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misssmountain

Oranda has a torn/frayed dorsal fin

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  • Test Results for the Following:
    • * Ammonia Level(Tank) - 0
    • * Nitrite Level(Tank) - 0
    • * Nitrate level(Tank) - 10
    • * Ammonia Level(Tap) - 0.25-0.5
    • * Nitrite Level(Tap) - 0
    • * Nitrate level(Tap) - 5
    • * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) - 8.2
    • * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) - 8.0-8.2
    • Other Required Info:
      • * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API test, drops
      • * Water temperature? 75 degrees F
      • * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? - 60 gallons, since December 2014
      • * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? - Penguin 200 HOB, Rena Filstar L canister
      • * How often do you change the water and how much? - 2x per week, about 90-95%
  • * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? - Thursday, 95%
  • * How many fish in the tank and their size? - 4, one about 4", other 3 are all about 3.25"
  • * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Prime
  • * What do you feed your fish and how often? Hikari saki pellets, small meals a two or three times a day, frozen brine shrimp and bloodworms every other day
  • * Any new fish added to the tank? no
  • * Any medications added to the tank? no
  • * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. - 3 weeks of Prazi and 0.3% salt back in February. This fish also went through 3 salt dips for suspected flukes
  • * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? - frayed dorsal fin
  • * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? - some flashing here and there

 

 

Hi everyone again,

 

My fish in the hospital tank is doing very well and I hope to move her back to the main tank late next week!

 

A few questions on my Oranda, Mamba....her dorsal fin has gotten very torn/frayed/shredded looking over the past few weeks. My fish Nacho also went through a long process with similar symptoms, which I was finally able to get under control after 3 weeks of double Prazi and 0.3% salt, and 3 rounds of salt dips, which Mamba was also included in because of some excessive slime coat on her dorsal. After that, we increased the size and frequency of the water changes in my tank. I change as close to 100% as I can get two times per week. Nacho's dorsal fin is almost healed now -- just waiting on it to grow back, but it is no longer torn or frayed or anything. Treatment detailed in this super long thread here: http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/119861-white-markings-on-orandas-tail-have-me-stumped/?hl=nacho#entry1851077

 

Mamba's other fins all look fine. She does do some flashing against the sand on the bottom of the tank occasionally -- you can see an example of this behavior right at the beginning of the video. There still seems to be some excess slime coat on her dorsal/back too, which you can also see. Other than that, she pretty much acts normally...eats well, etc.

 

I'm not sure if I should try a fluke treatment again...the hospital tank should be open as of next week and it's already set up...I could always throw her in some super clean water and see what happens? I have Melafix as well, not sure if that would be helpful? Please advise, I'm stumped once again!

 

Nevermind the Sex and the City noise in the background, LOL!

 

Edited by misssmountain

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Hi. I tried to watch your video but it said I have to be signed in to view. You may need to change your settings to public so koko's members can view it. :)

Edited by goldfishgirl82

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Beautiful fish, I hope her fin heals for you and her quickly.

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How long ago was the 0.3% salt and Prazi treatment?.  Was it Prazipro liquid?  

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How long ago was the 0.3% salt and Prazi treatment?.  Was it Prazipro liquid?  

 

Yes, the Hikari brand PraziPro liquid. 

 

My treatment schedule was:

 

ALL DONE AT 0.3% SALT

 

Day 1: 75% WC, double dose Prazi, salt dip affected fish

Day 3: salt dip affected fish

Day 5: 75% WC

Day 7: 50% WC, double dose Prazi, salt dip affected fish

Day 11: 100% WC, double dose Prazi

Day 15: 100% WC, reduce to 0.1% salt

Day 17: 100% WC, maintain 0.1% salt, double dose Prazi

Day 22: Large water change, no salt or Prazi

 

So, it was a total of about 3 weeks, as you can see. I followed the instructions I was given on here exactly.

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Maybe try a round of Prazi and salt at just 0.1 % and see if there is improvement.

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I forgot to say this was in February.

Should I do this in the main tank? Any salt dips? For how long, and what is the schedule? (Sorry so many questions! And thank you for the response!)

It actually seems to have gotten a little worse since I took the video. :(

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I forgot to say this was in February.

Should I do this in the main tank? Any salt dips? For how long, and what is the schedule? (Sorry so many questions! And thank you for the response!)

It actually seems to have gotten a little worse since I took the video. :(

It seems parasitic and not bacterial, though I'm not sure what kind of parasite.  So, yes I would start with a round of Prazi in the main tank with no salt.  If the flukes have persisted, the Prazi should help.  If there is no improvement with the Prazi, then I would try 0.3% salt again.

 

If this improves with the Prazi, I would do four 5-day rounds.  No salt dips for now.  

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What a beautiful fish, I hope she's better soon!

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I forgot to say this was in February.

Should I do this in the main tank? Any salt dips? For how long, and what is the schedule? (Sorry so many questions! And thank you for the response!)

It actually seems to have gotten a little worse since I took the video. :(

It seems parasitic and not bacterial, though I'm not sure what kind of parasite.  So, yes I would start with a round of Prazi in the main tank with no salt.  If the flukes have persisted, the Prazi should help.  If there is no improvement with the Prazi, then I would try 0.3% salt again.

 

If this improves with the Prazi, I would do four 5-day rounds.  No salt dips for now.  

