thanks Lynda. No problem about the wait time. I know there are lots of other sick fishies in need of assistance. BTW, I love your tank. Great plants. How big is it?

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Thanks Lynda. No problem about the wait time. I know there are lots of other sick fishies in need of assistance. BTW, I love your tank. Great plants. How big is it?

It's a 60 gallon. Thanks on the plants, but they're all fake! lol! One, I love bamboo, but real bamboo is not an underwater plant, soooo.... fake bamboo. Same with a bonsai tree! lol! And, between the fact that live plants take extra care and lighting, which I just don't have the time, energy or money for as well as that goldies love to munch and destroy plants, I went with plastic. But, thanks!

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Pearlscales can be sensitive to salt, like any fish. Some people have noticed high salt levels seems to "pop" the pearls and one stretch more along those lines and it might be that salt is somehow osmoted out less efficiently through those pearls.....Did you salt to 0.3%? What size is your tank- I'm sure you know 0.3% is one tablespoon per gallon of water....

Very sudden flipover like this can be caused by several things. High nitrates is one- but it doesn't look likely in your case so have a read of this list and see if anything else sounds possible and post back. Dealing with swimbladder and flipping issues is always a case of elimination and usually this is best done by the owner who knows the history and lifestyle of their fish best.

Over feeding: which can inflate the intestinal tract squishing and crowding out the airsacs above.

Eggs: a fish that is full of eggs -the eggs can put pressure on the sacs causing malfunction.

Infection: viral,bacterial and parasitic- causing inflammation of organs or build up of visceral fluids inside the fish.

Constipation and gas: A diet of solely processed commercial food can pack up the gut with air and cause bloat which squeezes the airbladder. Wheat and soy in processed foods require for digestion, the production of an enzyme that also produces some gases that create bubbles in poop and indicate gas build up. These fish should be either fasted or overfed for a few days or permanently if severe- on non processed foods to eliminate the gas.

Airbladder malfunction: sometimes the tube connecting the airsacs, the physostome, gets blocked, temporarily or permanently. In a worst case scenario water can enter and fill the swimbladder causing total malfunction. The fish will flipover. This is true "swimbladder disease".

High nitrates: these can affect the vasodilation capacity of blood capillaries- this one reminds me of how a fatty diet can affect the ability for people's blood vessels to transport blood to the human heart...arteries and vessels clog.

Gulping air: lack of oxygen, nitrite poisoning, plunging pH and parasites will have the fish piping for air. Gulping air deregulates vascular air flow and causes balance problems as th GI tract swells with air. Fish should not be at the surface.

Overuse of antibiotics: after use of antibiotics fish will have less available bacteria inside to help regulate vascular activities that support a healthy balance. The more antibiotics and medications we have used on a fish, the more likely it becomes they will weaken the fishes inner system. Longterm use of antibiotics can also damage the kidney causing bloat as the fish becomes unable to expell waste efficiently.

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Trinket- I failed to post that the tank is 20 gallons. I didn't know Henrietta was a pearlscale because I picked her out of the calico fantail tank LOL. I brought the aquarium salt up to 3% in 3-12 hour intervals. I checked the water readings yesterday afternoon and they were perfect- 7.6 PH, 0 AM, 0 Nitrite, 10 Nitrate. I'm stumped.

What would be your course of action if this was your fish Trinket? Also, if I cannot seem to remedy does one allow the fish to live like this?

Thank you

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Salinity of 3%??? or it's a typo?? It should be 0.3%.

Also 0.3% = 3 TEASPOONS per gallon, I dont think it's Tablespoon. Maybe that's a typo there too?

I am treating my tank with salt too, just want to make sure I'm using the correct salt dosage.

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Also 0.3% = 3 TEASPOONS per gallon, I dont think it's Tablespoon. Maybe that's a typo there too?

I am treating my tank with salt too, just want to make sure I'm using the correct salt dosage.

Trinket was saying that 0.3% salt is one tablespoon of salt per gallon (this is because 3 teaspoons = 1 tablespoon). But thanks for looking out for typos -- it is easy to make them and really screw up dosages!

I have recently found that using a small digital scale makes dosing salt much easier. 0.1% salt = 1 gram salt per liter of water, 0.2% salt = 2 grams salt per liter, etc. It is easy to convert gallons to liters, then grams to ounces, and then you don't have to worry about losing count of teaspoons or tablespoons or about the volume differences with fine vs. coarse salt. You could also use a postage scale.

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What would be your course of action if this was your fish Trinket? Also, if I cannot seem to remedy does one allow the fish to live like this?

Since your water looks good I would focus on food next. Stop feeding any commercial food and just feed veggies/gelfood/fruit and some shrimp for protein. Try this for a week. It may be your fish has encountered some swimbladder malfunction and if so the next thing may be she will at some point sink to the bottom of the tank (maybe upside down). As long as she is floaty I would go with gas or bloat issues related to food and/or the salting.

A small amount of Epsom should help. Give her a few weeks. It can take some time for gas to be released. Let us know what develops.

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