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Ryukin Sitting At The Bottom Of The Tank


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If it's been a couple of weeks and you're not seeing a marked improvement in Jack's mobility, I would definately consider other methods...but I can't recommend anything other than what I've used. If it were me though, I'd get a hold of an injectible antibiotic, as that seemed to really jumpstart Oscar's improvement. If I had it to do all over again, I'd go through the same trouble to get the antibiotic.

Toothless mentioned the injectible antibiotics also. Does that mean I use a syringe and inject the fish? :blink:

I have the antibac-bath that I bought from Goldfishconnection. The website claims it's the next best thing to the injection. I had to buy 100 capsules and the treatment cycle only required 4 so I have tons left. Should I do the cycle again?

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Hmmm, I'm not so sure that further treatment should be administered. He may very well be what some call a "sinker". Stuck to the bottom. If their mechanism for manipulating the swim bladder becomes damaged, it makes it very hard to swim around successfully. It causes most goldfish to become introverted. This is a very valid point that should be mulled over for a bit before continuing with any treatments. However, there is a slight ray of hope in trying the antibac bath. I just haven't seen any symptoms listed that would suggest a bacterial infection of any sort. Generally, fish with bacterial infections express other symptoms besides just bottom sitting. I can't even make out any red streaks in the tail..... :unsure:

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Hmmm, I'm not so sure that further treatment should be administered. He may very well be what some call a "sinker". Stuck to the bottom. If their mechanism for manipulating the swim bladder becomes damaged, it makes it very hard to swim around successfully. It causes most goldfish to become introverted. This is a very valid point that should be mulled over for a bit before continuing with any treatments. However, there is a slight ray of hope in trying the antibac bath. I just haven't seen any symptoms listed that would suggest a bacterial infection of any sort. Generally, fish with bacterial infections express other symptoms besides just bottom sitting. I can't even make out any red streaks in the tail..... :unsure:

Yes he looks healthy otherwise and has no physical clues to his sickness other than the flattened belly bottom. He tries to swim up but gets about 6 inches off the gravel and then just kind of falls down. The strange thing is, once in a while, he is capable of shooting all the way to the top in sort of a frenzy then he just drops all the way back down. :(

He looks smaller than he used to be. Not skinnier but just smaller. Is this possible? For a fish to shrink without changing it's proportion? It could be an optical illusion because Sash has had incredible growth spurts in the last few month and has almost grown twice the size since Jack has been sick. :blink:

I suppose I am going to continue with the medigold for the full 30 days but I have made the decision, starting tomorrow to take Jack out during feeding and manually feed him as he is not getting enough.

Is the antibac-bath safe to do again? I just did it a couple of weeks ago.

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Oh my god, I've just read this whole thread and it is exactly what happened to my ranchu Calypso a few months back.

My crappy vet told me to euth her which I really regret now as I think I could have saved her. I'm so encouraged your fish is still hanging in there.

I'll leave Toothy to advise as he's the Sherlock Homes of fishkeeping and diagnosis, but could I offer a suggestion?

Can you try lifting him off the bottom for a while in the sick-box contraption which is posted in 'tip of the month'? This will take the water pressure off him (stuck at the bottom) and prevent the possibilty of the gravel grazing his belly. I realised this too late and Calypso had scratched herself and tattered her fins in the effort to move off the bottom and swim up.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

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Oh my god, I've just read this whole thread and it is exactly what happened to my ranchu Calypso a few months back.

My crappy vet told me to euth her which I really regret now as I think I could have saved her. I'm so encouraged your fish is still hanging in there.

I'll leave Toothy to advise as he's the Sherlock Homes of fishkeeping and diagnosis, but could I offer a suggestion?

Can you try lifting him off the bottom for a while in the sick-box contraption which is posted in 'tip of the month'? This will take the water pressure off him (stuck at the bottom) and prevent the possibilty of the gravel grazing his belly. I realised this too late and Calypso had scratched herself and tattered her fins in the effort to move off the bottom and swim up.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

I'm sorry about your Calypso. :(

Thank you so much for your concern Pixiefish. :)

That's very good advice and I will keep an eye on his belly. I just took a look as I was doing a water change and his belly seems to be free of abrasion. When he moves around, he does seem to levitate slightly off the gravel.

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I took Jack out of the tank and put him in a mixing bowl but I think he freaked out. He spit out any food that went into his mouth so I put him back in the tank. I try to aim the food into his mouth but I think only one or two pieces of medigold went into his mouth. :(

I also noticed he pooped and it was brown so he is not constipated with what little food he is getting.

Poor Jack I don't know what to do. I hope he is not suffering. :(

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I also noticed he pooped and it was brown so he is not constipated with what little food he is getting.

Poor Jack I don't know what to do. I hope he is not suffering. :(

Brown poo is good! Woo hoo! :D How many times are you feeding him per day? If he's only eating one or two pellets at a time, you'll want to give him frequent feedings to make sure he keeps a full tummy. I have no idea how you're dropping directly into his mouth from the top of your tank...I think I'd be wasting a lot of food, or feeding Sash a lot. :D Definately continue with the medicated food though.

