Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
gumbo

Emergenceny-please Help Me!

Recommended Posts

Yes, bring your salinity down to nil before you treat with malachite green formalin. Goldfish don't take it well when salt and MG/F are being used together. I would say that you should change 75% now, 50% tomorrow and then tomorrow evening, start the mg/f along with salt dips.

Keep in mind that malachite green can be deactivated by strong light. So, don't let too much ambient light get to the water in the tank. If that means covering most of the tank with towels or something, by all means. But leave a small opening so that they can at least see a little bit. Dont let the towel droop into the water any or the water could slowly leech out of the tank via wick action (capillary action).

Good luck and I hope your successful with your treatment! :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, Goldfish Rocks, if you saw visable lesions, aka ulcers, that was a secondary from parasites involved sadly! Ulcers are bad news, Tricide neo and/or Antibiotic injections along with a medicated food. Sap can also add to problems with ulcers. Treated correctly, a fish does have a fighting chance there!

You can't overdose dimlin btw.

Mela is a catch 22, along with the prima. Both are stout products. Prima has a double edged sword as well. Prima fix is stout and goldies have shown bad reactions to it so we caution to start with a half dose if you really have to use it.

Mela on the other hand, tea tree oil. Oil can be a gill clogger. Nothing promoted to cover many things is as it should be, thats just too much.. LOL!

Is Mela a good product? Yes... Does it do all it claims? No. The key word is "antibacterial" .... One has to actually treat the problem first, then a follow up with mela is preventitive. But only when actually needed. Its good aiding wound's to heal, mild cases of white eye and it need not be used daily, every second day is good. Its rather like useing Neo sporin on a wound.

Goldfish are not really a cold water fish either, The larger ones can withstand winter temps, but the fancy's cannot.

As for heat, Sorry guy's, The fish' s immune system works at its best, peak @ 78* and thats a benifit when dealing with parasites and secondary infections to be fought off.... :D

Not trying to disagree with you Paul, but its what I've been taught by Doc J and Captk and the 'sperts. ;) Not that I alway's agree with some things mind you,lol!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This thead has gone around the garden path a few times and I would like to apologise to gumbo in advance for hijacking it further.

Goldfishrock, I really think that petstore has a lot to answer for. I wonder how many fish you have killed before you worked out what seems to worked okay? If the bucket-to-bucket experiment you are proposing on 6 sick fish is any guide then I'm really worried about your method. Just because the fish are sick and are free, it doesn't mean that they are some kind of object for experimentations.

Think about this for a minute, what you are advicing people to do will be done on their favourite pets. They might have it for years and is a member of their family. They are not disposables like what that petshop pass onto you. There is no second chance.

I agree that some of the knowledge you gained are valuable but the method by which they are obtained are questionable. There are lots more to fish health than just empirical observations.

There are lots more to learn. What about the physiology of a goldfish, their immune system, etc. Not to mention the fish tank as an ecosystem and all that entails. The bottomline is that we don't see curing a fish is the goal. We might prefer to stop a fish from getting sick in the first place. Handling a sick fish is an unfortunate situation that we have to tackle from time to time but with dread.

Yes, goldies immune response peaks at 78*F and more or less shuts down below 50*F. It is a cold water fish because it can survive cold water (under normal climatic condition and not in case of thermo shock) but it does not thrive in water below 60*F.

BTW, Prazipond dosage is 1gram for 100gal of water. It is not suitable for treating fish in an aquarium or bucket. No wonder you have problem dissolving it. :(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I won't add anything further by way of advice because you're in good hands so far with the three amigos (Paul, Kathy and Henry) ;) Good luck with your fish, gumbo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I started treatment with Maracide today and aww I feel so bad...poor Joey has to be locked up in this black box :cry1 I left the right side open for him to see out of but it is very dark and scary in there lol.

I don't want to take any chance of deactivating the MG. Is it ok if a little light seeps through cracks of the coverings? Also do you think Joey is scared? I don't know if you can answer that one but it is worth a shot :)

I haven't done any salt dips yet, should I just do one before adding next dosage?

