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How long a bubble wall for Aquael Oxypro 150 Air Pump?


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Hi,

 

My second Aquael Oxypro 150 Air Pump came today for the 220L tank.  It is really quiet which is great.

 

I wanted to put a lot of bubbles up one end of the tank, and have the other end bubble free so that it doesn't interfere with the skimmer on the canister filter intake.  So I was thinking of getting two bendable bubble walls and putting them both up the end of the tank with the filter outlet.  This means the water has to pass through the mass wall of bubbles before it can get back up to the other end of the tank to be filtered again.

 

So two questions-

 

  1. How long a bubble wall will a Aquael Oxypro 150 Air Pump run?
  2. Will the bubble wall act as a little bit of a buffer for the current from the outlet of the canister filter?  It is just a little too strong for my little 5g baby at the moment.

TANK%20BUBBLES_zpsctckq5f6.jpg

 

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Its ok, I think I might have solved the buffering problem today by buying a fake grass matt to put around the outlet and buffer somewhat.  Hopefully that will work, and ill just add 2 more air stones to the tank. 

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Ree since you've been here before

My tank will be 220 L as well

I am starting off with an aquaclear 110 while I cycle, and then take a call as to what my 2nd filter will be

Totally unsure about the air pump, will the one above do?

Obviously need one that is strong enough

and was thinking about putting a flexible air curtain 90cm perhaps

Awaiting your advice cheers

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Ree since you've been here before

My tank will be 220 L as well

I am starting off with an aquaclear 110 while I cycle, and then take a call as to what my 2nd filter will be

Totally unsure about the air pump, will the one above do?

Obviously need one that is strong enough

and was thinking about putting a flexible air curtain 90cm perhaps

Awaiting your advice cheers

 

Hi docians!

 

I have 2 Aquael Oxypro 150 Air Pumps ( http://www.thetechden.com.au/Aquael_Oxypro_150_Air_Pump_p/112453.htm ) running 4 air stones in my tank. 

The Aquael Oxypro 150 doesn't seem to be super powerful, hence me purchasing two for this tank, but it is super super super quiet.  So quiet if I turn off all the other equipment, I cant hear the Aquael air pump running.

 

I found that the two Aquael Oxypro 150 Air Pumps joined with one of these ( http://www.thetechden.com.au/Metal_Air_Divider_Manifold_4_X_4mm_p/ed04.htm ), so that is one air pump goes in either end, and then you can have the option of up to four air stones running at once.  I tried other dividers, and they all leaked, but this one is brilliant!  And hopefully will last for ages! 

 

My other alternate plan was to get a air curtain, one that I could plug the pumps one into each end to make sure the bubbles went along the entire length.  I couldn't find out about the air curtain :no: as I didn't get any responses, so I am not sure about that one.  Let me know if you find out!

 

 

Just a couple of tips I found out the hard way...

 

This type of airline I found better than a lot of others ( http://www.thetechden.com.au/Silicon_Airline_by_the_Meter_p/tubing1m.htm ).  Others stretched over the air fitting lugs, but didn't contract again on the other side (hope that makes some sense) and so I would get air leaks all the time.  They were quite hard.  This one is relatively soft, and I found that if you cut a nice neat clean straight cut and heat the end of the airline in a mug of really hot water before you slide it on the lug as far as it will go, it shrinks around the lug and I get a good seal. 

 

Also I have had an Eheim Adjustable Air Pump 3704 with Hose & Diffuser (2 x 200L/h) ( http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/eheim-adjustable-air-pump-3704-with-hose-and-diffuser-2-x-200l-h.html ) and found it was slightly nosier than the Aquael, but boy did it pump out the air!  The reason I changed to the Aquael was:

 

1. the noise (the air pumps are 600mm from the head of my bed), and

 

2. the lug broke off one of the sides of the pump as I was removing airline.   It was only about 8 weeks old.  Now I am gentle, so it must have been a flaw in the plastic (I am not saying that all of them will be like this... just that I got the lucky one that did break!).  It did however mean that I had an air pump with two pumps in one, and could only use one side, but both sides run, you cant turn one off.  That's the reason I went with the two separate pumps, if one dies, I don't have to return them both, and have no air stones running in my tank.

 

Oh, and you probably know this, but you will need to make sure you have a quality check valve inline between the air pump and the divider or air curtain depending on which way you decide to go.  I usually install 2 if possible just to be on the safe side.  I don't want any water syphoning up the airline into my pumps!

 

I hope all of that makes some sense?  Just let me know if you have any questions about what I have said... sometimes I waffle and it just comes out as jibberish!  :hi

Edited by Ree
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Hey Ree

I've just watched tithra's video ( green mountain goldfish)

She uses an air pump callers tetra whisper

This is connected to the air stone/ aircurtain with a check valve in between

These whispers are rated upto 100gal tanks, see eBay Australia

Don't know yet if it is available locally

Others eg

http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/aquatopia-silent-pro-air-pump-004-600-800l.html

Are rated 600-800 litres

So on watching tithra's video and getting one of those pumps I think we could run a 120cm aircurtain

Eg http://www.guppysaquariumproducts.com.au/48-120cm-bendable-bubble-wall-air-curtain.html

Now this is what I theoretically conclude

I am yet to buy my first aquarium so I could be talking nonsense :)

Thanks for the tip on airline tubing

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Hey Ree

I've just watched tithra's video ( green mountain goldfish)

She uses an air pump callers tetra whisper

This is connected to the air stone/ aircurtain with a check valve in between

These whispers are rated upto 100gal tanks, see eBay Australia

Don't know yet if it is available locally

Others eg

http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/aquatopia-silent-pro-air-pump-004-600-800l.html

Are rated 600-800 litres

So on watching tithra's video and getting one of those pumps I think we could run a 120cm aircurtain

Eg http://www.guppysaquariumproducts.com.au/48-120cm-bendable-bubble-wall-air-curtain.html

Now this is what I theoretically conclude

I am yet to buy my first aquarium so I could be talking nonsense :)

Thanks for the tip on airline tubing

 

Don't be afraid to talk nonsense to me!  :teehee   I have trouble with all the scientific stuff and the workings out of things. 

 

The Aquael is 150L/Hr so that is 2.5L/min... is that right? 

 

So one Auquael pump draws 2W and outputs 2.5L/min; and the Aquatopia (8W) is the same 2.5L/min in each of its 4 outlets. 

 

So do you reckon we could run 1.2m air curtain from two of the 2.5L/min outlets?  Is that what you mean?  Me is having a brain dead day today :help: , so tell me if I am right or not... I wont mind one bit if you correct me.

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Docians, Can you see what the ratings of the Tetra whisper pumps are output L/hr or L/min?  I can only find information that they say they are suitable for 'x' many gallons.... nothing about the actual specifications for the output.  That might give me a better idea based on the same pump she is using.

 

I did find one that ships to Aust for you, but it doesn't say which plug it has...

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Tetra-Usa-Inc-Whisper-100-Air-Pump-100-Gallons-/271833118857?_trksid=p2141725.m3641.l6368

 

I just know with my Aquaels I have to have the pressure balanced perfectly, or it wont run all four air stones...  Maybe just because at the moment one of my air stones is broken and just pouring bubbles out (so I have it switched off), but even with it switched off I have to balance the air perfectly for the remaining 3 to work.  I have to do a WC on the main tank tomorrow, so I will see if I can replace the air stone.. if I have a spare?  (I think I just used it in my QT)  That might give me a better idea.  Ill try to video it for you so you can see the output, and then you can decide if you feel you need a bigger air pump. 