Hey Toothless, is there any reason to consider an antibiotic (maybe other than for bacterial infection), to get Jack's swim bladder back in shape? When people and animals get sick, we don't always know what the culprit is, but an antibiotic will at least knock out whatever is wrong. If Jack isn't eating a lot, he's not getting a lot of the medicine in him, which is important. So assuming the swim bladder problem isn't irreversible yet, could something else be done besides what's being done now?

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I hope ur fishie gets better. My fishie had that too, except he wasnt eating, he died 2 days later (sorry, thats probably not very encouraging, but Im sure he'll make it).

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Brown poo is good! Woo hoo! :D How many times are you feeding him per day? If he's only eating one or two pellets at a time, you'll want to give him frequent feedings to make sure he keeps a full tummy. I have no idea how you're dropping directly into his mouth from the top of your tank...I think I'd be wasting a lot of food, or feeding Sash a lot. :D Definately continue with the medicated food though.

I feed them twice a day. I aim and drop the food from the top of the tank. It has to fall within a 1/4" of Jack's mouth or he won't be able to suck it in. He does not seem capable of getting food off the gravel. Yes Sash eats all the food that is on the gravel. Sash is getting enormous! He literally seems to be getting bigger by the day.

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I hope ur fishie gets better. My fishie had that too, except he wasnt eating, he died 2 days later (sorry, thats probably not very encouraging, but Im sure he'll make it).

Thank you Shamu23. Jack is lucky to have so many people wishing him well. :)

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Well, poor Jack's swim bladder mechanism is completely messed up. He tipped over on his side and he could not right himself up for the longest time. However he is an incredible fighter. He is constantly trying to learn how to swim again. He is always trying his hardest to get off the gravel. He seems so determined to become well again. Watching him I can't help but to think how opposite he is to when Sash was sick. When Sash had dropsy, he really looked like he had given up all will to fight. He looked like he was just devastated and knew he was going to die. I seriously did not think he was going to make it. Miraculously the Metromeds that I had shipped overnight cured him. With Jack, it's different. He is constantly trying to swim again. Like he is trying to teach his broken down swim bladder to work properly again. If you watch him, you can not help but to root and cheer for him to recover. He is that determined.

I think he's going to make it. :)

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My Spud is the same EXACT way. His swim bladder is beyond hope but he still tries really hard to keep his composure. If he somehow gets pushed over onto his side, he swims along the bottom on his side in circles trying his darndest to right himself again. Sometimes it takes a few minutes but he's slowly learned how to use plants and the walls of the tank to right himself and keep himself righted. Poor things. It IS a struggle but they seem to be quite the little fighters, don't they? :heart

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My Spud is the same EXACT way. His swim bladder is beyond hope but he still tries really hard to keep his composure. If he somehow gets pushed over onto his side, he swims along the bottom on his side in circles trying his darndest to right himself again. Sometimes it takes a few minutes but he's slowly learned how to use plants and the walls of the tank to right himself and keep himself righted. Poor things. It IS a struggle but they seem to be quite the little fighters, don't they? :heart

Poor Spud. He sounds like a fighter like Jack. :)

How do you feed Spud? Do you manually feed him everytime?

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Luckily, he seems to be able to keep himself upright 90% of the time. It's when he ventures around the tank that he sometimes "trips" and winds up fully laying on his side. He swims in a tight circular pattern until he either catches a "draft" of water that lifts him from the bottom or he winds up at a plant or the side of a tank to help himself upright. Sometimes he runs out of pep attempting to upright himself. Thats when he'll rest for a minute before going at it again. It never takes more than a couple minutes though. :P

I just wish he would swim up in the water column more. He spends nearly all his time within an inch or two of the bottom.... :(

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Hi Jack of Hearts - thought I'd stop by for an update on your Jack. So he is still hanging in there and no farther symptoms? Not worse often means mending :heart So it would seem to be just the swimbladder disorder? I hope he can stay upright. I have a fish that sits too but unfortunately her balance is skued and she is upside down. For ever, it seems :( . It's so sweet that Sash is sticking by her and misses his synchronised swimming partner and I wish you 3 the best outcome and lots of luck for Jack to get back swimming soon :)

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Luckily, he seems to be able to keep himself upright 90% of the time. It's when he ventures around the tank that he sometimes "trips" and winds up fully laying on his side. He swims in a tight circular pattern until he either catches a "draft" of water that lifts him from the bottom or he winds up at a plant or the side of a tank to help himself upright. Sometimes he runs out of pep attempting to upright himself. Thats when he'll rest for a minute before going at it again. It never takes more than a couple minutes though. :P

I just wish he would swim up in the water column more. He spends nearly all his time within an inch or two of the bottom.... :(

But it sounds like Spud is getting his share of food. Jack is not capable of getting food off the gravel. He only eats when the food pretty much falls into his mouth.

