Ranchu is fatter on one side of his body

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

Test Results for the Following: * Ammonia Level(Tank) 0.25-0.55 closer to the color for 0.55 ppm * Nitrite Level(Tank) 0.0 ppm * Nitrate level(Tank) 0.5 ppm * Ammonia Level(Tap) 2.0 ppm   * Nitrite Level(Tap) 0.0 ppm * Nitrate level(Tap) 10 ppm  * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) ph 8.0 ppm * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) ph 8.2 ppm Other Required Info: * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API test kit * Water temperature?76-78f * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 75 us gallons it’s been up and running for 3 ish years * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? Aqua clear hang on back filter for 70-100 gallons, also have pothos growing from the tank * How often do you change the water and how much? Weekly about 30-50% monthly 100%                                      Golly it took awhile to get that done!  My post is about my male ranchu Sumo, he is a very chubby guy but his sides are not very symmetrical anymore and he has been floating in place a lot making me think constipation, swim bladder, infection something but I figured I would get this out there and see if anyone knew more before I began further investigation and decided on a treatment plan. I’m not new to fish keeping so I’m confident in my ability but I am always learning new things and refer to this website often to read everything. I’ll try to get a picture in here as well. This isn’t a sudden onset I’ve noticed him getting fat for months now because well... that’s what well fed fish tend to do, I am treating him tentatively as if he is constipated with softer foods less pellets and more greens also I’ve now started a weekly fasting day. What are yalls thoughts on a lopsided bellied ranchu?

* How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? 5 days, 50% * How many fish in the tank and their size? 3 fish, two medium/ large ranchu 1 medium oranda/ryukin * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Seachem prime * What do you feed your fish and how often? Repashy soilent green, mix of pellets saki Hikari, new life spectrum, Aqueon goldfish pellets, spirulina, blood worms, brine shrimp, small cut green beans. All this is just their available food not my feeding regimen. * Any new fish added to the tank? No. Not since about a year now. * Any medications added to the tank? No * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank.Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. aquarium salt occasionally, every 2 months prazi round followed by water change, years back I used melafix for a different fish that’s now deceased, fed hex shield pellets for a 3 day period months back. This list doesn’t include quarantine tank treatment if that’s needed I can provide. * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? No * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? Occasional floating in place from my two ranchus, the one this post is about and my female the dropsy survivor, she of course will have issues for life due to the illness but her behavior is as normal as can be expected. The oranda/ryukin cross is very active.

Edited February 1, 2018 by GoldfishFINatics

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

Well... 3 days and no one seems to have anything to add so, maybe I should delete this? 

[FishyMandy 6,277]

Hi, sorry for the delay in an answer!

I'm getting you some help! Thanks for filling out the form!

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

6 hours ago, FishyMandy said:

Hi, sorry for the delay in an answer!

I'm getting you some help! Thanks for filling out the form!

Oh your good! I just figured maybe I needed to delete it cause everyone was probably thinking, there’s nothing really bad here what’s her point? Lol 

[mjfromga 1,784]

Looks abnormal to me. I suspect the fish is female. Might be a tumor. Can we get a top view of the fish? Hikari foods are linked to floating in these fish as well. Please remove them from the diet entirely. 

[Arctic Mama 3,626]

I have a fish who has something similar,  but in his case it seems to be a defective swim bladder (he lists to one side) and being easily prone to blockages.  Are you still seeing poop? How does the poop look (is it just casings, really large and long, etc?)

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

10 hours ago, mjfromga said:

Looks abnormal to me. I suspect the fish is female. Might be a tumor. Can we get a top view of the fish? Hikari foods are linked to floating in these fish as well. Please remove them from the diet entirely. 

Sumo is male, unless I am very wrong in which case I very well can be. I purchased him specifically because I wanted a male. I will bowl him and get some top views for you ASAP. Thanks for your help!

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

1 hour ago, Arctic Mama said:

I have a fish who has something similar,  but in his case it seems to be a defective swim bladder (he lists to one side) and being easily prone to blockages.  Are you still seeing poop? How does the poop look (is it just casings, really large and long, etc?)

I am assuming his swim bladder is an issue due to the floaty issues but this one has me stumped. I’ve been feeding only repashy gel and peas for about a week now because I worried over constipation so I have seen him pooping and they have form and color but they are rather large and his vent is swollen still. They aren’t long very short

[mjfromga 1,784]

Swollen vent, bulging belly on the right side specifically, and floating... Sounds like a female to me. Hard to be certain but probably holding some annoying eggs. Not much can be done if this is the case. There are various methods people use if there's an eggy female, but most aren't very effective and need much experience to work well. 