 

If you live in an area where it gets very hot, and you don't run the air conditioner (like me... don't have one :crying: ) then the extra bubbles are a bonus.  Hot water contains less oxygen... and also more bubbles cool the water better...  I have a spare Aquael which I use for my QT so I can add it to my main tank if needed during hot spells, if the QT is not being used.

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Hey Ree

Is there a way to see a picture of your tank

Trying to figure out why you need four stones (to me it is simpler to use an air curtain say 120 cm)

 

Perhaps I would go for

http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/aquatopia-silent-pro-air-pump-004-600-800l.html

This particular one is rated for upto 800 L

plenty for a 60 gallon tank

 

also I suppose we could adjust the flow rate with a flow valve

 

 

and run one air curtain 120 cm that should supply O2 bubbles to the entire length of the tank

rather than four air stones

or am I missing something :)

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Hey Ree

Is there a way to see a picture of your tank

Trying to figure out why you need four stones (to me it is simpler to use an air curtain say 120 cm)

 

Perhaps I would go for

http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/aquatopia-silent-pro-air-pump-004-600-800l.html

This particular one is rated for upto 800 L

plenty for a 60 gallon tank

 

also I suppose we could adjust the flow rate with a flow valve

 

 

and run one air curtain 120 cm that should supply O2 bubbles to the entire length of the tank

rather than four air stones

or am I missing something :)

 

No docians, Its ok.  I don't know if I need four air stones, its just how many I am running at the moment.  When it gets towards summer though it gets very hot in our little house, so I will need the extra bubbles then to reduce the water temperature.  The air temperature gets up to 37 degrees Celsius plus in our little house in the summer.  Way too hot for my little gold fish!

 

Here is my lovely little tank...  We live in a bed sitter while we try to save for a house deposit.  The whole floor area is 7m by 3.5m, so all our spaces have to double up as multi use areas. 

 

Here is the front of the tank, what you see when you walk in the door...  You can see pOdge in the middle, and Louie is the tiny black fish over to the far right.

SANY0877%202_zpsi5q3oypx.jpg

 

And here is the other side of the tank...  Sorry about the messy cords, I still have to organise all of them!  My cat is fortunately hiding most of the mess... Thankyou Fud!  :teehee

SANY0873%202_zpslkb89dnt.jpg

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I actually have to redo the tank layout.  I've done a thread on it here so I could get peoples opinions on where to put the air stones or air curtain.  I have a little fish, well, he has a little head and a bulbous body, and he is hurting himself because the thinks his body will fit where his head will.  Unfortunately, he hasn't realised the load he is carrying behind that head...

 

This is what I mean, excuse the red boxes, these were photos from a D&D thread...

06.03.15%20hugs_zpskpxnxxql.jpg

06.03.15%20slime_zpsbx5laks9.jpg

 

This is the thread here about redoing the tank layout....http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/121856-where-to-put-the-airstones-for-best-circulation/?view=getnewpost

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just let me know if you have any questions a  :hi

 

Hey Ree

these may sound like  silly questions but here goes

 

1.how do you keep the floor of your barebottom tank clean?

Do you let your filter work its magic or do you have to use additional equipment?

 

2. what equipment do you use for water changes (apart from buckets)

 

3. appreciate any information you want to share on plants

 

Sorry to hijack your thread like that, but when I saw your tank pics, I had to ask

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just let me know if you have any questions a  :hi

 

Hey Ree

these may sound like  silly questions but here goes

 

1.how do you keep the floor of your barebottom tank clean?

Do you let your filter work its magic or do you have to use additional equipment?

 

2. what equipment do you use for water changes (apart from buckets)

 

3. appreciate any information you want to share on plants

 

Sorry to hijack your thread like that, but when I saw your tank pics, I had to ask

 

 

No, Don't worry about that docians, there was no one else replying to this thread anyway, so no one will get confused...

 

 

1.  Cleaning the bottom of the tank...

 

This is my filter.... http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/131247811389?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

I layer it from the bottom up with:

            * the bottom tray has these sponges cut to size and layered bottom up from coarsest to finest http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/181408253159?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT            

            * multiple layers of filter floss then a layer of superfine floss in the second tray

            * then the top two trays have this bio media http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/231559404498?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT  I needed a minimum of 2kg for this, I could have done with 3kg to fill the trays.  It is a little more expensive than most biomedia, but it is supposed to be amazing stuff, has great surface area, has minerals to support beneficial bacteria, and last for ages and ages and ages...

You can see about it here....

 

 

Mostly the filter removes any debris from the bottom of the tank within about 2hours of it being deposited there.  This means that just to make sure its all nice and clean I give the tank a thorough scrub with this http://www.thetechden.com.au/Medium_Aquarium_Scraper_p/ar15.htm about an hour before I do a WC, and if I notice its getting a little grubby I might give it a scrub mid week as well with the algae scrubber, or just rub my hand along the bottom, but its not usually needed... so far. 

 

I like the bare bottom as it means I can see if my fish are constipated or not.  Also it is heaps easier to keep clean than gravel.  I also have my little pOdge to consider.  He kinda has a 'chest' which he tends to drag along the bottom of the tank when he is feeding.  I think if I added anything rough to the tank bottom he might end up with gravel rash and then maybe infections.

 

I was hoping to be able to have a Bristlenose Pleco in the tank with my fish, but because pOdge bottom sits some of the time, it has been recommended I don't in case the BN pleco decides to snack on pOdge's slime coat.  BN plecos don't usually do this if a fish is active or not sitting on the bottom.  In all fairness BN plecos are amazing for cleaning the surfaces in the aquarium, and I would definitely have one if I could.  The tank would stay spotless on its own.  Mine will have to stay in the tropical tank with the tropical fish.  I'm sure they wont mind!  They are hilarious to watch skimming over the glass... they kind of look like an opera singer strutting their stuff.... or a puppet off the Muppets. :lol

 

 

2. Water changes (WC)...

 

For water changes, I was having a great deal of difficulty.  I have chronic severe back pain which means I am bed ridden most of the time, so we had to design a way of making the water changes as easy as possible... ie. limited use of buckets!  We looked into getting a python, but we don't have any taps in the house we could use, and we don't have any taps over a large enough water catchment (ie we don't have a bath tub, only a shower, and only a small kitchen sink) to allow for the python. 

 

So my WC system is as follows:

 

Half hour to hour before WC scrub tank surfaces with algae scrubbing tool thing above.  Fish are always fascinated with this part of the experience... don't know why???  The water will get mucky, but most of the debris will settle again or be sucked into the filter.  I also rub my hands over any ornaments, pipes etc to clean any biofilm build up off.  Basically all surfaces get cleaned.  Take a water sample and test it here.

 

Some people leave their fish in the tank during the whole procedure, but I don't as I am scared of sucking them into the syphon... and too I have to refill with only water from the cold water tap... don't want to shock the pants off the poor baby's... so I take them out and put them in a holding tank and feed them NSL algae gel as a treat.  Messes the water up but that doesn't matter in the holding tank, and also they LOVE it.  :happydance  It also keeps them used to me handling them and then if they are injured or sick its not so stressful for me to have to move them.  Others may not agree with this, or do it differently, its just what I do.  I don't net them, just pick them up very carefully in my hands.  Oh, and I fill the holding tank first with water from the main tank so there are no shocks there.

 

I turn the filter off now and the air pumps.

 

Then I bought the largest syphon I could find.... like this one http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5-Inch-Gravel-Cleaner-Vac-Aquarium-Fish-Tank-Syphon-Vacuum-Penn-Plax-/251288486816?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3a81f603a0... and I submerge the whole thing under water, then put my thumb over the small end of the hose, and take it out of the tank, and.... here is the cheat... put the end of the hose into the end of a piece of spare pvc pipe... might be 90mm, not sure, but doesn't matter what size, the pipe rests on top of a bucket inside, pokes out the door, and drains the tank onto the lawn.... yay no buckets!!!!  I use the large end to vacuum up any debris left on the bottom of the tank.

