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Sanitizing Tank after Costia


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Hi,

 

I was thinking that I would like to sanitize my 220L tank.  I know it has sat here with no fish in it for over a month, but I am just not sure that I haven't cross contaminated it in the beginning when I wasn't as sure about cross contamination.  I have also read that Costia can stay alive outside of water for a while (haven't been able to confirm how long) and in water for months. 

 

So for my peace of mind (my OCD is driving me nuts about this) I would like to start again.  I would like to have the tank all ready for when Louie is out of QT, and will have to do a partial fishless cycle til then, and then complete with a fish in cycle.  At least 220L is a great deal of water for one little 6g fish, and with prime and regular monitoring of the parameters I think it will be ok.  I don't have access to ammonia to do a fishless cycle properly.  I realise that the tank will take longer to cycle this way.

 

I have new filter media ready to be put in there, and don't want to use media from my other tanks as I am unsure again about the cross contamination, and also the tropical tank I have cycled is showing signs of costia too.  I also have a heater to use to help the cycle speed up before adding the fish, as I understand lower temperatures reduce bacteria production.

 

I didn't want to use bleach as it would mean rinsing so many times, and I have a very bad back, and no pump yet to empty/fill the tank (I do plan on getting one soon, but the money has gone on meds for the fish at the moment) so it will all have to be done with buckets by my longsuffering and wonderful hubby.  

 

I wanted to make it as easy as possible for him and I thought the hydrogen peroxide may be the way to go with less rinsing required.  I have heard that hydrogen peroxide leaves no residue, and that the solution 'dissolves' into hydrogen and oxygen when combined with water.

 

My kh is normally 125 to 130 (7 to 7.5 drops API test) and my gh is normally 170-179 (9.5 to 10 drops API test).  The ph sits stable between 8.1 to 8.4.

 

If someone could answer my questions it would be very much appreciated.  I am sorry if I have asked similar questions in the past, but my threads have gotten so long I cannot find some of the answers and want to be sure.  Thankyou all so much for putting up with me!

 

So, here goes....

 

I was wondering if I could use hydrogen peroxide to disinfect the tank with all the filters (emptied of media) still set up and running on it?  Ie.  filling the tank with fresh water and hydrogen peroxide, connecting the canister filter and running it without any media in it...

 

How much Hydrogen peroxide at 6% hydrogen peroxide would I need to create a solution to disinfect for costia and any other nasty's that may be around?

 

How long exposure would the equipment need to the hydrogen peroxide solution?

 

Would rinsing once be sufficient to dilute the solution enough to be safe for fish?  (what I mean is will it be ok to add the hydrogen peroxide and leave it in the tank for the specified time, then empty the tank/canister, refill with fresh water, empty and refill again, leave it to cycle until Louie is out of QT, do another big WC before adding Louie)

 

How do I make a hydrogen peroxide solution to wipe the outside of equipment that cannot be immersed into the tank solution?

 

I have bought a pond cycling product to help speed up the cycling, and have already started a stocking with flakes in it soaking in some primed water to create some ammonia.  Has anyone used these kind of products to speed up the cycle with success?  This is the product I have purchased, and it has been in the fridge since I bought it... Pondcare Quick Start http://www.thetechden.com.au/Pondcare_Quickstart_473ml_p/aph321.htm

 

Will it be ok to start the cycle at 24degrees Celsius, and then reduce the temp to 18 degrees Celsius (room temperature water which Louies QT tank is at) 24hours prior to adding Louie?

 

I hope all of that makes some sense.  Thanks again for all your valuable insight and experience/recommendations.  I really feel like I am in over my head and you guys all make such a difference to me!  Thankyou, Thankyou, Thankyou!!!!!!

 

 

 

 

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I forgot to add my 2000L/hr canister will be set up with (in order of water flow from the tank, back into the tank):

  • course filter sponge,
  • medium filter sponge, 
  • fine filter sponge,
  • normal filter floss,
  • fine filter floss,
  • 2kg of Biohome Ultimate filter media. 

It seems that it the Biohome Ultimate has nutrients in it to help beneficial bacteria growth, and also will last for years and years.  They also claim the filter media has 1,120 Sq m (12,050 sq ft) of surface area for bacteria for the 2kg of media.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/231559404498?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

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Since Costia is a parasite, it may not live terribly long outside of a host (although I have no idea how long).  