 

 

Sounds good...I'm doing a big WC tonight and will add Prazi, but no salt. I just checked out the Prazi schedules...do you think the 7-day rounds would be okay? I'll do the 5-day if that's better, but I have family in town starting this weekend and throughout next week and that might work out better for me, on a personal note. :) 

 

If the Prazi does end up being effective, does it usually work pretty quickly? I'm just curious when I could potentially start to see improvement if we're on the right track. I just can't wait until all 4 of my babies' health is under control! It's been pretty hectic this year so far  :wacko:

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Yes, you can do the seven day rounds, but be sure to do the second dose of Prazi on day 2 per the Prazi protocol directions (link below my sig).

 

Hard to say.  I would give it a week.

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Yes, you can do the seven day rounds, but be sure to do the second dose of Prazi on day 2 per the Prazi protocol directions (link below my sig).

 

Hard to say.  I would give it a week.

No improvement yet, although I did just dose the prazi on Monday and Tuesday. I've noticed what I would describe as a slightly excessive amount of white stringy poo coming from her lately...what does that usually mean??

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Yes, you can do the seven day rounds, but be sure to do the second dose of Prazi on day 2 per the Prazi protocol directions (link below my sig).

 

Hard to say.  I would give it a week.

No improvement yet, although I did just dose the prazi on Monday and Tuesday. I've noticed what I would describe as a slightly excessive amount of white stringy poo coming from her lately...what does that usually mean??

 

It usually takes a couple of rounds to see improvement.  The stringy poo can indicate a number of things.  If the fish's behavior is normal, I wouldn't be to concerned.  If you see prolonged bottom sitting, then there may be an internal infection which will probably require antibiotics.

 

I will be away this weekend.  If you need help and no one responds, us the report button :)

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Added more Prazi after my WC last night...still no change, but I was wondering about something. This fish likes to hang out at the top of the tank when she rests. My other two hang near the bottom when they sleep, but this one is always in the same spot, up near the filter. I don't think the behavior is anything alarming, because when she is active, she looks great and she is eating. But I was thinking -- when she's in her resting mode, I think it's possible her dorsal sticks out of the water some. Could this be the problem? Her other finnage looks perfect...it's just the dorsal that's messed up. I'm not sure how I could test this theory, it's not like I can just ask her to stay a little deeper in the water, LOL. Anyway, just curious if this could be part of the problem. Let me know your thoughts.

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That could definitely be contributing to the problem.

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I've seen dorsal OR pelvic issue on floating fish. While the exposed fin is drying out of water, slime coat dries too. As finnage is relatively vulnerable, it is more easily damaged...and breaks.

 

Just a theory but it makes sense.

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I've seen dorsal OR pelvic issue on floating fish. While the exposed fin is drying out of water, slime coat dries too. As finnage is relatively vulnerable, it is more easily damaged...and breaks.

 

Just a theory but it makes sense.

 

Yeah, I hear that. And since she is hanging out up there a lot, maybe the breakage never gets a chance to repair itself. She does get some slime coat buildup on the dorsal as well from time to time, I wonder if it gets excessive to make up for the dryness. 

 

The fish has zero symptoms aside from her dorsal fin looking a little chopped up, so yeah...we will see. It makes sense in my mind that if it were something else, I'd see similar things happening to her other finnage maybe? I'm still going to Prazi for a few more rounds, though.

Edited by misssmountain

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You may want to investigate why she is hanging up there so much.  That's not a normal behavior.  Possible reasons include:

 

Too much current

Constipation

Parasites

Internal infection

Bullying

Low Oxygen

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May I also suggest  a 3 day fasting... Just to make sure we are floating from foods :(

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You may want to investigate why she is hanging up there so much.  That's not a normal behavior.  Possible reasons include:

 

Too much current

Constipation

Parasites

Internal infection

Bullying

Low Oxygen

 

This fish does have a history of SBD...she gulps air from the surface a lot. My canister filter is pointed toward the aquarium wall, I have one large airstone/bubble bar thing, and a Penguin 200 HOB. I see plenty of tiny oxygen bubbles, and I don't think the current is too much, all of my other fish seem to do fine. Unless she is just fragile from her floaty issues and looking for a calmer place to rest? I've never seen any bullying. Constipation could be, I could try a fast...and how would I figure out if it's parasites or internal infection??

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Okay, so it still seems to be gradually getting worse with the dorsal fin...is there anything else I can try besides Prazi? I've only done two of the 7-day rounds so far (still no salt). Just curious how to proceed. Thanks, and thank you also for all of your help so far. 

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Okay, so it still seems to be gradually getting worse with the dorsal fin...is there anything else I can try besides Prazi? I've only done two of the 7-day rounds so far (still no salt). Just curious how to proceed. Thanks, and thank you also for all of your help so far. 

What about moving her to a QT to see if the floating behavior will stop?  I think the dorsal sticking out of the water may be contributing to the problem.  What does the fin look like now?

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Drying out won't help the wound healing, I agree. It's a bit of a quandary with the floating issues, though.

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Okay, so it still seems to be gradually getting worse with the dorsal fin...is there anything else I can try besides Prazi? I've only done two of the 7-day rounds so far (still no salt). Just curious how to proceed. Thanks, and thank you also for all of your help so far.

What about moving her to a QT to see if the floating behavior will stop?  I think the dorsal sticking out of the water may be contributing to the problem.  What does the fin look like now?

I can try a QT as soon as T goes back in the main tank and the 10g is free. I fasted them over the weekend...not cold turkey, but I only fed one verrrry small meal once a day, and she actually does seem to have stopped hanging out near the top some. She's an air gulper (and got all of my other fish into the habit too...grrr) so I wonder if that may be the root of the floating problem. The fin looks similar to the video, just slightly worse...no improvement at all yet.

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