Sinking Pellets Without Color Enhancer

[Guest kathyd33]

i travel and use an eheim auto feeder. i just found out why my new velvet black butterfly oranda is getting a little orangey--color enhancer!! does anyone know of a food without beta cerotene, shrimp, salmon, krill--all those little orange critters? thanks, kathy

[Acupunk]

I am no expert, but I think that a black fish turning orange has more to do with it losing its black than getting too much orange, if you know what I mean. This is determined almost exclusively by genetics rather than diet.

Some people also say that black fish will keep their black better if they are exposed to the sun. Is spending the summer in a tub garden an option for your oranda?

I don't think that removing color-enhancing foods from its diet will make a difference. Hopefully if I am wrong someone will correct me.

[daryl]

Color enhancers effect the reds, making them brighter. They also can "pink out" the white on a white fish or a two toned fish. They really do not have anything to do with keeping a black fish black.

As noted above, black is almost all genetically determined. A fish that is genetically inclined to be black for the duration of it's life, will. Most do not remain black, though. A really GOOD black may stay black for 5+ years, but most, eventually silver out - and if there is yellow/red pigmentation in the genetics, they will bronze out with time. A fish that does not have the genetic makeup for true black may appear to be black when young, but as it ages, it will go red/yellow. You cannot stop it or change it. It is the nature of the goldfish.

There is something to the fact that you can HELP keep a DEEP black in black fish - or black spotted fish - with a higher pH and gH and kH. In waters that are borderline "too hard", the black fish seems to stay a deeper, more velvety black than a fish kept in more acidic waters. Water of this intensity is NOT recommended for koi - it will do damage - but goldfish can and do thrive in such waters.

Black is also increased and intensified by sunshine as noted above. Once again, though, you have to have the genetic makeup that produces the deep velvet black - the sunshine will just enhance that which is already there.

[Acupunk]

There is something to the fact that you can HELP keep a DEEP black in black fish - or black spotted fish - with a higher pH and gH and kH. In waters that are borderline "too hard", the black fish seems to stay a deeper, more velvety black than a fish kept in more acidic waters. Water of this intensity is NOT recommended for koi - it will do damage - but goldfish can and do thrive in such waters.

What constitutes a high enough GH/KH and pH to bring about this effect? And did you mean more acidic waters above, or am I confused?

[daryl]

I mean that you want more basic or alkaline waters to help keep the black. That is the theory, at least.

The general theory is that gH and kH over 300ppm and pH 8.2-8.8 ish......

Since I am running that, I have not noticed any obvious differences, but others have reported such.

[Acupunk]

I mean that you want more basic or alkaline waters to help keep the black. That is the theory, at least.

The general theory is that gH and kH over 300ppm and pH 8.2-8.8 ish......

Since I am running that, I have not noticed any obvious differences, but others have reported such.

Okay, so this is just my regular tap water (KH 350, pH 8.4) . For future reference, how would this water harm koi?