Jump to content

Cycling Tank Questions


Recommended Posts

  • Helper

I would assume that Podge will be running slimier until his condition is improved. It's better than being stripped of his slime coat, certainly! If he is still experiencing some irritation and healing that would kick up production of it.

Good to hear Louie is doing swimmingly ;)

I hate cycling with fish in but that is what we are dojng here, too, because all filters got cleaned. There are worse things, but with two, well fed fish it's daily or every other day water changes or my ammonia is just too high for my tastes. Such is life, but it makes for a long two or three months of filters settling!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I would assume that Podge will be running slimier until his condition is improved. It's better than being stripped of his slime coat, certainly! If he is still experiencing some irritation and healing that would kick up production of it.

Good to hear Louie is doing swimmingly ;)

I hate cycling with fish in but that is what we are dojng here, too, because all filters got cleaned. There are worse things, but with two, well fed fish it's daily or every other day water changes or my ammonia is just too high for my tastes. Such is life, but it makes for a long two or three months of filters settling!

 

Hi Arctic Mama!  How are your babies now?  I hope they are feeling better than they were.

 

He is defiantly a slimy slippery little critter at the moment!  :teehee  But if that is him healing I am ok with that!

 

I agree about the fish in cycling, but we have no access to ammonia to speed things up here.  I am fortunate my little fish are only 5g and 32g.  I think pOdge will be a while longer than the 5g little Louie in QT too, so that gives me a little more breathing space.  You are very right though... I will have to keep a diligent eye on the water parameters until it is all settled! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

There is an alternative to ammonia for fishless cycing.  It's free.  Pond people use it as fertilizer for duckweed.  It's clean and doesn't foul your filter or stink like fish food, rotting shrimp, and the like.  While it contains little free ammonia, it releases ammonia much faster than other high-nitrogen substances, probably by the next day.

 

The product?  Human urine.  Add ~ one tablespoon to the tank, wait a day to allow uric acid, urea, and creatinine to break down to ammonia, and test ammonia.  If it is less than 2 ppm but detectable, add another tablespoon.  If undetectable, add two tablespoons.  Wait a day and test  and adjust (if necessary) again.  

 

I don't recommend ammonia levels over 2ppm in fishless cycling except as a test at the end to confirm completion.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

There is an alternative to ammonia for fishless cycing.  It's free.  Pond people use it as fertilizer for duckweed.  It's clean and doesn't foul your filter or stink like fish food, rotting shrimp, and the like.  While it contains little free ammonia, it releases ammonia much faster than other high-nitrogen substances, probably by the next day.

 

The product?  Human urine.  Add ~ one tablespoon to the tank, wait a day to allow uric acid, urea, and creatinine to break down to ammonia, and test ammonia.  If it is less than 2 ppm but detectable, add another tablespoon.  If undetectable, add two tablespoons.  Wait a day and test  and adjust (if necessary) again.  

 

I don't recommend ammonia levels over 2ppm in fishless cycling except as a test at the end to confirm completion.  

 

:yikes  LOL after my OCD gets over the initial eeeeeeeeewwwwwwww I think I will put this to the test!  Thanks for the suggestion Sharon.  I had thought of this before, and I think Jim mentioned it also in another thread, but I had no idea that so little was needed.  I thought you would need heaps and the tank would smell like a toilet.  That I couldn't handle! 

 

Just a few questions though...  I kind of feel awkward asking these, but here goes nothing!....  :teehee

 

Is the tablespoon all that is needed for 220L tank?

 

Is there a best time of the day to collect the... er... um.... sample?  ie, in the morning when it is most concentrated, or later in the day when it is less concentrated?

 

Do medications affect the... er... um ... sample?  I am on several medications, as is my hubby.  Also I take over the counter vitamins as my diet is extremely restricted due to food intolerances.  Would the vitamins or meds affect the fish/cycle?

 

The other question I have is regarding UTIs... would that make the sample unwise to use?  esp if the UTI proves resistant to antibiotics?

 

Thanks for the input Sharon... Your help is very much appreciated.   :hi

Edited by Ree
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

There isn't any fixed amount, since concentrations will differ depending on things like water consumption.  I said to try a tablespoon and measure the ammonia the next day because one person said he used a tablespoon without saying how big his aquarium was.  We have to do this by trial and error.  If the ammonia concentration is too low, add more sample the next day.  If it is too high, do a partial water change.

 

Yes, low levels of medications will probably be in the sample.  However, you are making a huge dilution in the aquarium, and this is a fishless cycle.  You will do a 100% water change before adding fish, so the fish won't be medicated at all.

 

There's no reason to worry about transmitting infections.  Pathogenic bacteria infect tissue and are usually host-specific and not transmissible to other species.  They can't grow in water and are diluted to harmless levels.

