Jump to content

Juvenile red cap oranda


Recommended Posts

  • Regular Member

Posting for a friend as he is having trouble joining...

Juvenile red cap oranda: active and interested in food when I’m at the tank and when I drop in food, but foraging has mostly stopped, fish will swim up to food but will not make strong effort to eat it, jaw/mouth seems to have collapsed and shows apparent atrophy. It is able to eat a little food when it softens and breaks into small pieces. For about a month it appeared to make strong efforts to open its mouth but seemed to not be able to do so.

Test Results for the Following:

* Ammonia Level(Tank) 0

* Nitrite Level(Tank) 0

* Nitrate level(Tank) 0

* Ammonia Level(Tap) 1 ppm (our tap uses chloramines)

* Nitrite Level(Tap) 0

* Nitrate level(Tap) 0

* Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) pH 7.6, KH 71.6 and GH 89.5

* Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) pH 8.3, KH 53.7 and GH 35.8

Other Required Info:

* Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API Freshwater Master Kit

* Water temperature? 77 Fahrenheit

* Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 10 US gallons

* What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? Aquaclear/Fluval 70, BioMax media, sponges, crushed coral used

* How often do you change the water and how much? 2 times a week, 60%

* How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? 2 days ago, 60%

* How many fish in the tank and their size? 1 juvenile red cap oranda, 1.5 inches long from mouth to tip of tail

* What kind of water additives or conditioners? Seachem Prime and PraziPro

* What do you feed your fish and how often? NLS pellets, romaine, spinach, cucumber rind - 3 times a day

* Any new fish added to the tank? only one fish

* Any medications added to the tank? Seachem Prime and PraziPro

* List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment.

May 10: fish arrives - purchased from Petco

May 13: behavior changes, foraging stops. small ulcer/pustule noticed near right eye

May 14 (just after midnight): ulcer/pustule enlarged, fish moved to QT tank. ulcer/pustule bursts during transfer. white thread first noticed before moving - later identified as an anchor worm

May 14 afternoon: gill cover, area where pustule was inflamed, eye begins to show infection around edges

May 15: entire surface of eye infected, treatment with Melafix and Pimafix begins, goes through approximately May 31st

May 16: eye hangs from socket

May 17: eye lost, gill cover almost lost. Anchor worm attached to wen of other fish purchased on May 10 identified

May 18: anchor worm that caused loss of eye removed

May 20: CyroPro treatment begins

May 21 and 23: additional anchor worms discovered and removed,

May 24 - June 18: normal foraging behavior, adjustment to using one eye progresses well

June 19 - July 14: fish barely able to open mouth, not able to eat food until broken down into tiny pieces. still very interested in food. appears to try to open mouth, but not able to do so.

June 20 -27: Dimilin X treatment

June 28: PraziPro and .3% salt treatment begins (other fish in main tank shows flukes on tail) - PraziPro ongoing, salt tapered off last week or so

July 14 - present: still active and interested in food when I’m at the tank and when I drop in food, but foraging has mostly stopped, fish will swim up to food but will not make strong effort to eat it, jaw/mouth seems to have collapsed and shows apparent atrophy. It is able to eat a little food when it softens and breaks into small pieces.

Before mouth stopped opening as normal:

Notice mouth no longer opens and appears to have collapsed:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Helper

Yes. He definitely need nutrition. Syringe feed him if he cannot eat well, but he needs to get food in before he wastes further. He will just get weaker otherwise.

Welcome to the forum, Andrew :)

Edited by Arctic Mama
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

hello Andrew,

 

welcome to kokos. if you want to try syringe feeding, it's a very simple task :)

 

here is my educational video on it. it will show you how to prepare syringe food and then exactly how to feed it.

 

 

best of luck to you and your fish.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

to be very honest. it's difficult to tell. the most obvious reasons are either primary infection like columnaris (but the visible signs for this bacteria is not present on your goldfish) or secondary infection with the primary reason being parasites such as flukes. just to name a few.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Admin

Hmm ok.  It doesn't seem like the PraziPro and salt bath have helped, I'm afraid.  Do you all think we would be able to rule out flukes then?

How long have you dont the prazi salt treatment.... it can take up to a month to do :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

i get to these entries in the post that offers information:

 

 

May 15: entire surface of eye infected, treatment with Melafix and Pimafix begins, goes through approximately May 31st

 

  • why was there no significant antibiotic used if there was such a noticeable sign of infection?

 

May 20: CyroPro treatment begins  - fish lice medicine.. will not help with anchor worm

 

 

 

June 28: PraziPro and .3% salt treatment begins (other fish in main tank shows flukes on tail) -

 

questions:

 

  • whilst you were treating with prazipro at .3% salt.. how much prazi were you adding? standard dose or double dose?
  • whilst you were treating with prazipro, was the treatment in the tank the entire time? or did you treat 4 days on/ 3 days off?
  • how many weeks did you treat prazipro?
  • how long was this fish in .2% salt or higher?

