Fish I was paranoid about yesterday IS pineconing!

[Arctic Mama 3,624]

At this point also discontinue silver in the quarantine tank, as it can interact with antibiotics. It is safe with Epsom and aquarium salt but not any other treatments.

[misssmountain 67]

I'm sorry, I was hoping some of the other team would step up to help here because we are really busy right now at my place. However if you can be patient I will try to assist.

The kanaplex is a poor choice whenever swelling is present. If she is just pineconing in that one area I'd suspect a possible blockage or infection of one organ but not body wide. Instead I'd push the metro, Epsom, and feed only the oxytetracycline food for two weeks on all the meds. Please make sure you are feeding the fish by the instructions I posted on the last thread, because this has moved very quickly and we really need to full strength of those antibiotics to have the best chance of knocking this back. You will be okay to discontinue the kanaplex since we are using another similar antibiotic and in case the swelling is due to kidney or liver issues already I don't want to risk exacerbating it.

So treat as follows:

Remove all sodium chloride - never salt during dropsy unless specifically directed, it can make it worse quite quickly

Heat up to 78 degrees if she will tolerate it, move it slowly.

Daily 100% water changes

Dose 1/2 teaspoon Epsom per ten gallons each change, along with two measures of metro and 2% body weight of the fish in grams of oxytetracycline food each day, fed in the short burst method. Do NOT let that last one hang around in the water, or the medicine will be diluted quickly.

Improvement or an arresting of further swelling should be seen in four or five days if the treatment is working. When you get time can we have a new top view of the fish, as well as side view and belly shots? Thanks!

Thank you! I just have a quick second to check in here, but will update further tomorrow q. Will discontinue kanaplex at tomorrow's WC and proceed as you mentioned. I have not put any salt or silver in the QT, those are only in the main tank

[koko 14,335]

How are the fish in the main tank and how is the tank?

[misssmountain 67]

How are the fish in the main tank and how is the tank?

 

In the main tank, I have Large Marge, who is doing great, and Nacho, who just came out of QT. I am currently bleaching all of the decor and will put it back on Monday when I do a WC.

 

Honestly Nacho is not doing great...even before she showed symptoms of illness (which I of course just treated with meds), she really hasn't been herself for a while now She is still eating, but spends most of her time hanging out in the top corner of the tank. When I look at older photos of her when she was in her prime, I just feel like she is so frail and weak now. I hate saying it but I think it is time to say goodbye

[Arctic Mama 3,624]

Remind me - did we ever parasite treat nacho?

[misssmountain 67]

Remind me - did we ever parasite treat nacho?

Something like prazipro? Yes, she's been through several maintenance rounds before and a pretty intensive treatment a long time ago.

I'm just feeling like she's slowly going downhill, and since she's my old lady fish I'm hesitant to put her through more medications.

[koko 14,335]

 

Here is a pic of the weird foamy/floaty lotus things...

When where these added to the tank?

 

Do we have a full tank shot? .. Sorry drinking my coffee

[misssmountain 67]

 

Here is a pic of the weird foamy/floaty lotus things...

When where these added to the tank?

 

Do we have a full tank shot? .. Sorry drinking my coffee

Those have been in there for a year or so...I threw them away this past week. Full tank shot should be on the first page of this thread...

[mjfromga 1,784]

Sorry you're having trouble. I wanted to mention, several members have (moderately recently) complained of dropsy problems with fish from Coast Gem USA with fish lasting only weeks or a few months and then passing away from it. Most were I think wen growing breeds, too.

[misssmountain 67]

Sorry you're having trouble. I wanted to mention, several members have (moderately recently) complained of dropsy problems with fish from Coast Gem USA with fish lasting only weeks or a few months and then passing away from it. Most were I think wen growing breeds, too.

Yes! I got stormy along with a jumbo ranchu from them in December. About 3 weeks later, the ranchu had dropsy symptoms and passed the next day. They sent me a replacement -- exact same thing. I got another replacement -- EXACT same thing. The replacements were both orandas. The only difference with Stormy is that the other 3 were bottom sitting and stopped eating as soon as the pineconing/bloating started, and had passed by the next day. Stormy is still swimming around and loves to eat the medicated food. But, you did bring up a really good point. I wonder about this being a delayed reaction from something picked up from the supplier that may have been dormant?

ETA: I hope the silver knocks out any nasties that may have been related to all of this.

Edited August 14, 2016 by misssmountain

[misssmountain 67]

I'm sorry, I was hoping some of the other team would step up to help here because we are really busy right now at my place. However if you can be patient I will try to assist.

The kanaplex is a poor choice whenever swelling is present. If she is just pineconing in that one area I'd suspect a possible blockage or infection of one organ but not body wide. Instead I'd push the metro, Epsom, and feed only the oxytetracycline food for two weeks on all the meds. Please make sure you are feeding the fish by the instructions I posted on the last thread, because this has moved very quickly and we really need to full strength of those antibiotics to have the best chance of knocking this back. You will be okay to discontinue the kanaplex since we are using another similar antibiotic and in case the swelling is due to kidney or liver issues already I don't want to risk exacerbating it.