 

Then to fill, I have a garden hose which is dedicated only to the fish, and I connect it up to the garden tap and fill the tank.  Then I add a bucket (again the 20L bucket I have is dedicated only to the main fish tank, and gets disinfected after every use, esp while I am QTing fish... don't want any accidental cross contamination... I already learnt that the hard way!) and I add some warm water to match the temp of the holding tank water (or I should say my beautiful Hubby does this bit for me).  Then I test ph and adjust if needed (I usually don't have a problem here, my ph from the tap is very stable at 8.2-8.4).

 

Then I turn the filter on, and the air pump. 

 

Once the tank ph and temp are right, I add some of the water from the tank to the holding tank, just to reduce any possible shock, leave for 5-10 min, then carefully put the baby's back into their home.  I do this by hand again.  This way they are happy, they have had a yummy treat, and I am happy, their tank is nice and clean.

 

Lastly I wipe over the outside of the tank with a clean dry cloth to make sure no water marks are on the glass.  You can also use a little vinegar for this, but make sure you don't get any in the tank.

 

That's it!  That is as easy and as cheaply as I could make it for the moment.

 

 

3.  Plants...

 

Ok... Ill let you in on my plant secret.... promise not to tell hey??? :whisper   The secret is to buy the toughest plant variety you can find.... :whistle

 

here

http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/fauna-anubias-medium.html

 

here

http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/fauna-anubias-large.html

 

and here... though this one didn't stay together for too long...

http://www.aquaticsupplies.com.au/fauna-twin-lace-fern.html

 

Also when you are buying plants and ornaments, you need to consider your fish.  If you have fish with telescope eyes or bubble eyes, or a pearlscale, you need to make sure any ornaments/plants don't have any rough or sharp edges.  Telescope eyed fish don't tend to see well and bump into things a lot.  They bump their eyes on things a lot too, and if they end up wounded and infected, they can loose an eye, or worse still die.  So I just try to keep it all soft/smooth so they don't do too much damage.  Pearlscales also bump into things a lot, and if they knock their beautiful domed pearl scales off, they don't grow back as pearl scales, just as normal flat scales.

 

 

Just keep in mind that I am new at all of this too.  I am learning as I go.  I have only been on Kokos for maybe 3-4 months, and I have only had my tank and goldfish for 2-3 months, so there are a lot of people out there who are much more experienced than I am, and might be able to advise you better, or give alternate solutions/ideas. 

 

That's the end of my waffle for today... I hope its understandable... like I said, I tend to waffle... sorry!  :doh11:

Edited by Ree
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Back too sore to sleep, and just had a thought.  I don't know if I mentioned food to you before?  This is just my experience, so it may not apply to your situation, just thought I would mention it.

 

I tried a lot of different foods for my fish in the first few weeks... wasted a lot of money.  I have a floaty fish (pOdge would you believe? :wall , just as well he is so darn cute and personable :wub: ) and most of the foods didn't agree with him. 

 

I discovered that any foods with large amounts of any cereals, or air make him float away... :bubbles

 

Also I found a lot of the flakes made my fish surface gulp a lot, which can lead to floating/swim bladder issues in some fish.  If using flakes, I found pre-soaking them helped reduce the surface gulping, but not enough for pOdge.  It means the fish aren't trained to expect to eat food off the surface of the water, the food sinks to the bottom and they feed there or mid water column.  I do feed flakes, Nutridiet Chlorella flakes, but only as an occasional treat.  The surface gulping was remarkably reduced with the food below. 

 

I have found this food to be really really good.  Its New Life Spectrum Thera A+.  It is small enough for small fish to eat, 1mm pellet (I think it also comes in larger pellets too), and they seem to really like it.  It is has all sorts of vitamins, minerals, and other immune goodies, as well as fruit, vegies and fish meals.  You only need a very small amount too, so it should last me a good while.  I feed it twice a day, morning and night, and at lunch time feed some kind of vegies.  I am pre-soaking it a little at the moment, but will stop doing that once all the fish are healthy.  At the moment I am trying to get all their little digestive tracts healthy, and get loads of good vitamins etc into them to help them get healthy.  Once they are in the main tank and out of QT the pre-soaking will stop.  I have found that pre-soaking the pellets does lead to some water cloudiness.  But then I think I am over feeding too.  I find it really difficult to tell how much they need.  That is something I am working on.  Just as I get it right, this one has to come out of the tank for treatment and the amounts all change! (Guess who???  pOdge! yup!)

 

This is it...

http://www.thetechden.com.au/New_Life_Spectrum_Thera_A_Regular_250g_1mm_p/41300.htm

 

Oh, and if you ever run into troubles and need antibiotics, a lot of the antibiotics aren't available in Australia.  Those that aren't can be purchased online from https://www.vitamingrocer.com.au/  They are an American company selling to Australia.  It does however take a few weeks to get here.  My orders are typically 10-15 days approx., give or take.  Due to this I bought some to have on hand should my fish need them (which has been a fishy lifesaver already!), and then when I start to use them I order another one.  Hopefully that way I wont run out mid course.  Finding the products on the website can be a challenge, but I have found it easiest to just type the name of the product in the search bar.  That way it finds it for me!

 

Anyways... hope some of this helps, if not, please just take what you need and discard the rest for the waffle it indeed be!  :thumbs:

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Oh, and salt... find a pure pool salt, one with absolute no additives... I know Fishy Mandy uses one from Bunnings called Sunray Pool Salt by Cheetham Salt.  It is heaps heaps heaps cheaper than either aquarium salt or rock salt, and you will need it a lot in the first few months of QT.   I know for my 50L tub I have my two newbies in at the moment, to get to 0.3% I need about a cup of rock salt (hoping I have my measurements right here), and with water changes every day, that starts to get expensive.  The rock salt I found in the shops I can use is Saxa rock salt 500g for $2.06.  The Cheetham one from Bunnings is 25kg for around $6.90.  Prices might be different where you are... not sure on that front.

 

Anyway... Ill leave you be now... promise! 

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Oh... just one last thought... when I use the hose I always run it for a while first to flush out whatever stagnant water, insects etc is hiding in it.  I try to drain the water out of it prior to storing it too (but usually Hubby does this for me so the draining part doesn't always happen).

 

No more thoughts left now... brain used up all the thoughts for the rest of the year :P !

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just let me know if you have any questions a  :hi

 

Hey Ree

these may sound like  silly questions but here goes

 

1.how do you keep the floor of your barebottom tank clean?

Do you let your filter work its magic or do you have to use additional equipment?

 

2. what equipment do you use for water changes (apart from buckets)

 

3. appreciate any information you want to share on plants

 

Sorry to hijack your thread like that, but when I saw your tank pics, I had to ask

 

 

No, Don't worry about that docians, there was no one else replying to this thread anyway, so no one will get confused...

 

 

1.  Cleaning the bottom of the tank...

 

This is my filter.... http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/131247811389?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

Mostly the filter removes any debris from the bottom of the tank within about 2hours of it being deposited there.  This means that just to make sure its all nice and clean I give the tank a thorough scrub with this http://www.thetechden.com.au/Medium_Aquarium_Scraper_p/ar15.htm about an hour before I do a WC, and if I notice its getting a little grubby I might give it a scrub mid week as well with the algae scrubber, or just rub my hand along the bottom, but its not usually needed... so far. 

 

I also have my little pOdge to consider.  He kinda has a 'chest' which he tends to drag along the bottom of the tank when he is feeding.  I think if I added anything rough to the tank bottom he might end up with gravel rash and then maybe infections.