 

June 28: PraziPro and .3% salt treatment begins (other fish in main tank shows flukes on tail)

 

  • how was this determined?
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

 

i get to these entries in the post that offers information:

 

 

May 15: entire surface of eye infected, treatment with Melafix and Pimafix begins, goes through approximately May 31st

 

  • why was there no significant antibiotic used if there was such a noticeable sign of infection?

 

May 20: CyroPro treatment begins  - fish lice medicine.. will not help with anchor worm

 

 

 

June 28: PraziPro and .3% salt treatment begins (other fish in main tank shows flukes on tail) -

 

questions:

 

  • whilst you were treating with prazipro at .3% salt.. how much prazi were you adding? standard dose or double dose?
  • whilst you were treating with prazipro, was the treatment in the tank the entire time? or did you treat 4 days on/ 3 days off?
  • how many weeks did you treat prazipro?
  • how long was this fish in .2% salt or higher?

 

June 28: PraziPro and .3% salt treatment begins (other fish in main tank shows flukes on tail)

 

  • how was this determined?

 

 

 

Why was there no significant antibiotic used if there was such a noticeable sign of infection?

 

I didn't think that antibiotics purchased from a veternarian's office would be affordable for me (although I could be wrong), plus when I sought out advice from the Facebook groups that I'm in, all responses either indicated that I should use melafix/pimafix or euthanize the fish.

 

May 20: CyroPro treatment begins  - fish lice medicine.. will not help with anchor worm

 

Good to know.  Hikari does claim that it treats lernaea as well, and I think I did see on another forum someone recommend it.  http://www.hikariusa.com/solutions/healthaid/cyropro/

 

  • whilst you were treating with prazipro at .3% salt.. how much prazi were you adding? standard dose or double dose?

I have been using a double dose, mainly because it is difficult to pour a standard dose for a 10 US gallon tank.

  • whilst you were treating with prazipro, was the treatment in the tank the entire time? or did you treat 4 days on/ 3 days off?

The treatment has been continuous.

  • how many weeks did you treat prazipro?

The treatment has been continuous since June 28, so just under 4 weeks.

  • how long was this fish in .2% salt or higher?

Approximately 2 weeks.

 

June 28: PraziPro and .3% salt treatment begins (other fish in main tank shows flukes on tail)

 

  • how was this determined?

 

The other fish had white flecks on its tail that appeared to be embedded, and the edges were starting to fray.  I posted several photos in the Facebook groups that I'm in, and one person that works at an aquatics store said that they had seen it before, and that it was flukes.  The treatment appears to have worked.

 

What is the best way to insert photos into a post with a desktop on here?  I can show you before and after photos of the other fish.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

 

 

What is the best way to insert photos into a post with a desktop on here?  I can show you before and after photos of the other fish.

 

 

you can upload them to photobucket and post the direct link in your reply.

 

i will have to address the rest of your post tomorrow as it's 2:30am currently, and i need to get some sleep :) unless of course other members of the team are available to assist :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I was able to get the red cap to hand feed tonight with a syringe that had a little curvy thing on the end.  NLS pellets, blood worms... and spinach.  The spinach was a mistake.  It caused the curvy thing to get clogged, then food would come shooting out.  Oh well, I guess we learn through trying...  :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

That is one cute fish.  :teehee

 

Thanks for the pics.  It does look more flukey than ichy.  :rofl

 

So this fish has been in 0.3% salt and double dose prazi since June 28?  How often were you doing WCs at this time?  When you did WCs, how were you redosing the salt?  prazi?  (For example, if you did a 50% WC, did you replace 50% of the salt and the prazi or ?  :idont )

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

That is one cute fish.   :teehee

 

Thanks for the pics.  It does look more flukey than ichy.   :rofl

 

So this fish has been in 0.3% salt and double dose prazi since June 28?  How often were you doing WCs at this time?  When you did WCs, how were you redosing the salt?  prazi?  (For example, if you did a 50% WC, did you replace 50% of the salt and the prazi or ?   :idont )

 

 

Thanks!  The orange oranda is named Wiggles and will fixate on any humans near the tank and do the wiggle dance for them.

 

The red cap has had the Prazi cointinuously, but the salt I let taper off after a couple weeks.  WCs have been twice a week.  I was careful to only replace the salt I took out when I was doing salt.  Prazi I have been putting the standard amount in again rather than just 60%.  Would that harm the fish?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Hi Andrew :)  I have seen a couple of your posts on FB.  Wiggles is very sweet looking fish.  I hope she gets better soon!  You are definitely in good hands here :) 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...