Sinking fish/bottom sitting

[andry6]

Hello!  I'm back again with my problem fishy. Everything was fine until yesterday. I noticed my calico fantail sitting on the bottom of the tank. I immediately did a 100% water change because I noticed slight ammonia and nitrates. All other fish are behaving normally. Whenever I approach the tank she perks up and swims around, but when she stops, she sinks. She's interested in food.  I fed only peas yesterday and this morning. I noticed red spots on her belly this morning which I assume must be from bottom sitting.

https://youtu.be/lE1Lr5TTUrM 

Test Results for the Following:

• * Ammonia Level(Tank) 0
• * Nitrite Level(Tank) 0
• * Nitrate level(Tank) 0
• * Ammonia Level(Tap) 0
• * Nitrite Level(Tap) 0
• * Nitrate level(Tap) 0
• * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 7.6
• * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 7.6

Other Required Info:

• * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API Freshwater Master Test Kit
• * Water temperature? 75F
• * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 75 gallon - 2.5 years
• * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? two Aqueon 75
• * How often do you change the water and how much? 100% every 3 weeks or when water quality drops
• * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? 100% yesterday
• * How many fish in the tank and their size? 4 total. Two fancies (both 4" not including tail) and two common/comets (2.5" & 3" not including tail)
• * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Seachem Prime
• * What do you feed your fish and how often? Frozen blood worms, frozen brine shrimp, peas, rapashy soilent green, Paradigm herbivore. Once, sometimes twice a day. (I am not one to overfeed) Sometimes I even skip a day
• * Any new fish added to the tank? no
• * Any medications added to the tank? no
• * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. Prazipro yesterday as maintenance dose at 1 tsp/20 gallons.
• * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? not until this morning - red spots on belly (I assume from bottom sitting)
• * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? video attached. Normal behavior until yesterday. 

[koko]

When and how often do you dump the water from your HOB?

I would like you to stop feeding Gel food until this is fixed. That kind of food can fowl up a filter really fast and cause some other issues if the filter isn't kept really clean.

Do you have any Metro on hand? Also Garlic? 

 

I would be doing a 50% water change every week on that tank.

[andry6]

9 minutes ago, koko said:

When and how often do you dump the water from your HOB?

I would like you to stop feeding Gel food until this is fixed. That kind of food can fowl up a filter really fast and cause some other issues if the filter isn't kept really clean.

Do you have any Metro on hand? Also Garlic? 

I would be doing a 50% water change every week on that tank.

Yikes!  Probably not often enough! One of my HOB's is about a month old because the old one just quit on me one day. And the other one I completely cleaned about 6 months ago because we had a leak. I usually just pull the filters, ceramic rings, & sponges every water change and rinse them out really well, (with old tank water, of course) and wipe the front where the water comes out. Whenever I pulled the filters and emptied them, they always looked pretty clean so I stopped doing it. (Now I'm embarrassed to admit that)

I don't feed the gel food as often. The Herbiovore is not my favorite either because it's SUPER messy. 

I do have Metro-Med, but don't see an expiration date on it. I also have garlic (the kind in the jar in the fridge - is that what you mean?)

[DawnMichele]

Hope your goldfish feels better.

[andry6]

Here are a couple more videos (sorry about the constant focusing/re-focusing...I was trying to get a close up of her gills and my camera wanted to do its own thing!)

https://youtu.be/9I7R1U3IkVE

https://youtu.be/oJAfe9X0WCg

 

 

Edited September 17, 2017 by andry6
fix video link

[DawnMichele]

13 minutes ago, andry6 said:

Here are a couple more videos (sorry about the constant focusing/re-focusing...I was trying to get a close up of her gills and my camera wanted to do its own thing!)

https://youtu.be/9I7R1U3IkVE

https://youtu.be/oJAfe9X0WCg

 

 

The video is unavailable.

[andry6]

5 minutes ago, DawnMichele said:

The video is unavailable.

Oops! I thought I fixed it! Hopefully you can see them now

 

[DawnMichele]

54 minutes ago, andry6 said:

Oops! I thought I fixed it! Hopefully you can see them now

 

It works!!!!  