Thanks again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest goldfishrock

Hi,

Sorry to hear about your fish! captk, I'll respond to your comments on the other post.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im sure Joey isn't liking it too much but I can't think of any treatments that are pleasurable. I'm sure he'll be fine. Yes, you can leave a bit of it open to let some light in, Just don't allow too much ambient sunlight shine in. Its a specific wavelength that destroys malachite green, not just any old light. Thats why the tanklights should be turned off and the tank covered from sunlight during the day. Believe it or not, goldfish have great vision and can actually see in a spectrum or to that humans cannot.

Make sure you can see him in there. You need to keep an eye on his movements and habits throughout the treatment. If you see him acting worse, it might be time to discontinue the treatment.

How large a fish are we talking here? Thats a big factor in salt dips. ;)

Post back soon. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He is about 3-3.5 inches from head to the end of his tail.

Can I do more than 1 round of this treatment? After the 5 days are up? If this treatment does not work will there be something else I can try afterwards?

He seems to be doing ok so far, just swimming around franticaly as usual :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, contrary to popular belief you can run QC for longer than even 5 days. But, that does have its risks. If this first 5 day treatment does not work, you'll know it within a coulpe days of stoppng medication. From there, you can go another round if need be. Then, I have a couple other ideas to work with. ;)

Well, I would say yes to a salt dip for at least 2 days of this treatment. Prefferably 3 dips total.

Paul

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have one question regarding salt dips, how come the fish goes limp and almost lifeless? Is this because it is suffocating or something? Are the salt dips painful?

Sorry had to ask!

Brittany

Edited by gumbo

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If a fish goes limp and lifeless, the dip has gone too far. You should watch closely for the fish looking as though it has had enough. Beginning to float to the surface on its side is one of the main things to watch for. In essence, their bodies can handle, very well, abrubt changes in salinity. Their osmoregulation is increased. However, their bodies can't handle it for prolonged times becasue their organs that control osmoregulation can only go into hyperdrive for short periods. After a while, its like scotty on star trek always says, "Capt! She can't take any more!" :lol:

I'm sure its somewhat stressful, but, if the rebound time and normal activity is resumed very shortly afterwards, it can't be all THAT stressful....... ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

OK! I think I am ready to do one tonight! I put a 1/2 a cup of aquarium salt per gallon. That would give me a .? % solution?? Just wanted to know that.

THANKS YOU SO MUCH tootless :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whoa, who, whoa! STOP!!!!!!!

Way Way Way to much salt........

You only want two tablespoons(6 tsp) per gl to reach 0.6% solution.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, for a 1.5% dip, 1/2 cup per gallon is spot on. ;)

Tam, I don't think gumbo meant that this was going to be the solution for the fish to stay in..... just a dip. :huh:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:rofl I'm so used to seeing 0.6 or 0.9% that scared the snot outa me... :rofl

I've never seen one that high though, got to be a quick dip then.. :blink:

Tryin ta give me grey hairs are ya? :rofl

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The salt dip went well. He stayed in the salted water for 3 minutes until I took him out. He never got to the state where he would not move if I poked him, but I did not want to go past 3 minutes since he is still a small fish.

I also finished up with the Maracide treatment and took down the coverings. He looks a little more relaxed, but thats about it.

I do not know whether he is still pooping white stringy poo or not bc I have yet to see him pooping. I have seen some normal poop floating around though. He still has a white dot on his top fin and one red vein in his tail. He is still diving in the corners and scratching the gravel and pacing back and forth. However, he does not yawn very much at all anymore.

The water params stayed consistently perfect through out treatment, which I am very happy about :)

All in all, the problem has not been ceased and I think I need to try something else. Until than I am going to do some waterchanges to remove medication and maybe a couple more salt dips.

So whats next? :lol:

Gumbo, on the other hand, is doing great! I think the PC worked very well on him. He is acting completely normal now and seems very happy :)

Thank you once again for sticking with me through out this, I am very grateful!

Brittany

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm, well, how about trying to treat them in a sterile container (without a cycled filter). It could be that the maracides effects were reduced very quickly with the amount of bio-matter in the cycled tank. 100% waterchanges each day will ensure that ANY rising ammonia levels will be depeted before it can harm your fish. Using ammo-lock, prime or amquel plus adds another layer of protection in that any possible ammonia will be detoxified before it can do any harm. Trust me, this is a very safe way to handle this.

