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Very Sick Fish....


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I posted in the wrong place before... In Goldfich discussion. Ok I have 2 goldfish and a Dragon Fish in a 10 gal tank. Before coming to this site tonight I had no clue about cycling any of the levels....... I knew nothing! My goldfish are usually chasing each other aroung the tank ( the Dragon Fish is new) now they are sitting on the bottem or hiding in the log, they will dart aroung the tank like crazy, they are not eating, there is a clear jelly like sub. at the bottem of the tank, some scales are missing, they have red streaks on their bodies...... they have been like this for a few days...mabey close to a week. I got some meds (Maracyn-Two) and started it tonight and did a 40-50% water change. What else do I do? I love my fish but had no clue all the maintence was needed. PLEASE HELP ASAP!!!

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Test Results for the Following: NO CLUE ON ANY LEVELS

Ammonia Level?

Nitrite Level?

Nitrate level?

Ph Level, (If possible,KH and GH and chloramines)?

Ph Level out of the Tap?

Tank size (How many Gals) and How long has it been running? 10 GAL APROX. 1 YR

What is the name and size of the filter/s? WISPER FOR 10 GAL

How often do you change the water and how much? WHEN IT GETS BAD AND ALL

How many fish in the tank and their size? 2 GOLDFISH AND A DRAGONFISH

GOLDFISH ARE ABOUT 2IN AND THE DRAGON FISH IS ABOUT 4 IN

What kind of water additives or conditioners? TETRA EASYBALANCE

Any medications added to the tank? MARACYN-TWO

Add any new fish to the tank? YES THE DRAGON FISH IS NEW

What do you feed your fish? JUST SWITCHED THE GOLDFISH FROM TROPICAL CRISPS TO GOLDFISH CRISPS, THE DRAGON FISH EATS BLOOD WORMS FROZEN

Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt",

bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? BLOOD ON FISH, STRINGY WHITE MATERIAL ON FISH, BACK FIN DETEROURATING (SP?), HIDING, NO ACTIVITY (VERY UNUSUAL!!!), NOT EATING, FLASH EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE, JELLY SUB AT BOTTOM OF TANK,

Any unusual behavior like staying

at the bottom, not eating, ect..? ALL OF THE ABOVE!

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I posted in the discussion forum, but really, get that dragon fish out, its not doing you any good.

You said in your info that you only change the water when it gets bad, you need to change about 40% of the water every 2-3days in that tank. Comets or commons (which you probably have seeing as you got them from a fair) need about 20gallons EACH, which is why i'm saying your very overstocked and need to up the water changes.

Its hard to tell if they are sick just from bad water, or if its a combination of bad water and illness/disease.

I would do a big waterchange (you did 50% yesterday? do another one of about 40%), suction all the gravel and dont touch the filter (it holds all the good biobugs). You can salt the water and keep up the maracyn-2 (we dont have this in australia, but i've heard good things about it overseas).

I think the salt regimen is 1tsp/gallon to get it to 0.1% salinity, dont quote me though. And there are specific types of salt you need, definately dont use table salt as it contains anti-caking agents which are toxic to fish. Some of the useable ones are aquarium salt, pikling salt, rock salt, solar salt, well thats all i can think of at the moment, but none of these should have any additives.

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Forget peas. They are not the right treatment for your fish now. Wait till you have healthier fish. You say they are not eating so they'll only spit out the peas.

You have to replace the medicine you are taking out with water changes. Be really careful not to overdose your fish. That will kill them.

BTW Also in the forum rules we are told we are not supposed to block print posts! :) Even though I know how you feel right now is desperate.

Did you check out the disease link I posted for you? You really should! :) There's a ton of information there that will help you. I think it sounds like fungal disease and also finrot setting in. Perfect water and the right dosage of the right medicine needed. Good luck.

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Ohh sorry for the caps print (I think that is what you ment)!

So if I do a 40% water change and I have already put the meds in for today what should I do? I am only saposed to do one package/day.

I have looked on the info that came with the meds and my fish have the symptoms of a few diff illnesses! The Dragon fish is not aggressive, he is scared of the goldfish. He is 4 in long but resembles a snake! He is smaller than the goldfish. I will see if I can find a pic!

Also, I took the log and the plants out of my tank because they were very dirty and had alot of debris on them. Any suggestions for cleaning them? Should I remove the rocks? Are you saposed to boil rocks when you do the tank?

I am going to lay out the events that led to the sick fish....