 

You certainly could use hydrogen peroxide to clean the tank.  I suspect most people here don't because it is slightly less available than bleach/perhaps more expensive.  I doubt hydrogen peroxide as a diluted solution (6%) would do much to Costia were it still around after a month (which I really doubt), and you might consider a stronger dilution if you are truly worried about parasites and bacteria living in the tank. 

 

I have no idea how long the solution would need to be in contact with the equipment.

 

Your rinsing suggestions seem perfectly fine - in fact the sort of rinsing we suggest for bleach. 

 

You might want to consider putting the questions about cycling and cycling products in a different thread.  People knowledgable about cycling might not look in a sanitising thread :)

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Since Costia is a parasite, it may not live terribly long outside of a host (although I have no idea how long).  

 

You certainly could use hydrogen peroxide to clean the tank.  I suspect most people here don't because it is slightly less available than bleach/perhaps more expensive.  I doubt hydrogen peroxide as a diluted solution (6%) would do much to Costia were it still around after a month (which I really doubt), and you might consider a stronger dilution if you are truly worried about parasites and bacteria living in the tank. 

 

I have no idea how long the solution would need to be in contact with the equipment.

 

Your rinsing suggestions seem perfectly fine - in fact the sort of rinsing we suggest for bleach. 

 

You might want to consider putting the questions about cycling and cycling products in a different thread.  People knowledgable about cycling might not look in a sanitising thread :)

 

Thanks so much motherredcap, I will post the cycling in a different thread. 

 

The bottle of peroxide I have available to me says "20 volume 6% w/v".  Does that mean 6% dilution?  I really have no idea how strong I would need to get, or how much to combine with water...  do you know?

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Just a thought.... Would I be better off nuking the tank with an overdosed formaldehyde solution first?  My concern with this is the greatly increased possibility of exposure to the formaldehyde.  I often have or develop reactions to chemicals/drugs after exposure, esp things like antibiotics, so I would prefer not to use this method if possible.  I also have asthma, so this is a risk too.

 

My only other option would be the bleach method I guess... but again, I am very sensitive to bleach, and usually end up with sinus/asthma problems after using it, even in a well ventilated area.

 

How strong a concentration would I need if I were to use bleach to eliminate costia, and how long exposure would the equipment need?

 

Does anyone have any other ideas?

Edited by Ree
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Salt at 0.3% did nothing for removing the costia.  What sort of salt concentration would I have to use to be effective at eliminating all bacteria/parasites/viruses? 

 

How much residue of the salt would be left after one rinse?  I need to make sure there is none left so that I can start cycling the tank again.

Edited by Ree
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Sorry for all the fragmented ideas.... The other option is UV.  I have just found website http://www.emperoraquatics.com/harmful-waterborne-pathogens.php#.VV3SAOmJjIU which states that the UV dose for Costia is (Log-3 = 99.9%):

 

Costia necatrix 318 mJ/cm2 (log-3)

 

My UV bulb in my canister filter is a 9w.  How do I find out how to make sure my uv is at the right dose for the costia?

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Can you place the tank in the sun?

 

I can't move it myself.... If I could bleach it outside and then put it in the sun that might be an option... but I would have to see if my father in law and hubby were able to lift the tank after it was emptied.  Unfortunatly the stand goes up and around the tank, so you have to lift it up above chest height to remove it from the stand.  Ill see... how long would I need to leave it in the sun for?

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I just found a brilliant article on cosita and treatment.  http://www.fishhelpline.co.uk/health/costia.html

 

I am not scientific, and don't understand everything in the article, but if someone else can read it and tell me if my ideas are right based on the article and their experience I would be very grateful.

 

It appears my strain of costia is salt resistant, so salt is not an option for sterilising.  Therefore, since formalin is a know killer of costia, I think I would like to:

 

  • bomb my tank with formalin, with the filter running on it (media removed). what amount would I need minimum and for how long?
  • rinse well
  • clean all surfaces in the tank and filter with straight hydrogen peroxide 20 volume 6% w/v (if anyone thinks I need stronger pls let me know, I have no idea if this is right or not)
  • rinse well
  • put in sun for a length of time... how long do I need, and will this be needed?
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You could also use

Potassium Permanganate

 

 

It will wipe it out too... You could soak everything in it, then if you wanted to make sure everything is clean use the HP after, this will neutralize the PP and kill anything left :o

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You could also use

Potassium Permanganate

 

 

It will wipe it out too... You could soak everything in it, then if you wanted to make sure everything is clean use the HP after, this will neutralize the PP and kill anything left :o

 

That sounds like a brilliant plan!    How much Potassium Permanganate will I need to bomb the tank...  Its a 220L when completely full.   So how much PP would I need per L or per 20L or per gal or what ever measurement is easier to work out... sorry... brain fuzzy tonight... its 12.25am here.  :yikes

 

I could run the filter on it with the PP in the water couldn't I? 