Of course, you will have to completely sterilize their tank and filter and all their equipment before adding them back to the main tank. you can get a quick cycling done by using Bio-Spira. ;)

Whaddya think? :huh:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can do that.

So I should just buy a 10g rubbermaid container, put some prime and ammo-lock in, an aerator, cover and put Maracide in? I do not need a filter? Than do 100% waterchanges everyday and sterilize the main tank/recycle?

Is there another stronger medication available?

Joey has some signs of bacteria too: red vein and white poo. WIll Maracide have a chance of eliminating that as well?

Thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Actually, the red veins and white poo are indicative of stress caused by the parasite, not an internal bacterial infection. Since the causative agant here is parasites, the main thing to concentrate on is the parasites, not bacteria. Once the parasite is dessimated, any worries of bacterial infection will be too..... ;)

Yes, a ten gallon rubbermaid bin would work nicely. As for a different medication, since we don't know the parasite causing this, its a tough call as to what would work. I can tell you that I recently had great success in treating a goldfish with a protoan infection using Chloramine T. Its available here: http://www.pondrx.com/store/customer/produ...15&cat=1&page=1

If the maracide does not work in the sterile container, I would try Chloramine T next. Then, if that doesn't work, Potassium permanganate (bought at PondRX as well) could be tried. See, since we don't know the parasite involved, it complicates things and different meds are needed til a cure is found. That is why a microscope is such an important tool for treating parasites.

The rule of thumb is: Diagnose first, then treat. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh ok, it's caused by stress not neceassarily bacteria or parasite but by the stress of one or the other.

alright, well I am going to be doing the Maracide in the sterile container..I'll let you know how things go :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just have one quick question before I do this. My mom scared me by saying that she heard somewhere if a fish is put in a container where he/she can not see out of (not a clear container) than the fish could go blind. Is this true?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a little dilemna. Since I am doing a 100% water change everyday( container to container), how do I add the treatment. The directions correspond to keeping him in one tank. I am suppose to add the medication on day 1,3, and 5. WIthout doing any waterchanges, which means the previous medication I added would still be in the tank, know what I mean? When I put him in the new container of fresh water on day 2 do I just add one dose of the medication and than on day 3 add two doses? OR do I just add 1 dose every time I convert him to new container? I hope you understand my question.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry for the delay. :)

No, a fish will not go blind if it cannot see out the sides of a container. If that were true, all pondfish would be blind. ;)

As for the treatment regime, yes, every time you do a complete waterchange, you should add another full dose to the water. This way, the concentration fo the medication remians stable throughout the treatment.

Keep us posted, okay? :huh:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Alright, I'm really glad to hear that. I am on the last dose of medication= DAY 5.

I sterilized the container before I put him in since it had his old dirty water in it. I put just a dab of bleach on a cloth rubbed it around the container and rinsed it very thoroughly with hot water and let it dry in the sun. Still, I couldn't help but to be scared I may have not rinsed it well enough and was scared to put him in. He seems to be doing fine, are there any things to look for to make sure? Have there been any bad experiences from bleach when sterilizing a container and putting a fish in after? Just curious. He's doing fine I'm just paranoid :unsure: Thanks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hiya. :)

As long as you rinsed very well and let it dry in the sun afterwards, there shouldn't be any residual bleach left whatsoever. In fact, if you were to let a puddle of pure bleach to evaporate, all that is left is salt. Not exactly aquarium salt or table salt, but a harmless salt all the same. Regardless, a good rinsing and water with dechlorinator in it would destroy any residual bleach that might possibly be left behind. ;)

So, have you broken down your tank and sterilized everything? It would be best to go ahead and get a jump on that. Of course, re-cycling the tank with bio-spira should ensure that youhave a tank free of the parasite that was the original cause. Otherwise, adding your fish right back to the tank that has the parasite would re-infect your fish and you'd be back at square one again.

for sterilization, bleach and VERY hot water is ideal for doing the sterilization. Then, a REALLY good rinsing in hot water and a good drying session in the sun would have your tank and ALL the equipment ready for reuse.

Post back soon. :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...