 

Many people will appreciate your pioneering efforts in the future.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Oh now I have to hear how this goes. Tell your OCD to shove it in the name of science! :D

 

There isn't any fixed amount, since concentrations will differ depending on things like water consumption.  I said to try a tablespoon and measure the ammonia the next day because one person said he used a tablespoon without saying how big his aquarium was.  We have to do this by trial and error.  If the ammonia concentration is too low, add more sample the next day.  If it is too high, do a partial water change.

 

Yes, low levels of medications will probably be in the sample.  However, you are making a huge dilution in the aquarium, and this is a fishless cycle.  You will do a 100% water change before adding fish, so the fish won't be medicated at all.

 

There's no reason to worry about transmitting infections.  Pathogenic bacteria infect tissue and are usually host-specific and not transmissible to other species.  They can't grow in water and are diluted to harmless levels.

 

Many people will appreciate your pioneering efforts in the future.

 

:teehee mmmm I will think about it alittle more.... I will let you know what I decide later today.... mmmmmmm..... eweeeeeeeeeewwwwww!  mmmmm ummmm ew! um EW!  ummm...... ?????????????????????

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

 

Wow... that is amazing reading... LOL I :heart  the reference to the step ladder and bladder control! 

 

So his ideas are that you keep the ammonia low enough to colonise, but not inhibit the nitrite converting bacteria, which is what you have said to me before? 

 

I have some cycling product that I would also like to try, just to see if I can get the cycle up and going really fast.  I still needed a source of ammonia with it. 

 

This is the product.... http://www.thetechden.com.au/Pondcare_Quickstart_473ml_p/aph321.htm

 

 

so... if I decided to try it (urea).... Ill just run the process by you if that's ok....

 

1. I would fill the tank, add the media to the canister etc and set everything up and running....

 

2. then add the ammonia 'source' to the tank, one tablespoon, and test in 24hrs to see what the reading is...

  • if the reading registers ammonia, but not up to 2ppm, then I add another tablespoon....
  • if the reading registers none or very little, add 2 tablespoons.....

 

3. wait 24hours then test again....

  • repeat step 3 if test does not reveal near 2ppm ammonia.
  • if test reveals 2ppm ammonia then proceed to step 4

 

3. if the test produces about 2ppm ammonia, then add the Quickstart.... either one of two things will happen...

  • the cycle will establish quickly...
  • or it will take the usual amount of time....

Does that sound about right?  

 

Oh, what would be the optimum temperature for the water?

 

My kh is normally 125 to 130 (7 to 7.5 drops API test) and my gh is normally 170-179 (9.5 to 10 drops API test). 

 

The ph sits stable between 8.1 to 8.4. 

 

My tap water is always 0/0/0 for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates.

 

My 2000L/hr canister will be set up with (in order of water flow from the tank, back into the tank):

  • course filter sponge,
  • medium filter sponge, 
  • fine filter sponge,
  • normal filter floss,
  • fine filter floss,
  • 2kg of Biohome Ultimate filter media. 

It seems that it the Biohome Ultimate has nutrients in it to help beneficial bacteria growth, and also will last for years and years.  They also claim the filter media has 1,120 Sq m (12,050 sq ft) of surface area for bacteria for the 2kg of media.

http://www.ebay.com....=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Sharon, should I ask Koko to move this part of the thread to another thread in the water quality section?  It might be less confusing with my treatment schedule?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I expect that you would get the same results with the cycling product as you would if you just threw the money you spent on it directly into the tank.  (Although if I were into gambling, I would bet on the money, which is likely to be dirty, and the desirable nitrifiers live in  dirt. )  There are some cases in which the cycling product definitely slowed the cycling process.

 

I recall one poor fellow who came on a pond forum complaining that he had been dutifully adding a cycling product to his pond every two weeks for two years and he still had ammonia and nitrate.  (What did that cost?   :yikes )  Typically, an untreated pond will cycle in 3 to 4 weeks.  We told him to stop putting crap in his pond and two weeks later it was cycled.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I expect that you would get the same results with the cycling product as you would if you just threw the money you spent on it directly into the tank.  (Although if I were into gambling, I would bet on the money, which is likely to be dirty, and the desirable nitrifiers live in  dirt. )  There are some cases in which the cycling product definitely slowed the cycling process.

 

I recall one poor fellow who came on a pond forum complaining that he had been dutifully adding a cycling product to his pond every two weeks for two years and he still had ammonia and nitrate.  (What did that cost?   :yikes )  Typically, an untreated pond will cycle in 3 to 4 weeks.  We told him to stop putting crap in his pond and two weeks later it was cycled.

 

Ahhh ok... should have asked before I bought it then hey!  opps :yikes

 

Is the rest right though for the cycling with the urine?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Helper

Yes, once you have your ammonia sourced *snerk!* it's just a matter of following the directions until your media is fully colonized.

And you have a heck of a story to freak people out with, if the occasion calls for it!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Yes, once you have your ammonia sourced *snerk!* it's just a matter of following the directions until your media is fully colonized.

And you have a heck of a story to freak people out with, if the occasion calls for it!

 

I don't know if I could bring myself to tell anyone!  :no:  :teehee

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...