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Hi Jack of Hearts - thought I'd stop by for an update on your Jack. So he is still hanging in there and no farther symptoms? Not worse often means mending :heart So it would seem to be just the swimbladder disorder? I hope he can stay upright. I have a fish that sits too but unfortunately her balance is skued and she is upside down. For ever, it seems :( . It's so sweet that Sash is sticking by her and misses his synchronised swimming partner and I wish you 3 the best outcome and lots of luck for Jack to get back swimming soon :)

Hi Trinket. Good to hear from you!

It's very strange because like Toothless noted, Jack shows no other symptoms of illness, such as clamped fin, dropsy, or anything on his fins or gills. He looks perfectly healthy except for his flattened belly.

Everybody says that it's a good thing that Sash does not pick on Jack as he is twice his size now. Sometimes Sash bangs into Jack and knocks him over unintentionally. :( Jack always seemed very smart for a fish but Sash is definitetly not too smart.

I noticed now that Sash has a couple of scales missing and the flesh underneath is oozing out. :blink: Is this going to be a problem or will it heal? He doesn't seemed to be bothered by it...

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I just noticed that Jack's anal region is very swollen and protuding. :(

I never noticed it until now. I don't think it was like that from the beginning but I'm not sure now. I only noticed it now because he seems to be slightly better and is getting a few inches off the gravel now.

What could this be? And is this the cause of his problems?

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I can only assume that, because he doesn't eat much, his body mass is lean. This, along with his digestive tract being mostly bare, may cause his port to bulge. Could this be what your seeing? :unsure:

You say he's up and about more now?

Could you elaborate on Sash's apparent injury? It sounds hideous! :blink:

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I can only assume that, because he doesn't eat much, his body mass is lean. This, along with his digestive tract being mostly bare, may cause his port to bulge. Could this be what your seeing? :unsure:

You say he's up and about more now?

Could you elaborate on Sash's apparent injury? It sounds hideous! :blink:

It looks like it is severely swollen and enlarged.

Yes he dashes around on the top of the gravel a lot moving around more frequently on the tank. Also he is able to suck in food that fall a little farther away than before. He also seems to be able to tilt to the side to try to get some food off the gravel. If he tilts all the way to the side, it takes him a long time to be able to right himself up(I think your Spud had the same problem).

Now the strange thing is on an occasion, he is able to dart off daiagonally all the way to the top of the tank, suck in air at the top then sink down to the bottom. Other than that, he has no control to get himself more than a few inches off the gravel.

I tried to photograph Sash's condition but it does not come out right. Also it can only be seen clearly when the light is on in the room but the tank light shut off.

I don't know if the scales are actually missing but there is on the space of about 2-2.5 scales, an fleshy looking substance in lieu of the scales. It's actually slightly darker orange than his scales and it is slightly more raised than the surface of the scales. It does not seem to bother him whatsoever.

Thank you so once again for your concern, toothless. :)

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Could be a mechanical injury. Goldies get them from time to time. Keep a close eye on it and let us know if anything new arises.... :unsure:

Thank you. It has not gotten any better but I don't think it has gotten any worse. It's very weird. I don't think it's exposed flesh as the flesh is not dark orange. It might be some kind of growth on the scales... :(

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I was reading in my goldfish book the other night that goldfish who's swim bladders seem to "stop" working, can be fixed surgically. Something to think about, as a last resort I suppose.

I was hoping to pop over here and find Jack all better, but a little upset he's still sick. Poor guy. But sounds like he's making some progress? He's been fighting for a while, which is definately promising. You are taking really good care of him.

Do you have that book from the Goldfish Connection? It's an awesome book. I read it all the time now. :)

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I was reading in my goldfish book the other night that goldfish who's swim bladders seem to "stop" working, can be fixed surgically. Something to think about, as a last resort I suppose.

I was hoping to pop over here and find Jack all better, but a little upset he's still sick. Poor guy. But sounds like he's making some progress? He's been fighting for a while, which is definately promising. You are taking really good care of him.

Do you have that book from the Goldfish Connection? It's an awesome book. I read it all the time now. :)

Thank you Lola. It's so nice of you to check in on Jack. :D He is somewhat better as his range(in getting the food) is somewhat better. I don't have to almost directly drop the food into his mouth now. If it is within a couple of inches, he can usually get it. He tilts to his side now to try to get some food off the gravel, so that's encouraging. :) His anal region is still very swollen and his belly is still flattened. He is always practicing getting off the ground(gravel). He can now get up about a few inches on occasion.

What book are you talking about from the Goldfish Connection?

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Guest beemo

i didnt read through all the post so my appologies if what i post has allready been mentioned.

bottom sitting is usually a sign of flukes or intestinal worms.

did you treat him with prazipro?

too much salt can also lead to bottom sitting

my guess is its flukes, ive been through it so many times before. first they bottom sit then they get these sores which is a secondary infection to the fluke infestation

either way no matter what it is, he should be taken out of that tank and placed in a bare bottom QT tank where he can get the proper treatment

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