 

 

Ah good, so it looks like all I will need will be an efficient filter. I was wondering if I would need a gravel vaccuum

 

 

I was hoping to be able to have a Bristlenose Pleco in the tank with my fish,

 

Eventually I plan to have an oranda, a black moor and a ranchu so hopefully I could have a BN pleco. Are they suitable for a coldwater tank though?

 

2. Water changes (WC)...

 

For water changes, I was having a great deal of difficulty.  I have chronic severe back pain which means I am bed ridden most of the time, so we had to design a way of making the water changes as easy as possible... ie. limited use of buckets!  We looked into getting a python, but we don't have any taps in the house we could use, and we don't have any taps over a large enough water catchment (ie we don't have a bath tub, only a shower, and only a small kitchen sink) to allow for the python. 

 

I turn the filter off now and the air pumps.

 

Then I bought the largest syphon I could find.... like this one http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5-Inch-Gravel-Cleaner-Vac-Aquarium-Fish-Tank-Syphon-Vacuum-Penn-Plax-/251288486816?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item3a81f603a0... and I submerge the whole thing under water, then put my thumb over the small end of the hose, and take it out of the tank, and.... here is the cheat... put the end of the hose into the end of a piece of spare pvc pipe... might be 90mm, not sure, but doesn't matter what size, the pipe rests on top of a bucket inside, pokes out the door, and drains the tank onto the lawn.... yay no buckets!!!!  I use the large end to vacuum up any debris left on the bottom of the tank.

 

 

Once the tank ph and temp are right, I add some of the water from the tank to the holding tank, just to reduce any possible shock, leave for 5-10 min, then carefully put the baby's back into their home.  I do this by hand again.  This way they are happy, they have had a yummy treat, and I am happy, their tank is nice and clean.

 

Lastly I wipe over the outside of the tank with a clean dry cloth to make sure no water marks are on the glass.  You can also use a little vinegar for this, but make sure you don't get any in the tank.

 

That's it!  That is as easy and as cheaply as I could make it for the moment.

 

Hey not teaching you to suck eggs

but this might be a useful video

 

The common goldfish I am looking after are very skittish. They should be returning to their owner tomorrow

How do your fish get used to you handling them? Do they thrash about?

I can't see my commons resting in my hand

 

3.  Plants...

 

Ok... Ill let you in on my plant secret.... promise not to tell hey??? :whisper   The secret is to buy the toughest plant variety you can find.... :whistle

 

Just keep in mind that I am new at all of this too.  I am learning as I go.  I have only been on Kokos for maybe 3-4 months, and I have only had my tank and goldfish for 2-3 months, so there are a lot of people out there who are much more experienced than I am, and might be able to advise you better, or give alternate solutions/ideas. 

 

That's the end of my waffle for today... I hope its understandable... like I said, I tend to waffle... sorry!  :doh11:

 

Your plants do look natural

No no its not waffling- at this stage the more information I can get the better

 

Ah good

I discovered that any foods with large amounts of any cereals, or air make him float away... :bubbles

 

I have found this food to be really really good.  Its New Life Spectrum Thera A+.

 

This is it...

http://www.thetechden.com.au/New_Life_Spectrum_Thera_A_Regular_250g_1mm_p/41300.htm

 

Oh, and if you ever run into troubles and need antibiotics, a lot of the antibiotics aren't available in Australia.  Those that aren't can be purchased online from https://www.vitamingrocer.com.au/  They are an American company selling to Australia.  It does however take a few weeks to get here.  My orders are typically 10-15 days approx., give or take.  Due to this I bought some to have on hand should my fish need them (which has been a fishy lifesaver already!), and then when I start to use them I order another one.  Hopefully that way I wont run out mid course.  Finding the products on the website can be a challenge, but I have found it easiest to just type the name of the product in the search bar.  That way it finds it for me!

 

Anyways... hope some of this helps, if not, please just take what you need and discard the rest for the waffle it indeed be!  :thumbs:

so the pet food from the LPS would not be ideal for wen growth/ optimal growth etc

 

Oh... just one last thought... when I use the hose I always run it for a while first to flush out whatever stagnant water, insects etc is hiding in it.  I try to drain the water out of it prior to storing it too (but usually Hubby does this for me so the draining part doesn't always happen).

 

No more thoughts left now... brain used up all the thoughts for the rest of the year :P !

Thank you for all your information. Very very helpful. And yes I did read in another post that hubby will be eventually building a pond for you :)

How many goldfish do you have in all?

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Your plants do look natural

 

Ah good, so it looks like all I will need will be an efficient filter. I was wondering if I would need a gravel vaccuum

 

I was hoping to be able to have a Bristlenose Pleco in the tank with my fish,

 

Eventually I plan to have an oranda, a black moor and a ranchu so hopefully I could have a BN pleco. Are they suitable for a cold water tank though?

 

Hey not teaching you to suck eggs

but this might be a useful video

 

The common goldfish I am looking after are very skittish. They should be returning to their owner tomorrow

How do your fish get used to you handling them? Do they thrash about?

I can't see my commons resting in my hand

 

 

No no its not waffling- at this stage the more information I can get the better

 

Ah good

 

so the pet food from the LPS would not be ideal for wen growth/ optimal growth etc

 

Thank you for all your information. Very very helpful. And yes I did read in another post that hubby will be eventually building a pond for you :)

 

 

How many goldfish do you have in all?

 

 

 

I cant wait for my pond!  But I have to be patient! 

 

These are my babies, 4 in all:

 

pOdge the Pearlscale

http://vid1298.photobucket.com/albums/ag52/Reesbucket/pOdge%2005_26_15/pOdge%2005_26_15%20video/THE%20ORANGE.avi_zpshyto9dvp.mp4

 

 

Louie the Black Moor

http://vid1298.photobucket.com/albums/ag52/Reesbucket/pOdge%2005_26_15/Louie%2005_26_15%20video/THE%20BLACK.avi_zpskndexav6.mp4

 

 

My two new fish are:

 

Nudge the Calico Nymph

Nudge%20Hi_zpszrslxwj3.jpg

 

 

Smudge the red and white Oranda

No%20name%20hello_zpsyanbibnk.jpg

 

 

The plants weren't expensive either.... I hate the look of plastic plants... they look plastic, but the Fauna range that Simone sells seem to all look fairly natural. YAY

 

The syphon I mentioned above is a gravel vacuum.  You can also get battery powered ones online that don't have hoses, they have a net and the water is run through the net before its returned to the tank.  They might be suitable for mid week clean ups, but I haven't tried them yet...

 

Many on the forum have the BN plecos in their tanks, so I think they can quite well tolerate lower temperatures.  It might be worth posting a thread to see if you can find out how low a temp they can tolerate... Im not too sure on that one.  I was going to run the heater in my tank and just keep it at 18 degrees Celsius with the pleco. 

 

The only additional things you will need is some driftwood for your pleco to munch on... apparently they die a lot lot sooner without the driftwood.  It is good for their digestion.  Also you will need a good quality algae wafer if you don't have much algae to begin with... and they absolutely LOVE zucchini!

 

Thanks for the video... I had thought of doing that, but I have to find a mesh that is large enough to allow any left over debris through so they can get sucked up by the syphon.  Haven't found one yet... LOL. 

 

I also have to remove them due to the cold water only by tap situation.  In summer the tank temps will get quite high... we don't have an air conditioner... so the difference in temp between the cold water tap and the tank water will be too great for my little fish to handle I think.  Plus our water is quite heavily chlorinated. 

 

That being said I have heard others on the forum mention that they leave their fish in and just stick the python in their tank and fill.  Most of them though have the python on a mixer tap, so the temp is right before it gets to the tank.  They also dose with prime as they start to fill.  So that works for them.