So treat as follows:

Remove all sodium chloride - never salt during dropsy unless specifically directed, it can make it worse quite quickly

Heat up to 78 degrees if she will tolerate it, move it slowly.

Daily 100% water changes

Dose 1/2 teaspoon Epsom per ten gallons each change, along with two measures of metro and 2% body weight of the fish in grams of oxytetracycline food each day, fed in the short burst method. Do NOT let that last one hang around in the water, or the medicine will be diluted quickly.

Improvement or an arresting of further swelling should be seen in four or five days if the treatment is working. When you get time can we have a new top view of the fish, as well as side view and belly shots? Thanks!

 

Alright, update and photos. So, she had gotten a bit worse from the initial photos I had posted. I followed your instructions on the Epsom, 2 measures of Metroplex, and am feeding the Oxytetra flakes exclusively. In the past day or so, she does look to have gotten a tiny bit better since getting worse (which I didn't take photos of -- sorry, it was a hectic weekend). Other than that, if she wasn't bloated, I would have no idea anything was wrong. She is still swimming around normally, and eating those flakes like a champ. She has been coming up to the surface and grabbing big clumps of them right out of my fingers. Maybe she was a dolphin in a past life.

 

Anyway, here are some pics (I forgot a belly shot, will get one in a few):

 

 

 

***Edited to add this belly shot:

 

 

She does look a bit paler, her brown spots are really standing out right now. But I'm really pulling for her.

 

(side note: we said goodbye to Nacho last night. Since going back in the main tank, she was just looking really weak and frail, and as my bf put it, she looked "crumpled." we found her stuck between the two filter intakes yesterday morning...surprisingly she wasn't injured too badly, but I just don't think she was strong enough anymore. Even before I did all of the medications, she was starting to show signs of slowing down. I know goldies can live a long time, but it did seem like she was just starting to get old, especially compared to older pics I have of her when she was really thriving. It had been a long time since I'd seen that fish I was still on the fence about what to do, and when I got home from work, I took one look at her and I just knew it was time. Thank you Nacho, for being an amazing fishy friend for nearly 2.5 years)

Edited August 15, 2016 by misssmountain

[Speckles 1,178]

Sorry nacho didn't make it

My best vibes to Stormy!!

[misssmountain 67]

Sorry nacho didn't make it

My best vibes to Stormy!!

Thank you!

[FishyMandy 6,272]

Sorry you lost Nacho

[LisaCGold 1,691]

I'm so sorry for your loss of Nacho. Rest in peace, dear Nacho!

[misssmountain 67]

Thank you all, Nacho will be missed for sure. She was such a sweet little fishy.

 

Arctic Mamma, what's your take on Stormy's photos? Is there anything else I should be doing for now?

[misssmountain 67]

Just checking in again with a quick update --

 

We are on day 5 of the meds, and she is looking great! I'm not calling it a victory yet (it ain't over 'til it's over!) but I'm feeling very optimistic. Still a tiny bit of prickling on the scales, but the bloating has made a significant improvement.

 

I will update with a photo later on when I change her water.

 

One interesting thing -- she has changed color almost completely in the past 5 days. She is now a silvery color with some brown spots (brown spots have always been there, they're just more visible now). I guess she's not so dark and stormy anymore, but as long as she gets better I of course don't care. She was probably due for a color change anyway

[misssmountain 67]

After 5 days of the meds. It is just me, or does she look better?

 

[Speckles 1,178]

[Arctic Mama 3,624]

She does look better, a little less swollen and prickly behind her gills. Keep it up and let me know if anything changes.

[misssmountain 67]

She does look better, a little less swollen and prickly behind her gills. Keep it up and let me know if anything changes.

Will do. Should I continue on at the 2 measures of metro and 1/2 tsp Epsom for my 10g?

[Arctic Mama 3,624]

She does look better, a little less swollen and prickly behind her gills. Keep it up and let me know if anything changes.

Will do. Should I continue on at the 2 measures of metro and 1/2 tsp Epsom for my 10g?

Yes, along with the oxy food.

You could test doing several days without the Epsom and see if the swelling has abated on its own, it's up to you.

[misssmountain 67]

She does look better, a little less swollen and prickly behind her gills. Keep it up and let me know if anything changes.

Will do. Should I continue on at the 2 measures of metro and 1/2 tsp Epsom for my 10g?

Yes, along with the oxy food.

You could test doing several days without the Epsom and see if the swelling has abated on its own, it's up to you.

Maybe I will try that in a couple of days once we've hit the week mark. And should I plan on 14 days with the metro? Just trying to get an idea of how to best move forward thank you for all of your advice!

[FishyMandy 6,272]

She is looking better! Hope it continues for you!

[Arctic Mama 3,624]

Yes, always two weeks on the metro. You can discontinue feeding the oxy at ten days out if the symptoms are gone and switch to duckweed or whatever pellet/soft food she likes, but the metro is a two weeks course.