 

Would the PP stain the canister?  I could cover it I suppose with plastic before I add it to the tank???  Sorry... thinking out loud. :teehee

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You could also use

Potassium Permanganate

 

 

It will wipe it out too... You could soak everything in it, then if you wanted to make sure everything is clean use the HP after, this will neutralize the PP and kill anything left :o

 

That sounds like a brilliant plan!    How much Potassium Permanganate will I need to bomb the tank...  Its a 220L when completely full.   So how much PP would I need per L or per 20L or per gal or what ever measurement is easier to work out... sorry... brain fuzzy tonight... its 12.25am here.  :yikes

 

I could run the filter on it with the PP in the water couldn't I? 

 

Would the PP stain the canister?  I could cover it I suppose with plastic before I add it to the tank???  Sorry... thinking out loud. :teehee

 

 

PP will stain things hun... you will want to use Gloves with this stuff....

 

You want to use about 5 tablespoons per 10 gallons (38-40L) and use the same rinse instructions as  bleach. You can go more if you want to nuke it out....

 

Yes you can let the filter run this way :)

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You could also use

Potassium Permanganate

 

 

It will wipe it out too... You could soak everything in it, then if you wanted to make sure everything is clean use the HP after, this will neutralize the PP and kill anything left :o

 

That sounds like a brilliant plan!    How much Potassium Permanganate will I need to bomb the tank...  Its a 220L when completely full.   So how much PP would I need per L or per 20L or per gal or what ever measurement is easier to work out... sorry... brain fuzzy tonight... its 12.25am here.  :yikes

 

I could run the filter on it with the PP in the water couldn't I? 

 

Would the PP stain the canister?  I could cover it I suppose with plastic before I add it to the tank???  Sorry... thinking out loud. :teehee

 

 

PP will stain things hun... you will want to use Gloves with this stuff....

 

You want to use about 5 tablespoons per 10 gallons (38-40L) and use the same rinse instructions as  bleach. You can go more if you want to nuke it out....

 

Yes you can let the filter run this way :)

 

 

Ok Koko, thanks for that... I will see how expensive it is and add as much as I can... and will have plenty of old towels on the floor so it doesn't get stained, and gloves... a drop sheet might be a good idea hay! 

 

Thakyou Koko.... how much HP do I need to neutralise the PP?

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You could also use

Potassium Permanganate

 

 

It will wipe it out too... You could soak everything in it, then if you wanted to make sure everything is clean use the HP after, this will neutralize the PP and kill anything left :o

 

That sounds like a brilliant plan!    How much Potassium Permanganate will I need to bomb the tank...  Its a 220L when completely full.   So how much PP would I need per L or per 20L or per gal or what ever measurement is easier to work out... sorry... brain fuzzy tonight... its 12.25am here.  :yikes

 

I could run the filter on it with the PP in the water couldn't I? 

 

Would the PP stain the canister?  I could cover it I suppose with plastic before I add it to the tank???  Sorry... thinking out loud. :teehee

 

 

PP will stain things hun... you will want to use Gloves with this stuff....

 

You want to use about 5 tablespoons per 10 gallons (38-40L) and use the same rinse instructions as  bleach. You can go more if you want to nuke it out....

 

Yes you can let the filter run this way :)

 

 

Ok Koko, thanks for that... I will see how expensive it is and add as much as I can... and will have plenty of old towels on the floor so it doesn't get stained, and gloves... a drop sheet might be a good idea hay! 

 

Thakyou Koko.... how much HP do I need to neutralise the PP?

 

 

 

Now I want to make sure there isnt fish in this right?

 

If so you would use enough HP till the water turns from Purple to brown..... Then let that run for a day.... then you will need to rinse rinse rinse... In fact I would run the tank with just water for a day then drain and run for a few hours by its self again before the fish are added :)

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You could also use

Potassium Permanganate

 

 

It will wipe it out too... You could soak everything in it, then if you wanted to make sure everything is clean use the HP after, this will neutralize the PP and kill anything left :o

 

That sounds like a brilliant plan!    How much Potassium Permanganate will I need to bomb the tank...  Its a 220L when completely full.   So how much PP would I need per L or per 20L or per gal or what ever measurement is easier to work out... sorry... brain fuzzy tonight... its 12.25am here.  :yikes

 

I could run the filter on it with the PP in the water couldn't I? 