 

LOL yes, some of my fish are more wiggly than others.  I found it very daunting at first to even consider handling them, but then realised I would have to do it eventually.  With daily water changes in their 4-6 week long quarantine, they need to be removed from the QT tank every day for a 100% WC.  So this gives me a chance to get them used to being handled.  That's why when I do remove them to clean their QT tank, they get a treat in their holding tank... makes them associate my hands with good food.

 

I also have to handle them to get photos for the forum for diagnostic purposes as my QT tanks are not clear sides. 

See here for example:

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/121794-podge-had-an-accident-pls-help/

 

 

Nudge is the worst.  He is a little fighter, and bigger than the rest too.  I found that the smaller fish don't wiggle as much, and they get used to being handled a lot faster.  Louie and the Smudge are my smallest and after one or two time handling them they just lay in my hand, but I do have to hold them close, not firmly, just close. 

 

The food from your LPS might be ok.  Im not sure.  Post a thread about it to get others opinions if you like, they will have a much better idea than me.  These are just the foods I found good. 

 

I did try my local fish shop generic takeaway container of flakes, but they made pOdge float, and both Louie and pOdge surface gulp a great deal.  They ended up getting used to help cycle my tank the first time round.  Then it got contaminated when pOdge was diagnosed with costia, and before I knew about the importance of cross contamination in their early QT.  So I then had to chuck all my media, bleach the whole tank, and then start from scratch again.  By then Hubby hurt his back and couldn't help me with their daily water changes for a few weeks, and Louie and pOdge were both finished their costia treatment (they still had some rounds of prazi to go but the mods said I could do that in the main tank), so I popped them in the main tank to reduce the number of WC's on Hubby.

 

Let me know if you have any more questions... Ill answer all I can :hi

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Thank you for all your information. Very very helpful. And yes I did read in another post that hubby will be eventually building a pond for you :)

How many goldfish do you have in all?

 

 

Hi, Ive answered all your q's above, but the post somehow didn't quote you.. Im sorry... so I just thought I would quote you so it would prompt that I answered.  Hope that makes some sense!  :hi

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Thank you for all your information. Very very helpful. And yes I did read in another post that hubby will be eventually building a pond for you :)

How many goldfish do you have in all?

 

 

Hi, Ive answered all your q's above, but the post somehow didn't quote you.. Im sorry... so I just thought I would quote you so it would prompt that I answered.  Hope that makes some sense!  :hi

 

 

A few more thoughts and questions

Really cute fish

Don't know much about nymphs. Are they fast swimmers? like commons

Also with the red and white oranda- that is one I want in my tank- are there different types ie long and short body?

 

Also what size do i buy them at?

one LPS has them at 5cm

but another said 5cms tend to be weak, get 7cm

but I'm wondering if its because he wants more money as 7cm are longer

 

Hey I suppose if I get all my fish from the same shop at the same time I do not have to quarantine if I am introducing them at the same time?

My LPS does sell tiny fish tank kits, so I dont think I will follow their advice when it comes to food

 

And lastly how come both you and  hubby have bad backs? Don't have to answer this one if it is too intrusive

Cheers

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Thank you for all your information. Very very helpful. And yes I did read in another post that hubby will be eventually building a pond for you :)

How many goldfish do you have in all?

 

 

Hi, Ive answered all your q's above, but the post somehow didn't quote you.. Im sorry... so I just thought I would quote you so it would prompt that I answered.  Hope that makes some sense!  :hi

 

 

A few more thoughts and questions

Really cute fish

Don't know much about nymphs. Are they fast swimmers? like commons

Also with the red and white oranda- that is one I want in my tank- are there different types ie long and short body?

 

Also what size do i buy them at?

one LPS has them at 5cm

but another said 5cms tend to be weak, get 7cm

but I'm wondering if its because he wants more money as 7cm are longer

 

Hey I suppose if I get all my fish from the same shop at the same time I do not have to quarantine if I am introducing them at the same time?

My LPS does sell tiny fish tank kits, so I dont think I will follow their advice when it comes to food

 

And lastly how come both you and  hubby have bad backs? Don't have to answer this one if it is too intrusive

Cheers

 

 

Hi again!

 

Nymphs are stronger swimmers I think.  From what I have read they are basically fantails with a commons single tail instead of the normal fantail.  Nudge is a very strong fish compared to my other babies.  I know that when I put them in the same tank, Nudge will swim quicker to the food than little Louie will.  I am hoping that as Nudge needs more food than Louie because he is bigger, that this wont be a problem.  Also I tend to spread the food out as much as possible, so they have to work to find it a little more, and cant scoop up quite so much in one mouthful.  I have been watching Nudge in QT with Smudge to see how he reacts to Smudge when fed, and he doesn't push him away from the food, or guard the food, so that is also a good sign.

 

I think, but don't quote me, there are different types of body's in orandas.  The long body ones tend to have less digestive issues I have read, due to their innards not being quite so squished up, and also less swim bladder disorders.  I don't know how the long/short body affects their balance if their wenns get to big... might be worth posting a thread to ask about that.  But if you feed correctly, and keep the tank clean, the chances of swim bladder and digestive issues will be very greatly reduced. 

 

As to the length I am not sure.... Ill try to measure my baby's when I do their water change today.  I haven't measured them yet.  I know little Louie was only 5g when I first got her.  She was stronger and healthier than pOdge, and he was 33g, though he is not much longer, he has a much greater 'volume' I guess would be a really polite way of putting it... just in case he is reading over my shoulder... :teehee

 

I would defiantly quarantine, even if you buy them all from the same shop at the same time.  Take my case as an example, I had started cycling my tank, then I thought while it cycles I can QT my first fish.  I bought pOdge and Louie from the same petshop, but different tanks, and the lady bagged them in the same bag.  I started their QT together out of the main tank in a large plastic storage container as I don't have a spare tank.  During the second round of prazi pOdge developed what looked at first like septicaemia.  So I had to separate them, and treat him with antibiotics.  He got worse and worse, and I nearly euthanized him several times to end his suffering, and then we changed treatment.  It turned out he had cosita, which is a very nasty, very hard to kill parasite.  I had to treat with formaldehyde to eliminate the parasite.  The formaldehyde was a last resort as it can cause gill damage, organ failure, and can also sterilise a fish I believe.  I don't think its a treatment that breeders use for this reason.  He has pulled through ok, though it took a while for him to get better.  In the meantime I treated Louie with one course of antibiotics as I had already started, I didn't want to stop mid course and create a super bug. 

 

During all this stress and kafuffle, I didn't realise the importance of making sure all the QT had separate equipment to the main tank, or to thoroughly disinfect equipment between using it on QT then the main tank.  As a result my main tank would have been infected with costia too, so I had to strip the whole thing down, disinfect everything, chuck all my media, and start the cycle from scratch again.  A very painful job to do, and something I could have avoided if I had just not cross contaminated. 

 

So knowing what I know now, that even if my tank had no fish in it, I would be definitely QTing away from the main tank.  Some fish look healthy in the shop, but due to the stress of being moved can succumb to any parasites and consequently infection during the QT period.  This means you may have to treat with antibiotics or other medicines which will kill your cycle.  All that hard work down the drain! 

 

You can see my nightmare with pOdge here:

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/121344-freckles-or-something-sinister/

 

I would also recommend, if you haven't already, looking up the QT information on Kokos... I found it very helpful!

