Regular Member jenste Posted August 16, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 16, 2015 Sorry hun, wasn't sure if maybe it would help the stronger ones a bit if they weren't for a short time alongside others who have passed...Thought maybe some might not have it as bad as others....Hoping some pull through for you 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Hinfin Posted August 16, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 16, 2015 Sorry to say this...... But better to end it here. I have seen too many disformed fry that have been kept alive and to say you should keep feeding them is wrong! Better to humanely put them to rest, learn how to raise a good spawn without chemicals, it will take much time and effort for sure but i have done so with my fry eventually. I wish you well, remember they are what they are. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 16, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 16, 2015 (edited) They are not disformed, Hinfin. They have a fungal infection. Up until now, they have been raised without chemicals. The Methylene Blue is being used to treat the infection. The infection is what the fry have been succumbing to. I also know what they are. They are goldfish, just like any other goldfish. If they did not have the infection, they would be just fine, and grow into beautiful mini-versions of their parents. This is no noob-spawn. I have spawned fish before. They did pretty well. E2A: I know you're trying to be helpful and I agree that there's a chance I will euth if they don't get over the infection, but I wanted to make clear what I was doing and why I was doing it. Edited August 16, 2015 by ChelseaM 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporter FishyMandy Posted August 16, 2015 Supporter Share Posted August 16, 2015 Aw I'm so sorry this isnt working out. Good luck whatever happens 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 16, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 16, 2015 Thanks, Mandy. I do hope that the issue clears up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Hinfin Posted August 17, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 They are not disformed, Hinfin. They have a fungal infection. Up until now, they have been raised without chemicals. The Methylene Blue is being used to treat the infection. The infection is what the fry have been succumbing to. I also know what they are. They are goldfish, just like any other goldfish. If they did not have the infection, they would be just fine, and grow into beautiful mini-versions of their parents. This is no noob-spawn. I have spawned fish before. They did pretty well. E2A: I know you're trying to be helpful and I agree that there's a chance I will euth if they don't get over the infection, but I wanted to make clear what I was doing and why I was doing it. I am sorry i cant be more helpfull and you should read what i said as just my opinion. I hope you will succeed in treating them, but fry are extremely delicate which is all i wanted to say really. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Shahbazin Posted August 17, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 I hope some of them make it! Sorry to hear of all the losses. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helper Arctic Mama Posted August 17, 2015 Helper Share Posted August 17, 2015 Pictures would help us diagnose, if you have them. I'm wondering if it is saprolegna or something else, like flexibacter. Fungus is necrotic in its action, it doesn't usually cause deformity. Do you have access to high res photographs or microscopy? Also, have you reconsidered using copper or even formalin on them? It is harsh but in a bath situation it might knock back the pathogen enough to help the fry pull through. This is severe and it may be worth a shot if you're not quite ready to give up and euthanize? I'm so sorry for all your fry fighting this mystery illness. I'd be heartbroken. : 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helper Arctic Mama Posted August 17, 2015 Helper Share Posted August 17, 2015 (edited) Another treatment to consider might be Furan-2. Thinking out loud here. Edited August 17, 2015 by Arctic Mama 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member shakaho Posted August 17, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 Chelsea, are you sure this is fungus and not columnaris? Columnaris white spots look much like fungus. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Hinfin Posted August 17, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 I have often found a common water fungus(same as mildew i think) taking a liking to GF eggs but also as a secondary infection on the fry. That was during my ranchu spawn after which i upped the salt treatment of the water and the problem never came back. Anyway, if you dont have a microscope, get one! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 17, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 I do need a microscope. We are on our way out the door for our vacation right now, so I will unfortunately have to see who is alive when I get home. No, Sharon, I am not sure it's not columnaris. However it is a fuzzy fungus-like substance on them that did turn blue under the MB bath. So I have no idea. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 17, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 I did just discover that NO FRY DIED LAST NIGHT. so that's good. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member SweetMamaKaty Posted August 17, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 Yay! Enjoy your vacation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Blitz Posted August 17, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 17, 2015 Come on little fry! You can do it! Just hang in there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helper Arctic Mama Posted August 17, 2015 Helper Share Posted August 17, 2015 Chelsea, are you sure this is fungus and not columnaris? Columnaris white spots look much like fungus. With this rate of spread that was exactly my thought. But I'd need pictures to be sure. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 18, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 18, 2015 (edited) My question is that if it was Columnaris and I shared things between the pond and the tank, wouldn't my adult fish get Columnaris as well? They have been using a shared bucket this whole time and nothing has attacked the adult fish. Edited August 18, 2015 by ChelseaM 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helper Arctic Mama Posted August 18, 2015 Helper Share Posted August 18, 2015 They may, they may not. There are four differen strains of flexibacter (columnaris) and not all are equally virulent. Some have longer incubation times, lower mortality rates, and as with most pathogens it is opportunistic - if your adult fish are healthy they may have been carrying this at low levels for months without issue. Stress, injury, weak or new immune systems - all common vectors by which a pathogen takes hold and overcomes the host. Sharing equipment isn't a great idea with fry, but don't worry about that at this point. Lots of people get away with it without issue. Pictures of the fish, especially the currently afflicted and newly deceased, would be a huge help. It could be saprolegna, but that's extremely unlikely to survive meth blue treatment and travel among the stock so rapidly. But saprolegna and flexibacter look extremely similar at first - with the latter tending to favor better aerated, low mineral cation water supply. Saprolegna, like aeromonas/pseudomonas, seems to take hold due to high bio loads and low oxygenation and agitation. Those are generalities, but they seem to hold true most of the time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 18, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 18, 2015 I would think that from what you're describing it is Saprolegna. But we will see when I get back if any fry are left to save. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member shakaho Posted August 18, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 18, 2015 I had columnaris in fry 3 years ago. I left on a two week trip with two large tanks of healthy fry mostly 2 to 4 months old. My husband took care of the fish. The one thing I didn't tell him was to check for any dead fish and remove them. When I got back there were about half as many babies and a lot of them were not looking so good. I probably lost about 75% of the babies (including just about all of the wakin I wanted to keep) and no adult had symptoms. I've read that the disease spreads by fish nibbling on the lesions of sick or dead fish. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 21, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 21, 2015 Two surviving fry with NO signs of infection in either. I guess it puttered out on its own. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member shakaho Posted August 21, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 21, 2015 Welcome back! It sounds like you have some little survivors. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member DieselPlower Posted August 21, 2015 Regular Member Share Posted August 21, 2015 Oh no! 2 left?! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helper Arctic Mama Posted August 21, 2015 Helper Share Posted August 21, 2015 I'd strongly recommend upping the salt to .3%, keeping heat down, and using the a Furan-2 anyway. It will inhibit any further spread if it is columnaris and is a good move for dealing with saprolegna, if that is what you are fighting, too. It won't hurt, it can only help. I'm glad they weren't entirely wiped out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member GoldenSpoiledRotten Posted August 21, 2015 Author Regular Member Share Posted August 21, 2015 I don't have a way to get any Furan-2 at the moment. Lack of funds due to moving to college right now. and with them being outside, I can't control the heat either. Yeah, they definitely are little survivors. I wasn't expecting any. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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