 

Would the PP stain the canister?  I could cover it I suppose with plastic before I add it to the tank???  Sorry... thinking out loud. :teehee

 

 

PP will stain things hun... you will want to use Gloves with this stuff....

 

You want to use about 5 tablespoons per 10 gallons (38-40L) and use the same rinse instructions as  bleach. You can go more if you want to nuke it out....

 

Yes you can let the filter run this way :)

 

 

Ok Koko, thanks for that... I will see how expensive it is and add as much as I can... and will have plenty of old towels on the floor so it doesn't get stained, and gloves... a drop sheet might be a good idea hay! 

 

Thakyou Koko.... how much HP do I need to neutralise the PP?

 

 

 

Now I want to make sure there isnt fish in this right?

 

If so you would use enough HP till the water turns from Purple to brown..... Then let that run for a day.... then you will need to rinse rinse rinse... In fact I would run the tank with just water for a day then drain and run for a few hours by its self again before the fish are added :)

 

 

NO FISH?  :yikes

 

:teehee OH OK... NO FISH.... :teehee

 

No, there are no fish in there at the moment.  They are both in separate QT tanks being treated.  Poor babies!

 

I will make sure there is plenty of rinsing... I am OCD and very good at either cleaning or rinsing the living daylights out of things! 

 

Thanks so much for the help and support Koko!  It is very very much appreciated! :hi

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Using bleach does not require lots of rinsing.  Give the tank a good scrubbing before bleaching.  Fill the tank with 10% bleach toss in anything you want the disinfect If you are disinfecting a filter, run it as usual.  Ten minutes is the minimum time of contact with the bleach solution for disinfection.   I'd use a half hour or so.  After that, drain the bleach, rinse everything with running water until the smell goes away, and dry it completely.  There is no dry form of chlorine bleach.  When the tank is dry the bleach is gone.  If it still worries you, bleach disinfects with chlorine, and your dechlorinator will remove that.

 

PP is a good disinfectant.  The problem I have with it is that I can't find consistent information on how to use it as a disinfectant.  It has much the same problems as bleach -- both are highly toxic in concentrated form.  Bleach bleaches and PP stains.

  

Hydrogen peroxide is a weak disinfectant.  I wouldn't even think of trying to disinfect a contaminated tank with it.

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Hydrogen peroxide is a weak disinfectant.  I wouldn't even think of trying to disinfect a contaminated tank with it.

 

 

Just so everyone knows I wasnt think of the HP as a cleaner more of a neutralizer after the PP :)

 

Like a double clean :)

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Using bleach does not require lots of rinsing.  Give the tank a good scrubbing before bleaching.  Fill the tank with 10% bleach toss in anything you want the disinfect If you are disinfecting a filter, run it as usual.  Ten minutes is the minimum time of contact with the bleach solution for disinfection.   I'd use a half hour or so.  After that, drain the bleach, rinse everything with running water until the smell goes away, and dry it completely.  There is no dry form of chlorine bleach.  When the tank is dry the bleach is gone.  If it still worries you, bleach disinfects with chlorine, and your dechlorinator will remove that.

 

PP is a good disinfectant.  The problem I have with it is that I can't find consistent information on how to use it as a disinfectant.  It has much the same problems as bleach -- both are highly toxic in concentrated form.  Bleach bleaches and PP stains.

  

Hydrogen peroxide is a weak disinfectant.  I wouldn't even think of trying to disinfect a contaminated tank with it.

 

Ok, thanks for all that Sharon.   Ill have a look and see how much bleach I have.  I would need... 22L for a 220L tank?  is that right or is my brain having a moment?

 

Do you know if bleach kills costia?

Edited by Ree
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Hydrogen peroxide is a weak disinfectant.  I wouldn't even think of trying to disinfect a contaminated tank with it.

