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Bpanelli

Advice on white bump and bottom sitting please.

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Hi all -- hoping for some input/advice regarding some bumps on our fish and possible treatment.  She has started bottom sitting occasionally but daily and has some bumps that look similar to something that has surfaced in the past.  I'm hoping to get a jump on it if she needs medication before it gets too serious - but doesn't seem to serious at the moment.  She eats readily and is only bottom sitting occasionally but it's unusual behavior for this fish.  I recently set up a new tank and canister filter, transferring the previous filter media to the new filter and thinking there may have been a some recycling going on.

Pictures have been uploaded to photo bucket.  Link Here: http://s1302.photobucket.com/user/ameliafish/library/

The pics that are more yellowish are the older ones from the previous time something similar occurred.  The newer images are the ones where the fish looks more "orange".

All the details are below.  Please let me know of any other questions.

Thank so much for your help - this forum is such a great resource.!!

Brett

  •  
    • * Ammonia Level(Tank)  0.125 plus
    • * Nitrite Level(Tank) 0
    • * Nitrate level(Tank)  20 plus ppm ( between 20 and 40)
    • * Ammonia Level(Tap) .50
    • * Nitrite Level(Tap) 0
    • * Nitrate level(Tap) 5 ppm
    • * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) . PH = 8  KH= 6 drops  GH = 10 drops
    • * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines)   PH = 8  KH= 7 drops  GH = 8 drops
    • Other Required Info:
      • * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops?  API drops
      • * Water temperature?  72 
      • * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running?  30 gallons -- been running about 3 weeks with new canister filter but put all media from previous filter in canister.  The bump in question was present prior to the new set-up - but the bottom sitting is new within the last 5-7 days.
      • * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? 1 Eheim 3e canister approx 575 gph.
      • * How often do you change the water and how much? change every 3-4 days 35-50% water changes
  • * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? 3 days ago 35% - next change tomorrow.
  • * How many fish in the tank and their size? 1 Veiltail, 4.5 inches nose to to base of tail
  • * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Prime and or NovAqua
  • * What do you feed your fish and how often? Give the brand, type of food (sinking/floating pellets, gel food, steamed vegetable, etc.), and how frequently you feed each.  Omega One sinking pellets - 4-6 pellets per day.
  • * Any new fish added to the tank? No
  • * Any medications added to the tank? No
  • * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment.  MetroMeds for 10 days or so for similar looking problem about 1.5 years ago--the bumps opened up into thick white fluff.  The Metro Meds did take care of the problem at the time.
  • * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Just the bumps indicated and a couple of very small white spots.  Also a small "dug out"  looking spot next to the bigger bump. ( see picture with arrows)
  • * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? Periodic Bottom sitting only.  She's eating fine and and if she is bottom sitting, she perks up immediately when I approach the tank.
  •  
Edited by Bpanelli

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Hmm; if there have been no new plants, animals, or live food in the last two months I'd say it is unlikely it is viral, so I'm going to recommend we treat with a combo of gram positive and negative antibiotics.  I assume your metromeds are quite old now, but if we can combine Metronidazole with Furan-2 for a two week course I think we can knock it back.  

 

Do you have a quarantine readily available?  We will need a heater going as well, I'd like to treat this at 78 degrees to speed up the life cycle of whatever we are dealing with so the antibiotics have a better chance of taking it out in a shorter course. 

 

How long have the current course of bumps and bottom sitting been happening?  A few days?  A week?

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Hi Taryl,  Thank you for the reply and your help!  

The bumps have been apparent for maybe a few weeks-ish but one has grown over that time - although slowly.  I've just been watching them since she has been acting normally but then just in the last 5-7 days she's starting a bit of the bottom sitting now and then - which hasn't been usual for her.

I do have 2 QT tanks available - however (of course there is a "however") I have a new fish (2 weeks) in QT right now in the tank with the heater.  Would it be possible to treat the main tank or is it too much volume to be practical?  

As a side note.  I was planning on treating both fish with Prazi once the new fish is ready to go into the main tank.  The fish with bumps in question has never had a Prazi treatment so was thinking now would be a good time with the addition of another fish.  Any thoughts on best procedures here is of course welcome as well.

So My options at the moment might be...

1. Ween the heater off of the QT and use it in the main tank if the treatment you suggest wouldn't hurt the bio-filter and it's not too hard to treat the larger volume??

2. Switch the place of the fish:  New fish in main tank and use QT tank for this treatment.

3. Pull out an older 10 gal. tank I have and use it for another.

I do only have the one heater but feel like the new fish would be fine without it. 

If the main tank is free of fish for a bit, will the filter remain ok and intact or would I need to do something to keep it going?  Maybe a couple of food pellets or something?

 

Please let me know thoughts and I'll take care of it.  Thanks so much for your advice!!

Brett

 

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I'd just pull out the old ten gallon and remove the heater from quarantine, sterilize it in some bleach water, and run the meds in there.  Lower water volume will make it cheaper and it's also easier to keep clean without any substrate or biofilm going, which can actually interfere with the medication.

 

Definitely Prazi the fish.  I'd do that first, honestly.  No salt, just three rounds of prazi in qt before the antibiotics.  Do your newbies separately under the prazi and salt protocols though.

Courtesy of Lisa C Gold: 

Day 1: Big WC (100%), add Prazi. Make sure salt is at the appropriate concentration. This is the beginning of Round 1.

Day 2-4: 100% WC, add Prazi and salt
Day 5: 100% WC, replace salt, but do not add Prazi. This is the end of Round 1.
Day 6-9: 100% WC, replace salt, and add Prazi. This is the start of Round 2.
Day 10: 100% WC, replace salt, but do not add Prazi. This is the end of Round 2.

 

Same procedure without salt should suffice for this fish.  I think you can safely wait on the antibiotics to do prazi first but if behavior or symptoms worsen please let me know.

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Ok sounds good and will do...

You mentioned 3 rounds of Prazi but the protocols you pasted show to an end of round 2.  Does the Prazi need to continue further than what you show above?  i.e.; Day 11-14, then final water change?  Or is to the end of round 2 sufficient?

 

Thanks again!

Brett

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It's just an example, you can continue on in five day rounds.  Since this fish has never been prazi'd I'd like to do three, so fifteen total days in the same pattern.

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Thanks again Taryl.  I'll update once I get into the treatment.

Brett

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One last question...

Do you suggest I use the Metronidazole as a feed or just in the water?  I've never made a medicated gel food but I can if need be.

Thanks!

Brett

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Waterborne should be fine in this case :)

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