[koko]

4 hours ago, andry6 said:

Yikes!  Probably not often enough! One of my HOB's is about a month old because the old one just quit on me one day. And the other one I completely cleaned about 6 months ago because we had a leak. I usually just pull the filters, ceramic rings, & sponges every water change and rinse them out really well, (with old tank water, of course) and wipe the front where the water comes out. Whenever I pulled the filters and emptied them, they always looked pretty clean so I stopped doing it. (Now I'm embarrassed to admit that)

I would with every water change dump the water out of the HOB. I would suggest cleaning one filter out every water change, meaning clean the floss and stuff and dump the water out. Then next water change do the other filter  

4 hours ago, andry6 said:

I don't feed the gel food as often. The Herbiovore is not my favorite either because it's SUPER messy. 

That mess builds up in the filter and can cause issues if the filter isn't cleaned every week  or when you do a water change. If you do feed gel I suggest feed it in another container or turn off your filters till the food is gone. I do that for blood worms  

4 hours ago, andry6 said:

I do have Metro-Med, but don't see an expiration date on it. I also have garlic (the kind in the jar in the fridge - is that what you mean?)

Metro-Med the pellets would be long dead by now. Goldfish connection isn't there anymore so we have to do it differently.

So this tank and fish have never been Prazied before?

 

[koko]

If you haven't Prazied these fish I would do that.

I would also get the one fish put him in a 10gallon QT with filter. I would then treat him with General Cure API and Garlic soaked blood worms. 

[andry6]

3 minutes ago, koko said:

If you haven't Prazied these fish I would do that.

I would also get the one fish put him in a 10gallon QT with filter. I would then treat him with General Cure API and Garlic soaked blood worms. 

I usually use PraziPro (one dose at 1 tsp/20 gallons) once every 4 months or so just for maintenance.  I've done it to treat flukes, but that was ages ago and I forget the protocol.

[koko]

Round 1= Sunday: Big water change.  Add Prazi.

                 Thursday: Add Prazi

 

Round 2= Sunday:  Big water change.  Add Prazi

                 Thursday:  Add Prazi

Don't add salt unless you want to add .1% salt  

[andry6]

Thank you so much! She's in a QT now with the API General cure, and I fed her the garlic soaked blood worms. I already prazied the main tank yesterday, so I'll repeat on weds, and so on...stay tuned!

[koko]

1 hour ago, andry6 said:

Thank you so much! She's in a QT now with the API General cure, and I fed her the garlic soaked blood worms. I already prazied the main tank yesterday, so I'll repeat on weds, and so on...stay tuned!

Did she eat? 

[andry6]

2 hours ago, koko said:

Did she eat? 

Oh yes!  She's never lost interest in her food 

[shakaho]

Testing the tank water after a 100% water change gives you the parameters of your tap water.  Please read/reread our guidelines for heathy goldfish.  As Koko already mentioned, we recommend  a minimum water change of 50% weekly for a tank that provides at least 20 gallons per goldfish.  You have two huge fish in that aquarium.  A 4" standard length fancy goldfish has about the same mass as an 8 inch standard length comet/common.  Add on the tail and these become 12" long comet/commons.  Your little guys probably add up to one fish, but they have a lot of growth in them.

If one does 100% water changes these should occur weekly or more often to avoid shocking the fish by greatly changed water chemistry.  When you don't change water, you get a steady build up of nitrate, that can reach toxic levels for sensitive fish in three weeks.  The increase in nitrate reflects a similar build-up of total dissolved solids and total organics which may harm fish, but which you cannot easily measure. The pH usually changes as these chemicals build up. When you suddenly replace this chemically "dirty" water with nice clean tap water the fish may experience an initial shock reaction.  Sometimes people who rescue fish from filthy water find them getting sick and even dying when put in clean water.

Would you please do a daily test of ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH in the main tank for a week so we can see what happens chemically?

 

Edited September 18, 2017 by shakaho

[andry6]

5 hours ago, shakaho said:

Testing the tank water after a 100% water change gives you the parameters of your tap water.  Please read/reread our guidelines for heathy goldfish.  As Koko already mentioned, we recommend  a minimum water change of 50% weekly for a tank that provides at least 20 gallons per goldfish.  You have two huge fish in that aquarium.  A 4" standard length fancy goldfish has about the same mass as an 8 inch standard length comet/common.  Add on the tail and these become 12" long comet/commons.  Your little guys probably add up to one fish, but they have a lot of growth in them.