 

 

Just so everyone knows I wasnt think of the HP as a cleaner more of a neutralizer after the PP :)

 

Like a double clean :)

 

 

That's OK Koko, I knew you meant it as a PP neutraliser. :D

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Using bleach does not require lots of rinsing.  Give the tank a good scrubbing before bleaching.  Fill the tank with 10% bleach toss in anything you want the disinfect If you are disinfecting a filter, run it as usual.  Ten minutes is the minimum time of contact with the bleach solution for disinfection.   I'd use a half hour or so.  After that, drain the bleach, rinse everything with running water until the smell goes away, and dry it completely.  There is no dry form of chlorine bleach.  When the tank is dry the bleach is gone.  If it still worries you, bleach disinfects with chlorine, and your dechlorinator will remove that.

 

PP is a good disinfectant.  The problem I have with it is that I can't find consistent information on how to use it as a disinfectant.  It has much the same problems as bleach -- both are highly toxic in concentrated form.  Bleach bleaches and PP stains.

  

Hydrogen peroxide is a weak disinfectant.  I wouldn't even think of trying to disinfect a contaminated tank with it.

 

Ok, thanks for all that Sharon.   Ill have a look and see how much bleach I have.  I would need... 22L for a 220L tank?  is that right or is my brain having a moment?

 

Do you know if bleach kills costia?

 

Yes, that's right, and yes, bleach kills costia.  You want fresh bleach because it deteriorates after opening the bottle.  You could also consider using half as much bleach and treating twice as long.  I'd recommend PP if I knew how to prepare it.  I find so many recommendations for adding it until you get a nice shade of magenta (???) or sometimes purple.  

 

Koko, I know what you meant, but you sniped me, so I didn't know you had said it when I was writing my post.   :unsure:    I was talking to Ree.  (Does this make any sense at all?)    :hmm

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Using bleach does not require lots of rinsing.  Give the tank a good scrubbing before bleaching.  Fill the tank with 10% bleach toss in anything you want the disinfect If you are disinfecting a filter, run it as usual.  Ten minutes is the minimum time of contact with the bleach solution for disinfection.   I'd use a half hour or so.  After that, drain the bleach, rinse everything with running water until the smell goes away, and dry it completely.  There is no dry form of chlorine bleach.  When the tank is dry the bleach is gone.  If it still worries you, bleach disinfects with chlorine, and your dechlorinator will remove that.

 

PP is a good disinfectant.  The problem I have with it is that I can't find consistent information on how to use it as a disinfectant.  It has much the same problems as bleach -- both are highly toxic in concentrated form.  Bleach bleaches and PP stains.

  

Hydrogen peroxide is a weak disinfectant.  I wouldn't even think of trying to disinfect a contaminated tank with it.

 

Ok, thanks for all that Sharon.   Ill have a look and see how much bleach I have.  I would need... 22L for a 220L tank?  is that right or is my brain having a moment?

 

Do you know if bleach kills costia?

 

Yes, that's right, and yes, bleach kills costia.  You want fresh bleach because it deteriorates after opening the bottle.  You could also consider using half as much bleach and treating twice as long.  I'd recommend PP if I knew how to prepare it.  I find so many recommendations for adding it until you get a nice shade of magenta (???) or sometimes purple.  

 

Koko, I know what you meant, but you sniped me, so I didn't know you had said it when I was writing my post.   :unsure:    I was talking to Ree.  (Does this make any sense at all?)    :hmm

 

 

Ok.... I undergustumble!   :D

 

Ok... I will have to check which is more available in my little ol country hick town... the PP or the bleach... I'm guessing the bleach... and I will make sure I have a whole stack of prime on hand to eliminate it afterwards... I think I just bought a new 1L bottle... will that be enough????

 

Does PP have any fumes?

 

Thanks so much for your help Sharon!

Edited by Ree
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You don't need lots of Prime.  Remember the bleach disappears when the tank is completely dry.

 

PP is usually found in hardware stores where they have water filters (for people, not fish).  If you inhale dry PP or get it in your eyes, it's not good. Once you get it in water it's only bad if you drink it, get it in your eyes, or get a lot on your skin..

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You don't need lots of Prime.  Remember the bleach disappears when the tank is completely dry.

 

PP is usually found in hardware stores where they have water filters (for people, not fish).  If you inhale dry PP or get it in your eyes, it's not good. Once you get it in water it's only bad if you drink it, get it in your eyes, or get a lot on your skin..

 

Ok Sharon, no drinking straws in the tank then!  :no:   I will be careful if I use the PP.  I really didn't know that about bleach disappearing when dry before you mentioned it!  I will have to keep that in mind.  Its not so scary then!  Thanks Sharon :hi

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