[shakaho 6,312]

We rarely see ammonia in a tank that has been running for 3 years.  I think you need to start by fixing your water quality.  Since you have ammonia in your tap water I would recommend not doing 100% water changes.  2ppm ammonia makes water toxic.  If your system had a good cycle, you wouldn't see any ammonia in the tank water for more than a few hours after a water change, so we need to look at your filtration.  

We recommend a filter that turns over 10X the tank volume per hour.  Your filter falls short of that, but many filters with a lower turnover keep ammonia and nitrite at zero.  Usually ammonia and or nitrite in the water of an established tank results from dirty filters or over-cleaned filters (particularly from replaced filter medium).  

How often do you clean your filter, and how do you clean it?

 

• "* What do you feed your fish and how often? Repashy soilent green, mix of pellets saki Hikari, new life spectrum, Aqueon goldfish pellets, spirulina, blood worms, brine shrimp, small cut green beans. All this is just their available food not my feeding regimen."

So  how much do you feed and how often?  The fish looks fat to me, and fat fish often become floaty.  You might try reducing the amount you feed and including some leafy green vegetables and/or duckweed which will clean out the gut and lower the calorie intake.

 

[koko 14,340]

8 hours ago, shakaho said:

We rarely see ammonia in a tank that has been running for 3 years.  I think you need to start by fixing your water quality.  Since you have ammonia in your tap water I would recommend not doing 100% water changes.  2ppm ammonia makes water toxic.  If your system had a good cycle, you wouldn't see any ammonia in the tank water for more than a few hours after a water change, so we need to look at your filtration.  

We recommend a filter that turns over 10X the tank volume per hour.  Your filter falls short of that, but many filters with a lower turnover keep ammonia and nitrite at zero.  Usually ammonia and or nitrite in the water of an established tank results from dirty filters or over-cleaned filters (particularly from replaced filter medium).  

How often do you clean your filter, and how do you clean it?

 

• "* What do you feed your fish and how often? Repashy soilent green, mix of pellets saki Hikari, new life spectrum, Aqueon goldfish pellets, spirulina, blood worms, brine shrimp, small cut green beans. All this is just their available food not my feeding regimen."

So  how much do you feed and how often?  The fish looks fat to me, and fat fish often become floaty.  You might try reducing the amount you feed and including some leafy green vegetables and/or duckweed which will clean out the gut and lower the calorie intake.

 

Great post  

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

12 hours ago, shakaho said:

We rarely see ammonia in a tank that has been running for 3 years.  I think you need to start by fixing your water quality.  Since you have ammonia in your tap water I would recommend not doing 100% water changes.  2ppm ammonia makes water toxic.  If your system had a good cycle, you wouldn't see any ammonia in the tank water for more than a few hours after a water change, so we need to look at your filtration.  

We recommend a filter that turns over 10X the tank volume per hour.  Your filter falls short of that, but many filters with a lower turnover keep ammonia and nitrite at zero.  Usually ammonia and or nitrite in the water of an established tank results from dirty filters or over-cleaned filters (particularly from replaced filter medium).  

How often do you clean your filter, and how do you clean it?

 

• "* What do you feed your fish and how often? Repashy soilent green, mix of pellets saki Hikari, new life spectrum, Aqueon goldfish pellets, spirulina, blood worms, brine shrimp, small cut green beans. All this is just their available food not my feeding regimen."

So  how much do you feed and how often?  The fish looks fat to me, and fat fish often become floaty.  You might try reducing the amount you feed and including some leafy green vegetables and/or duckweed which will clean out the gut and lower the calorie intake.

 

I did recently replace my filter media it was old and needed thrown out, i may be going through a cycle again (please no!) but I didn’t realize it would upset the balance as bad since I left the chamber itself dirty. if more filtration is needed that’s no problem at all I only removed the other one because the fish were being tumbled about when they went to one side of the tank and it bothered me lol, I am sure I have done something wrong here along the way so I appreciate y’all helping me to investigate it!

i usually rotate the food I feed and only feed about twice a day but I may need to feed less and hold off on all pellets for awhile since I’m over feeding and making him/her fat lol

example: pellets in the morning gel food at night, brine shrimp in the morning pellets at night, blood worms in the morning gel at night

i did recently change them to only gel and peas and once a day because of this issue

what would be a good weight loss regimen for a fish? Also I am doing some tank maintenance so I will have some top view pics later tonight 

thanks for everyone’s help with this!

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

17 hours ago, mjfromga said:

Swollen vent, bulging belly on the right side specifically, and floating... Sounds like a female to me. Hard to be certain but probably holding some annoying eggs. Not much can be done if this is the case. There are various methods people use if there's an eggy female, but most aren't very effective and need much experience to work well. 