I was out of filters and the tank got very, very dirty. For about a month (I know it is horrable but I have been going through alot!) I cleaned it a couple of times (80-90% water change). Then while buying the filters, we picked up the Dragon Fish and added him to the tank. A few days after I completly changed the tank water, boiled the rocks, scrubbed the filter (it gets very slimmy and gets clogged quite easy), and put the fish back in. This is when they started acting funny!

Sorry for the long post! Thanks! ~Audra~

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Sounds like your tank is now trying to cycle, you basically crashed your cycle by changing all the water (or 90% as you said), boiling the rocks and buying new filters (i assume you mean buying new filter pads). All of this has crashed your cycle as in you killed all the good bio-bugs that keep your tank healthy.

Read up on cycling tanks, i've only ever had to do it once and that was many many years ago, i've always seeded my tanks from existing filters and never had a cycling problem so i dont have much info to give you.

However during cycling you get ammonia spikes, which i still think has been a major contributor for your fish becomming sick. Never buy (or very rarely, like once a year) new filter pads, just rinse them out in DECHLORINATED water or water you've taken out to do a water change from your tank, the chlorine in tap water will kill all the bio-bugs and your back where you started. You can clean the inside of your filter (the plastic parts) as much as you like to stop the impeller getting clogged, this dosen't really have an effect on the bio-bugs as they are mainly in the rocks/filter media. In saying this I would only do this once a week or so max. I clean my canister filters out like once every few months.

I still wouldn't keep the dragon fish in there, its a tropical fish, and needs different conditions to the goldfish, not only that but your adding more waste to an already overstocked tank. Do you have a big plastic tub where you could put the filter and the goldfish? I have 2x 40gallon tubs which cost like $15AUeach which would be perfect until you can sort your tank situation out. I use them as quarantine/hospital tanks, and when their not serving my fish they are clothes baskets :)

I hope your fishies will be ok :)

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Also with medications, i'm sorry i cant tell you much, here in australia we basically have NO medications for fish (none that actually work anyway..) because our antibiotic rules are very strict.

Just remember if your planning on salting the tank that salt dosent evaporate. So if you add 2tablespoons of salt into a 2 gallon tank, if 1gallon of the water evaporates you still have 2tablespoons of salt in the tank. The only way to remove salt from water is to manually remove the water and replace it with fresh water. Did that make sense? lol

So once your tank is salted and your doing a water change, only add enough salt to salt how much water your replacing, not the whole tank.

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A dragon fish is harmless, its the new fad. What it is, is a violet goby a mean looking fish that represents an eel type look. But its a very quiet, kind fish that belongs in a tropical tank, with a heater and salt. Its a community fish, a lot of people think that this new "dragon fish" is mean and eat other fish when they are are harmless as dojos.

If your fish are look like they are painted with blood then they have septicemia, which can lead to all sorts of other dieases which is what they orginally die from, instead of the septicemia. Your already medicating for it though so that is a good start :( but you have to keep the water completely clean with nitrites and ammonia at 0 at all times.

What I found that worked wonders for this is the fungal bactieria meds by jungle.

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My filter is a Whisper. The pads get clogged with green gunk and then the water does not run through them, I have tried to rince them before but it didn't help much. When the water does not run through (it acts as a waterfall) then they are starved for oxygen and gasp at the top.

Thank you so much for the info!

I still need to know about the water change with meds....

Any info?

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One more question....

I am making another run to vvvv to get more supplies. Any suggestions on what I should get to cheak levels? Or any other supplies? I do not have much money but I am going to try.....

I got a gravel vacuume yesterday. If I do a 50% waterchange and I have already put the meds in for today, would I redose with half of a package? Or wait and just do tommarros dose in the morning?

I use tap water for my tank...and use Tetra- EasyBalance w/ Nitraban. Is this ok? It reads 'Keeps aquarium water biologically balanced for up to 6 months. Stabilizes pH and alkalinity (KH) levels vital for fish and plants. Reduces nitrates and phosphate.'

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I'd like to know how the fish are doing. :(

If you've done a 50 %change after adding meds then I'd wait till tomorrow to add another days meds AFTER (oops caps!)you do the water change this time. It is very easy to OD on the meds.

If you're filters were that clogged I'm sure that was half the problem.

Your poor fishies. I hope they're all going to heal up. Please let us know how its going.

You need to buy ammonia test kit and also nitrites/nitrates and PH. if poss.