If one does 100% water changes these should occur weekly or more often to avoid shocking the fish by greatly changed water chemistry.  When you don't change water, you get a steady build up of nitrate, that can reach toxic levels for sensitive fish in three weeks.  The increase in nitrate reflects a similar build-up of total dissolved solids and total organics which may harm fish, but which you cannot easily measure. The pH usually changes as these chemicals build up. When you suddenly replace this chemically "dirty" water with nice clean tap water the fish may experience an initial shock reaction.  Sometimes people who rescue fish from filthy water find them getting sick and even dying when put in clean water.

Would you please do a daily test of ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH in the main tank for a week so we can see what happens chemically?

 

Thank you for that information.  I will definitely be doing 50% water changes weekly from now on!

today's results (2 days after 100% water change)   pH  - 7.6     ammonia - 0     nitrite - 0     nitrate - 0 

[andry6]

On ‎9‎/‎18‎/‎2017 at 6:53 PM, andry6 said:

Thank you for that information.  I will definitely be doing 50% water changes weekly from now on!

today's results (2 days after 100% water change)   pH  - 7.6     ammonia - 0     nitrite - 0     nitrate - 0 

4 days after 100% water change - still no change.  pH - 7.6   ammonia, nitrite, & nitrate all = 0

7 days and still no change.  I will be doing a 75% water change today and adding Prazipro again.

She's still sinking to the bottom of the tank and stays there except when she eats.  Can anyone tell me what might be wrong with her?  I figured that I was treating her for gill flukes, but I thought after a week she should be doing better by now.  I had one day in the middle of the week where she was a bit more active and I was feeling hopeful.  Today...not so much 

[koko]

2 hours ago, andry6 said:

4 days after 100% water change - still no change.  pH - 7.6   ammonia, nitrite, & nitrate all = 0

7 days and still no change.  I will be doing a 75% water change today and adding Prazipro again.

She's still sinking to the bottom of the tank and stays there except when she eats.  Can anyone tell me what might be wrong with her?  I figured that I was treating her for gill flukes, but I thought after a week she should be doing better by now.  I had one day in the middle of the week where she was a bit more active and I was feeling hopeful.  Today...not so much 

Okay I would like you to do one more thing for her. Find her some Duckweed, and let her munch on that only with garlic worms. This will help clean out her gut and give her some good nutrition. Im thinking she might have a swim bladder issue. Duckweed is an amazing food for fish.  

[andry6]

57 minutes ago, koko said:

Okay I would like you to do one more thing for her. Find her some Duckweed, and let her munch on that only with garlic worms. This will help clean out her gut and give her some good nutrition. Im thinking she might have a swim bladder issue. Duckweed is an amazing food for fish.  

Where do I get Duckweed? And can the other fish have it too? (sorry, I don't know anything about it)

The reason i ask is because I put her back in the main tank. She was acting better and was done with the API General Cure (two doses per the instructions on the box) and I'm treating the main tank for flukes also. The other fish aren't bothering her.

[shakaho]

http://www.ebay.com/bhp/duckweed

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Dlawngarden&field-keywords=duckweed

 

All of the fish will appreciate duckweed -- a very nutritious food.  You have to grow it in a separate tub, since the goldfish will eat it all very quickly if you try to keep it in the tank.  Feed the duckweed used fish tan water.

[andry6]

I found duckweed at a store near me - ( rmsaquaculture.com ). It was like a feeding frenzy! They love it!  I only bought a small amount so it looks like I'll be returning for more. 

She struggles to get to the top to eat it and immediately sinks back down to the bottom. Let's hope this helps her soon. 

[koko]

2 hours ago, andry6 said:

I found duckweed at a store near me - ( rmsaquaculture.com ). It was like a feeding frenzy! They love it!  I only bought a small amount so it looks like I'll be returning for more. 

She struggles to get to the top to eat it and immediately sinks back down to the bottom. Let's hope this helps her soon. 

Put her in a shallow container so she can eat as much as she can. Or a QT tank for a bit  

[shakaho]

A spacious, shallow container serves to get the fish swimming well.  Struggling to the top of an aquarium grabbing some food, then sinking does not contribute.  Lots of swimming area and a good supply of readily available food gets the fish to keep swimming, and the more they swim the better they swim.

[ChrissieA]

Hey how's it going? Any improvement??