Oh no! What do you mean by not very effective? And not much can be done?

[shakaho 6,312]

The best way to maintain your filter is to clean it when you do your weekly water changes.  Dump the dirty water, and rinse all of your filter medium in the used tank water.  Get vigorous with the sponges.  Dip them in the water and slap them hard against the inside of an empty bucket.  Repeat until the water coming out of them when you slap is clear.  the biomedium should be less dirty.  Just rinse the bags of biomedium by swishing them around in used tank water until they are gunk-free.  Rinse the muck out of the filter box and pipes and put everything back in place.

How long had the filter been running?  The AquaClear sponges usually last several years before they start to crumble.  I don't know anyone who has ever had ceramic biomedium break down.  This should last for decades,  So why do the filter manufacturers tell you to replace media frequently?  It might have something to do with the money they make selling replacement medium.

Since the majority of nitrifiers live in the filter medium, replacing the filter medium removes most of your nitrifiers.  Yes, your tank will have to recycle, but since you still have the nitrifiers that live on the walls of your tank, and on the hard surfaces of your filter,  it may only take a few weeks. 

Use Prime to protect your fish from the high ammonia.  When you change water, add 2X the dose of Prime recommended for your full tank volume.  The Prime will convert the highly toxic ammonia to the much safer ammonium.  This effect only lasts two days, so add that same dose to the tank every other day.  Your ammonia test reads ammonia plus ammonium, so you will not see a change in your ammonia reading from the Prime treatment.

You feed a lot of nutritious food, so to avoid obese fish, just cut the amount the amount you feed each time  in half -- "portion control".  

 

 

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

38 minutes ago, shakaho said:

The best way to maintain your filter is to clean it when you do your weekly water changes.  Dump the dirty water, and rinse all of your filter medium in the used tank water.  Get vigorous with the sponges.  Dip them in the water and slap them hard against the inside of an empty bucket.  Repeat until the water coming out of them when you slap is clear.  the biomedium should be less dirty.  Just rinse the bags of biomedium by swishing them around in used tank water until they are gunk-free.  Rinse the muck out of the filter box and pipes and put everything back in place.

How long had the filter been running?  The AquaClear sponges usually last several years before they start to crumble.  I don't know anyone who has ever had ceramic biomedium break down.  This should last for decades,  So why do the filter manufacturers tell you to replace media frequently?  It might have something to do with the money they make selling replacement medium.

Since the majority of nitrifiers live in the filter medium, replacing the filter medium removes most of your nitrifiers.  Yes, your tank will have to recycle, but since you still have the nitrifiers that live on the walls of your tank, and on the hard surfaces of your filter,  it may only take a few weeks. 

Use Prime to protect your fish from the high ammonia.  When you change water, add 2X the dose of Prime recommended for your full tank volume.  The Prime will convert the highly toxic ammonia to the much safer ammonium.  This effect only lasts two days, so add that same dose to the tank every other day.  Your ammonia test reads ammonia plus ammonium, so you will not see a change in your ammonia reading from the Prime treatment.

You feed a lot of nutritious food, so to avoid obese fish, just cut the amount the amount you feed each time  in half -- "portion control".  

 

 

I was under the impression I needed to replace all my media occasionally, I was Misinformed obviously... I don’t do it often but I thought that every few months I was supposed to. 

Okay so the swelling is worse and the tummy now feels gassy and full of air, I don’t like to handle my fish much so I only took a few pics I’ll post them here

im setting up the quarantine tank now as I type this because I fear I’m already dealing with something serious. My female ranchu is a dropsy survivor and by that we all know she will always have issues until the inevitable happens but she is looking sluggish again too. Something is definitely going on with my fish. I’m officially super worried now.

also I have not fed Today yet.

 

[mjfromga 1,784]

I don't know, I have "fat" fish and they don't float around all swim bladdery. They're also not oddly uneven like that. I do not think the problem is mere overfeeding. Not at all.

EDIT: Look at that fish... No way is this mere overfeeding. Also, I'm PRETTY sure it's a female. Check that, I'm REALLY sure it's female. I could be wrong, but I don't think so. 

Edited February 6, 2018 by mjfromga

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

Sorry! Also this filter has been running since I bought this tank. I used to have both it and my canister going but I chose to use the aqua clear when I stepped down the filter due to its easy access for cleaning 

[koko 14,340]

11 minutes ago, mjfromga said:

I don't know, I have "fat" fish and they don't float around all swim bladdery. They're also not oddly uneven like that. I do not think the problem is mere overfeeding. Not at all.