Also what kind of log did you have in there? Are you using only fish store supplies or did you put anything in the tank that isn't specifically for fish? Soaps/pesticides/varnish/paint/metal/bamboo etc are all killers. You can only use stuff for aquariums... :)

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Hi again. I have suddenly realised what the clear gel stuff in your tank is/was. Are they a whole batch of jelly like eggs? It dawned on me later...the fact you were saying about how cute it was the 2fish chasing each other round....

You've got fish eggs in there.I'm pretty sure. The fish doing the chasing will be the male. the other laid the eggs. Don't worry I imagine they are not going to hatch with a sick male- he wo't be up to spraying them. (To read more about breeding go to the goldfish breeding section/forum)

This makes your situation alittle different. That gel if its eggs it is going to cloud and rot your water Very soon!

I think you are going to have to set up a new tank. A QT. You have already crashed your cycle and there are eggs in there that will soon start to rot as they are not fertilised.

Also your female fish will be very weak after this and prone to infection.

Do you have a large rubbermaid (10 gallon min) or another tank? :listen:

I think you should set up a QT (Quarantine tank)urgently. Plese post back, I can try and guide you through that...Also you should separate the dragonfish so 2 diff. QTs would be the best...is that real hard? That dragonfish is big and he needs his own space, believe me!

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Ok guys I am so proud.... I just tested the water in the tank!

Ammonia- 0.25ppm

Nitrate- 20ppm

Nitrite- 5.0ppm

Hardness (GH)- 150ppm

Alikalinity (KH)- 120-180ppm (the color was a mix)

pH- 7.8

I also got a 20 gal Wisper filter and put it in the tank in addition to my 10 gal filter (which doesn't do much) The lady at the pet store told me to stir up the rocks so that is what I did so that both filters can suck up the gunk!

I have heard so many diff opinions on weither or not to do a water change while meds are in the tank, that I think that I will just wait unless in dire need. I am to afraid of over-dosing with the meds when trying to redose the tank!

Please someone explain what my tanks levels mean and what to do next!

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Great you got the kits!!!

I mailed a Mod to come and help so hope one of the Mods will get to you soon. hang in there.

Meanwhile your water readings are very dangerous. They should be

Ammonia 0

Nitrite 0

Nitrates.25

Are you sure your nitrate is 5.0?

Or is that nitrite?

Anyway nitrites and ammonia must be 0.

You will have to do frequent water changes to get those readings down. I strongly suggest you do a 100% water change and check levels again before adding meds again.

PH looks okay.

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Nitrate is 20 ppm

Nitrite is 5.0 ppm

Also, I took the water levels after I stirrd up all of the rocks and there was alot of debris flying around. You could barely see through the water! I do not know if that would make a differance or not. Should I take them again?

How do I go about changing the water? Usually I put them in a tupperware container and do everything.

How do I properly clean the rocks? Nothing I do seems to leave them clean, I cannot get all of the gunk out of them. Should I just remove them for now???

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Sorry I replyed twice... I keep thinking that it is not going through!

The temp of the tank is 76-78 degrees F. Is this good? I do not have a lid on it nor a light. I took it off because the tank was like 80 degrres and staying that hot.

My tank also has some foam on the top of the water around the sides. Is this normal?

Thanks so much for all of your help everyone!!!!!!!!!

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Hi :)

There's a couple of things that stand out here:

1) the reason they're ailing may be due just to poor water

2) please don't add any more meds to your tank and try to remove the meds you currently have in there.

The reason?

Poor water can cause real stress to a fish and they will exhibit symptoms such as you have described. The only time to medicate is when water quality has been ruled out as a possible cause. So meds with a nitrite level of 5.0 could actually push a fish over the edge. Meds are there to work in conjunction with the immunity of a fish but the immunity needs a fighting chance to improve and the best way to do this is with excellent water. Bad water will lower the immunity and keep it lowered so that no amount of meds you use will do any good - they can infact have the opposite affect.

So in saying that, I would recommend:

- doing waterchanges until you see ammonia 0, nitrite 0 and nitrate anywhere <20 and continue to test until you see the water has stabilized.

- then once they have been in a much healthier environment, check for improvement - hopefully this will be all they need

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How much water do I change? 50-80%???? And how often??

Sorry for all of the questions! I really do not know what I am doing!

Thanks to all of you I am learning though....

I will do 50% water change now! Please get back to me! I will post the test results after!

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