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/114157-why-quarantining-new-fish-is-necessary/

 

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/114492-how-to-quarantine-new-fish/

 

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/105076-schedules-for-the-treatment-of-flukes-etc-using-praziquantel/

 

 

When you go to buy your fish, look at the tanks.  Ask if they are all filtered together or separately.   If they are filtered together, and one tank has sick fish in it, the chances are the rest of the tanks will have sick fish.  They will all be contaminated with the same bugs.  The same applies to their nets... do they have individual nets for individual tanks?  If not then again they will all be cross contaminated. 

 

Look for fish that are active, interested in you in particular, dorsal fins erect when not swimming (they flatten them a little when they swim).  I like to pass my hand across the tank and see which fish follow my hand.  When I picked Nudge and Smudge, and the same with Louie and pOdge, I waved my hand slowly across the front of the tank to see which fish followed.  I then leaned down to face them and make fish faces.... I know... weird in a shop... but all four made fish faces back like they were having a conversation with me.  I then walk away from the tank and see if they follow.  I will walk away and look at the rest of the tanks, then come back and do the same thing again.  I like to pick fish that are interested in me.  It shows they are aware of their surroundings, and will bond better with you.  I think that Koko said she also asks the pet shop to feed the fish in front of her so she can see if they are interested in eating (always a good sign for a goldfish) and not spitting most of the food out.

 

Avoid, if you can, fish from any tanks with clamped fins (fins held close to the body at all times, esp the dorsal fin), any white spots like salt (that's ich), any wounds, white fluffy fungus looking stuff, ragged and torn fins (fin rot), fish floating on the top of the water, fish sitting at the bottom of the tank, fish that are having trouble righting themselves (swim bladder disorder), and esp fish with tiny pinprick looking broken blood vessels on their skin (this could be septicaemia or worse still costia). 

 

In Australia I have found it very difficult to avoid these diseases in a lot of cases, and I will buy that special fish and treat him if I think I have the medicines on hand.  I live in a remote area and I only have the choice of one independent fish shop 3/4hr away, or pet chain stores 1.5hr away... and their stock is usually sick (also all filtered on the same filter, and no individual nets per tank) with a minimum of ich and flukes, so I don't always have the option of waiting for healthy stock.  That's why I mentioned having the antibiotics on hand as secondary infections can develop when you are removing parasites.

 

Nearly all fish in petshops in Australia have Flukes, and probably worms, so prazi treatment is a must in QT.  I use blue planet fluke and worm tablets.

 

Ich is also fairly common during QT.  It is one of the easier problems to treat (salt and increased water temp, hence a heater is good for QT). 

 

You mentioned the fish you were 'fishy-sitting' were skittish.  QT has been a great way I have found to get your fish used to you.  They will know you.  They will get to know that you mean food too.  When you come near the tank, they will dance, and beg, and have a chat (pOdge does this... its so cute... just opens and closes his mouth while staring you dead in the eye, just like he is having a conversation), and also they will respond to your voice (pOdge comes when called, as does Louie... I use a different voice to call each of them).  If I wave my fingers in front of pOdge he responds by waving his pectoral fins faster back at me... just like he is waving back.  You will have a ball with your fishy babies!

 

The bad back department is a long story... have you got a cuppa...  if you don't have time I understand you skipping this bit... its not relevant to fish stuff anyway... but here goes... Ill try to describe what happened.

 

My back was the result of a fall.  Our bathroom was a step higher than the hallway, and I slipped on some water on the bathroom floor and landed on my knee in the hallway.  I thought I had broken my knee... but a few hours later I could move it ok just, so had a very sore knee for around two weeks, then my hip started killing me about a week after the fall, then when it started getting better I realised the pain was actually coming from my back.  It was bad, but I thought it would go away.  4 weeks after my fall I woke up one morning in absolute and utter agony.  I couldn't get out of bed.  I went to a Dr and he shoved an icepack on my back, told me he didn't want it back and said it would be fine in a week or so.  It got worse and worse.  A week later I was up at outpatients and they sent me for a CT scan and said I had damaged 3 or more disks just above my tailbone.  They said with physio it would get better.  The first physio I went to wouldn't even touch me.  So I went to another, and it did help a little, but only for a day or so, and even then I was still in agony.  I couldn't do the exercises they wanted me to do either.  It was way too painful.

 

I was working full time at the time and had to have months off work.  It got to the point where my boss called in at home one day and said that if I wasn't able to work then I should think of resigning.  I had a mortgage and other responsibilities, so didn't have the option of not working.  So I went back to work.  I could not stand for longer than 10min or sit for longer than 10 min so they altered my desk so I could 'yoyo' all day.  I used to have to come home at lunch to lie down, then go back to work again in the afternoon.  Finally it all was too much, and I requested part time work, which they were not impressed about, but it suited them at the time as the workload had decreased.  This was about the same time I met my beautiful Hubby.

 

Due to having to reduce my working hours, and my increased medical expenses, I ended up having to declare bankruptcy and lost pretty much everything, my beautiful 120yr old house, my car, and surprising to me many of my friends.  I realised at this point that they were not true friends, just happy to have a ride here, or ask me to do this or that for them... once I couldn't do the things they wanted I was of no use.  I am pleased in one way I found this out.  I now have a select little group of people who I know I can rely on and love dearly.  They are my peeps (special people).  They understand, are considerate, and are the most precious people in all the world.. to me anyway.

 

So, after all this, then my employers decided to close the factory I worked for, and so I was made redundant.  At this point I could still not stand for more than 10-15min, or sit for the same duration.  I still required physio and bed rest.   I could not sit through a job interview, and I couldn't work any more so I applied for the disability pension, which was granted very quickly. 

 

I hate not being able to work, and I loved my work even though it was super stressful.  The painkillers make my brain fuzzy though, and due to the stress I found that my already problematic depression bouts and panic attacks became more of an issue.  The medications also made me super paranoid along with many other side effects, and I was about the same time diagnosed with severe depression, general anxiety disorder, panic disorder and OCD.... new problems to deal with which were so out of control it was very difficult to function. 

 

It was about now Hubby and I got married.  He is a treasure.  He looks after me so well.  He married me knowing that one day I will end up in a wheelchair.  Nothing is too much trouble.  He does all the housework, washing, dishes, cleaning, and helps me with my fish and looks after our puddy cat.  Most of the time I need assistance to shower, get in and out of bed, get in and out of chairs or the car, and I am not allowed to carry anything over about 1kg.  I cant bend to get anything off the floor, so he will pick up anything I need too... which is wonderful (you don't realise how many things you drop on the floor until you cant pick them up!).  He also does all the gardening (he has a beautiful garden) and outside work.  He does all this while struggling with health issues of his own.  He is an absolute treasure and I don't know where I would be without him! 

 

But I digress... Another year later, and I was only getting worse, so they sent me for CT scans to see if anything could be done to fix the problem.  The result is disc damage, degenerative disc disorder, nerve damage and twisted and displaced nerves.  Due to the nerve damage surgery is not an option.  Painkillers and bed rest are the only things that help.  Most of the time my back is covered in bruises too which no one has ever been able to figure out.

 

So I have now got my mental health treatment relatively stabilised.  Again, its not a complete solution, and it severely impacts my every day, but at least I have some quality of life now, and actually want to live, a big step up from where I was a few years ago.  I do find that new medications, stress or lack of sleep affects me badly though, and my depression, anxiety and OCD get out of control very easily, but at least I know now that is what they are, and that not everything my silly brain tells me is true. 

 

So that is me.  Hubby on the other hand hurt his back a month ago.  He was landscaping my parents in-laws garden for them.  They have a rainforest type area in their garden, and wanted some paths put through it, so Hubby was lifting huge heavy rocks, lumps of concrete and lots of digging... that night he couldn't walk easily, next morning I had to get the ambulance... it scared me to death coming from my background.  After a couple of weeks of taking it easy and some painkillers though, he is right as rain now.  Which is good cause I need buckets carried for my QT tanks.... :teehee and I hate to see him in pain or suffer.