EDIT: Look at that fish... No way is this mere overfeeding. Also, I'm PRETTY sure it's a female. Check that, I'm REALLY sure it's female. I could be wrong, but I don't think so. 

I checked and checked and yup that fish is a girl and I believe she is egg bound

[mjfromga 1,784]

I believe so too Koko. Being so big on THAT side like that to me spells an egg bound female. The floating and vent also links with that. It doesn't look good at all. I have no experience with egg bound females. Confirmed cases of egg binding are sadly usually post mortem. There's never a way to be TOTALLY sure it's egg binding when the fish is alive. 

Hand stripping can help but if done wrong, it will kill the fish. I can't recommend it at all. A mature male fish can help, but it doesn't always help and I don't think she has a male fish anyway. I've heard of epsom salt and soggy rice (badly overcooked) fed to the fish helping with egg binding, but I cannot say if it works. 

Unfortunately I truly can't recommend anything. Egg binding isn't ultra common, but in fancies it usually doesn't end well from what I've seen. Put her in some warm water and see if she might release or absorb them. 

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

Aww man... well this sucks. It’s okay though guys I appreciate the help more than y’all know. I’ve had my round with just about everything and now I can add egg bound females to the list unfortunately. I’ll up the temp on the tank and let her be. I’m not comfortable trying to hand spawn her and I don’t think I could bring myself to do it. 

Its sad but hey atleast I know now and I can hopefully figure out how to prevent it. 

Does anyone here feel as though I should euthanize her? I don’t like the thought of her suffering she’s been one of my favorites for over a year or more now, it might be time to say goodbye to both her and my other one unfortunately 

[mjfromga 1,784]

If the fish is badly floating and seems as if it has no normal quality of life, then it may be best to euthanize her. In the case that we are wrong about the eggs and this is infection and that's fluid buildup, we wanted you to try medicating the fish first. Metronidazole is where I would start. 

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

3 hours ago, mjfromga said:

If the fish is badly floating and seems as if it has no normal quality of life, then it may be best to euthanize her. In the case that we are wrong about the eggs and this is infection and that's fluid buildup, we wanted you to try medicating the fish first. Metronidazole is where I would start. 

As of right now she’s still eating and swimming pretty normal, aside from her obvious issues and there will be moments when she floats in place and then she’s just sort of slowly making small laps back and forth. She won’t go by the filter because of the currents, I assume but tends to stay on the other half of the tank. She still gets little speed bursts when I do place food in the tank and rushes to beat the other two for a bite. Mornings are slow for all three of them, they are close to the bottom and it takes them a minute to “wake up” and get their little butts moving. This fish will stay close to the bottom longer than the other two in the a.m. though. This morning I noticed red stringy poo from her it wasn’t very much at all and I would have missed it if I hadn’t been looking so hard at her.

[koko 14,340]

4 hours ago, GoldfishFINatics said:

As of right now she’s still eating and swimming pretty normal, aside from her obvious issues and there will be moments when she floats in place and then she’s just sort of slowly making small laps back and forth. She won’t go by the filter because of the currents, I assume but tends to stay on the other half of the tank. She still gets little speed bursts when I do place food in the tank and rushes to beat the other two for a bite. Mornings are slow for all three of them, they are close to the bottom and it takes them a minute to “wake up” and get their little butts moving. This fish will stay close to the bottom longer than the other two in the a.m. though. This morning I noticed red stringy poo from her it wasn’t very much at all and I would have missed it if I hadn’t been looking so hard at her.

Red isn't good at all  sounds like something might have ruptured or she may have some kind of bacteria building.

Like MJ said I would go with Metro if you wanted to but other than that Not much you can do for egg bound. Maybe a shallow tub with duckweed and metro.  

[GoldfishFINatics 1]

1 hour ago, koko said:

Red isn't good at all  sounds like something might have ruptured or she may have some kind of bacteria building.

Like MJ said I would go with Metro if you wanted to but other than that Not much you can do for egg bound. Maybe a shallow tub with duckweed and metro.  

Thank you, I didn’t think that red was good at all I was sure I would find her dead at lunch today but she’s still swimming around. 

I kinda think I’m gonna go get some clove oil today I don’t know if it expires but my bottle has crust on the edges so I’m gonna just grab some more. 

I truly want to treat her and see her get better but it’s so advanced now and with the red poop I almost feel as if it’s cruel to put her through treatment and prolong the inevitable. I’m so on the fence about it, I have a tank set up ready for her but I don’t want to waste my meds and be cruel at the same time, I hope that doesn’t sound horrible.

if she was your fish what would you do? 

[FishyMandy 6,277]

The red doesnt sound  good at all.

 

Before that I would have been more inclined to try treating, now I think I would euth. 

Im sorry