 

See, told you it was a long story... I tried to make it as short as possible for you.  It has been a very difficult 6 years, but there have been many good things that have come out of all the horror and pain.  I now know who my true friends are, I have a wonderfully supportive Hubby and his family are amazing. I have a lovely little puddy tat and 4 very sweet fish... and that is my life.   Also now I have the Kokos team to help me learn to look after my fishy babies, which I value sooooo much!

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Thank you for all your information. Very very helpful. And yes I did read in another post that hubby will be eventually building a pond for you :)

How many goldfish do you have in all?

 

 

Hi, Ive answered all your q's above, but the post somehow didn't quote you.. Im sorry... so I just thought I would quote you so it would prompt that I answered.  Hope that makes some sense!  :hi

 

 

A few more thoughts and questions

Really cute fish

Don't know much about nymphs. Are they fast swimmers? like commons

Also with the red and white oranda- that is one I want in my tank- are there different types ie long and short body?

 

Also what size do i buy them at?

one LPS has them at 5cm

but another said 5cms tend to be weak, get 7cm

but I'm wondering if its because he wants more money as 7cm are longer

 

Hey I suppose if I get all my fish from the same shop at the same time I do not have to quarantine if I am introducing them at the same time?

My LPS does sell tiny fish tank kits, so I dont think I will follow their advice when it comes to food

 

And lastly how come both you and  hubby have bad backs? Don't have to answer this one if it is too intrusive

Cheers

 

 

Hi again!

 

Nymphs are stronger swimmers I think.  From what I have read they are basically fantails with a commons single tail instead of the normal fantail.  Nudge is a very strong fish compared to my other babies.  I know that when I put them in the same tank, Nudge will swim quicker to the food than little Louie will.  I am hoping that as Nudge needs more food than Louie because he is bigger, that this wont be a problem.  Also I tend to spread the food out as much as possible, so they have to work to find it a little more, and cant scoop up quite so much in one mouthful.  I have been watching Nudge in QT with Smudge to see how he reacts to Smudge when fed, and he doesn't push him away from the food, or guard the food, so that is also a good sign.

 

I think, but don't quote me, there are different types of body's in orandas.  The long body ones tend to have less digestive issues I have read, due to their innards not being quite so squished up, and also less swim bladder disorders.  I don't know how the long/short body affects their balance if their wenns get to big... might be worth posting a thread to ask about that.  But if you feed correctly, and keep the tank clean, the chances of swim bladder and digestive issues will be very greatly reduced. 

 

As to the length I am not sure.... Ill try to measure my baby's when I do their water change today.  I haven't measured them yet.  I know little Louie was only 5g when I first got her.  She was stronger and healthier than pOdge, and he was 33g, though he is not much longer, he has a much greater 'volume' I guess would be a really polite way of putting it... just in case he is reading over my shoulder... :teehee

 

I would defiantly quarantine, even if you buy them all from the same shop at the same time.  Take my case as an example, I had started cycling my tank, then I thought while it cycles I can QT my first fish.  I bought pOdge and Louie from the same petshop, but different tanks, and the lady bagged them in the same bag.  I started their QT together out of the main tank in a large plastic storage container as I don't have a spare tank.  During the second round of prazi pOdge developed what looked at first like septicaemia.  So I had to separate them, and treat him with antibiotics.  He got worse and worse, and I nearly euthanized him several times to end his suffering, and then we changed treatment.  It turned out he had cosita, which is a very nasty, very hard to kill parasite.  I had to treat with formaldehyde to eliminate the parasite.  The formaldehyde was a last resort as it can cause gill damage, organ failure, and can also sterilise a fish I believe.  I don't think its a treatment that breeders use for this reason.  He has pulled through ok, though it took a while for him to get better.  In the meantime I treated Louie with one course of antibiotics as I had already started, I didn't want to stop mid course and create a super bug. 

 

During all this stress and kafuffle, I didn't realise the importance of making sure all the QT had separate equipment to the main tank, or to thoroughly disinfect equipment between using it on QT then the main tank.  As a result my main tank would have been infected with costia too, so I had to strip the whole thing down, disinfect everything, chuck all my media, and start the cycle from scratch again.  A very painful job to do, and something I could have avoided if I had just not cross contaminated. 

 

So knowing what I know now, that even if my tank had no fish in it, I would be definitely QTing away from the main tank.  Some fish look healthy in the shop, but due to the stress of being moved can succumb to any parasites and consequently infection during the QT period.  This means you may have to treat with antibiotics or other medicines which will kill your cycle.  All that hard work down the drain! 

 

You can see my nightmare with pOdge here:

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/121344-freckles-or-something-sinister/

 

I would also recommend, if you haven't already, looking up the QT information on Kokos... I found it very helpful!

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/114157-why-quarantining-new-fish-is-necessary/

 

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/114492-how-to-quarantine-new-fish/

 

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/105076-schedules-for-the-treatment-of-flukes-etc-using-praziquantel/

 

 

When you go to buy your fish, look at the tanks.  Ask if they are all filtered together or separately.   If they are filtered together, and one tank has sick fish in it, the chances are the rest of the tanks will have sick fish.  They will all be contaminated with the same bugs.  The same applies to their nets... do they have individual nets for individual tanks?  If not then again they will all be cross contaminated. 

 

Look for fish that are active, interested in you in particular, dorsal fins erect when not swimming (they flatten them a little when they swim).  I like to pass my hand across the tank and see which fish follow my hand.  When I picked Nudge and Smudge, and the same with Louie and pOdge, I waved my hand slowly across the front of the tank to see which fish followed.  I then leaned down to face them and make fish faces.... I know... weird in a shop... but all four made fish faces back like they were having a conversation with me.  I then walk away from the tank and see if they follow.  I will walk away and look at the rest of the tanks, then come back and do the same thing again.  I like to pick fish that are interested in me.  It shows they are aware of their surroundings, and will bond better with you.  I think that Koko said she also asks the pet shop to feed the fish in front of her so she can see if they are interested in eating (always a good sign for a goldfish) and not spitting most of the food out.

 

Avoid, if you can, fish from any tanks with clamped fins (fins held close to the body at all times, esp the dorsal fin), any white spots like salt (that's ich), any wounds, white fluffy fungus looking stuff, ragged and torn fins (fin rot), fish floating on the top of the water, fish sitting at the bottom of the tank, fish that are having trouble righting themselves (swim bladder disorder), and esp fish with tiny pinprick looking broken blood vessels on their skin (this could be septicaemia or worse still costia). 

 

In Australia I have found it very difficult to avoid these diseases in a lot of cases, and I will buy that special fish and treat him if I think I have the medicines on hand.  I live in a remote area and I only have the choice of one independent fish shop 3/4hr away, or pet chain stores 1.5hr away... and their stock is usually sick (also all filtered on the same filter, and no individual nets per tank) with a minimum of ich and flukes, so I don't always have the option of waiting for healthy stock.  That's why I mentioned having the antibiotics on hand as secondary infections can develop when you are removing parasites.

 

Nearly all fish in petshops in Australia have Flukes, and probably worms, so prazi treatment is a must in QT.  I use blue planet fluke and worm tablets.

 

Ich is also fairly common during QT.  It is one of the easier problems to treat (salt and increased water temp, hence a heater is good for QT). 

 

You mentioned the fish you were 'fishy-sitting' were skittish.  QT has been a great way I have found to get your fish used to you.  They will know you.  They will get to know that you mean food too.  When you come near the tank, they will dance, and beg, and have a chat (pOdge does this... its so cute... just opens and closes his mouth while staring you dead in the eye, just like he is having a conversation), and also they will respond to your voice (pOdge comes when called, as does Louie... I use a different voice to call each of them).  If I wave my fingers in front of pOdge he responds by waving his pectoral fins faster back at me... just like he is waving back.  You will have a ball with your fishy babies!

 

The bad back department is a long story... have you got a cuppa...  if you don't have time I understand you skipping this bit... its not relevant to fish stuff anyway... but here goes... Ill try to describe what happened.

 

My back was the result of a fall.  Our bathroom was a step higher than the hallway, and I slipped on some water on the bathroom floor and landed on my knee in the hallway.  I thought I had broken my knee... but a few hours later I could move it ok just, so had a very sore knee for around two weeks, then my hip started killing me about a week after the fall, then when it started getting better I realised the pain was actually coming from my back.  It was bad, but I thought it would go away.  4 weeks after my fall I woke up one morning in absolute and utter agony.  I couldn't get out of bed.  I went to a Dr and he shoved an icepack on my back, told me he didn't want it back and said it would be fine in a week or so.  It got worse and worse.  A week later I was up at outpatients and they sent me for a CT scan and said I had damaged 3 or more disks just above my tailbone.  They said with physio it would get better.  The first physio I went to wouldn't even touch me.  So I went to another, and it did help a little, but only for a day or so, and even then I was still in agony.  I couldn't do the exercises they wanted me to do either.  It was way too painful.

 

I was working full time at the time and had to have months off work.  It got to the point where my boss called in at home one day and said that if I wasn't able to work then I should think of resigning.  I had a mortgage and other responsibilities, so didn't have the option of not working.  So I went back to work.  I could not stand for longer than 10min or sit for longer than 10 min so they altered my desk so I could 'yoyo' all day.  I used to have to come home at lunch to lie down, then go back to work again in the afternoon.  Finally it all was too much, and I requested part time work, which they were not impressed about, but it suited them at the time as the workload had decreased.  This was about the same time I met my beautiful Hubby.

 

Due to having to reduce my working hours, and my increased medical expenses, I ended up having to declare bankruptcy and lost pretty much everything, my beautiful 120yr old house, my car, and surprising to me many of my friends.  I realised at this point that they were not true friends, just happy to have a ride here, or ask me to do this or that for them... once I couldn't do the things they wanted I was of no use.  I am pleased in one way I found this out.  I now have a select little group of people who I know I can rely on and love dearly.  They are my peeps (special people).  They understand, are considerate, and are the most precious people in all the world.. to me anyway.

 

So, after all this, then my employers decided to close the factory I worked for, and so I was made redundant.  At this point I could still not stand for more than 10-15min, or sit for the same duration.  I still required physio and bed rest.   I could not sit through a job interview, and I couldn't work any more so I applied for the disability pension, which was granted very quickly. 

 

I hate not being able to work, and I loved my work even though it was super stressful.  The painkillers make my brain fuzzy though, and due to the stress I found that my already problematic depression bouts and panic attacks became more of an issue.  The medications also made me super paranoid along with many other side effects, and I was about the same time diagnosed with severe depression, general anxiety disorder, panic disorder and OCD.... new problems to deal with which were so out of control it was very difficult to function. 

 

It was about now Hubby and I got married.  He is a treasure.  He looks after me so well.  He married me knowing that one day I will end up in a wheelchair.  Nothing is too much trouble.  He does all the housework, washing, dishes, cleaning, and helps me with my fish and looks after our puddy cat.  Most of the time I need assistance to shower, get in and out of bed, get in and out of chairs or the car, and I am not allowed to carry anything over about 1kg.  I cant bend to get anything off the floor, so he will pick up anything I need too... which is wonderful (you don't realise how many things you drop on the floor until you cant pick them up!).  He also does all the gardening (he has a beautiful garden) and outside work.  He does all this while struggling with health issues of his own.  He is an absolute treasure and I don't know where I would be without him! 

 

But I digress... Another year later, and I was only getting worse, so they sent me for CT scans to see if anything could be done to fix the problem.  The result is disc damage, degenerative disc disorder, nerve damage and twisted and displaced nerves.  Due to the nerve damage surgery is not an option.  Painkillers and bed rest are the only things that help.  Most of the time my back is covered in bruises too which no one has ever been able to figure out.

 

So I have now got my mental health treatment relatively stabilised.  Again, its not a complete solution, and it severely impacts my every day, but at least I have some quality of life now, and actually want to live, a big step up from where I was a few years ago.  I do find that new medications, stress or lack of sleep affects me badly though, and my depression, anxiety and OCD get out of control very easily, but at least I know now that is what they are, and that not everything my silly brain tells me is true. 

 

So that is me.  Hubby on the other hand hurt his back a month ago.  He was landscaping my parents in-laws garden for them.  They have a rainforest type area in their garden, and wanted some paths put through it, so Hubby was lifting huge heavy rocks, lumps of concrete and lots of digging... that night he couldn't walk easily, next morning I had to get the ambulance... it scared me to death coming from my background.  After a couple of weeks of taking it easy and some painkillers though, he is right as rain now.  Which is good cause I need buckets carried for my QT tanks.... :teehee and I hate to see him in pain or suffer.

 

See, told you it was a long story... I tried to make it as short as possible for you.  It has been a very difficult 6 years, but there have been many good things that have come out of all the horror and pain.  I now know who my true friends are, I have a wonderfully supportive Hubby and his family are amazing. I have a lovely little puddy tat and 4 very sweet fish... and that is my life.   Also now I have the Kokos team to help me learn to look after my fishy babies, which I value sooooo much!

 

That is one sad story

Really sad about those 'friends'

But glad that you've made it despite it all

 

Will read up on the QT info and surely will report back with questions lol

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That is one sad story

 

Really sad about those 'friends'

But glad that you've made it despite it all

 

Will read up on the QT info and surely will report back with questions lol

 

 

No problems docians, I'm happy to help where I can.  Makes me feel useful.

 

I've learnt that you can take more knocks than you think you can, that your whole life can change in a split second, to slow down and enjoy simple things in life, and also treasure those who are truly friends!  All of these things came from the last six years, so I guess they were not wasted.  :hi

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That is one sad story

 

Really sad about those 'friends'

But glad that you've made it despite it all

 

Will read up on the QT info and surely will report back with questions lol

 

No problems docians, I'm happy to help where I can.  Makes me feel useful.

 

I've learnt that you can take more knocks than you think you can, that your whole life can change in a split second, to slow down and enjoy simple things in life, and also treasure those who are truly friends!  All of these things came from the last six years, so I guess they were not wasted.  :hi

Hmmm

I thought initially that I would have to wait upto eight weeks while my tank cycles before shopping for fancies

With QT I could start shopping right after the school holidays and simultaneously cycle and QT.

Sounds like a plan :)

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That is one sad story

 

Really sad about those 'friends'

But glad that you've made it despite it all

 

Will read up on the QT info and surely will report back with questions lol

 

No problems docians, I'm happy to help where I can.  Makes me feel useful.

 

I've learnt that you can take more knocks than you think you can, that your whole life can change in a split second, to slow down and enjoy simple things in life, and also treasure those who are truly friends!  All of these things came from the last six years, so I guess they were not wasted.  :hi

Hmmm

I thought initially that I would have to wait upto eight weeks while my tank cycles before shopping for fancies

With QT I could start shopping right after the school holidays and simultaneously cycle and QT.

Sounds like a plan :)

 

 

LOL, that's what I did!  Happy fishy hunting. Your three will look beautiful in your tank!  :hi

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Did you want a photo of that rock? I can post it here if you like so you can see what it looks like... just a thought... no pressure!  :whistle

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