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Fish in a Dish - it is enough to make you cry


TonySydney

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Hi Everyone,

 

I was reading Kokos excellent article on water changes that I have in my Evernote Account when a pop up from Evernote said this is a related article: Fish in a Dish Craze. So naturally I had a look, I felt sick as soon as I read the first paragraph:

 

http://blogs.wsj.com/japanrealtime/2015/03/13/fish-in-a-dish-the-next-pet-craze/

 

The guy behind this is supposed to be a fish expert  :no:  :mad:

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Well...that just proves that someone can CLAIM to be an expert and it NOT BE TRUE!!!  What is sad is that there are people out there who will believe his "information" to be true & follow it....tho I do not see how keeping ANY fish in a small bowl like that can be appealing to anyone!!  A big part of fish keeping is enjoying watching them swim happily around!!

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Wow, that is crazy!  I like how he says keeping goldfish in tanks is objectifying them, but keeping them in a bowl like a trinket that you can carry around with you or give as a gift somehow is not.  And where do they even mention the size a goldfish can grow to?  That would be a pretty big dish, not to mention heavy to carry around :)

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First of all I'd like to say that he is right about a few things. One goldfish can be kept in a bowl if done properly. The Chinese have done it for a long time and some people will get negligent with the tanks and let the water get so bad that it would be better for the fish to have it in a bowl with daily or tice daily water changes.
But that's as far as ill go with that one. I believe that a well maintained tank is a much much much better way to keep them myself.

Also goldfish can't live in the wild he says..... someone must have forgotten to tell these.
http://www.businessinsider.com/colorado-lake-infested-with-goldfish-2015-4

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I agree with Daniel that this is a cultural thing to some degree.  There is something very Zen and beautiful about the simplicity of a nice, large pot or bowl with a single goldfish.  I think it's fine in a "gigantic" shallow bowl of many gallons like I've seen in China and Japan, but not in one as small as in this article.  

 

I would need one of these :rofl

goldfish_pots.jpg

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There was someone on Instagram that had tanks as well as a giant bowl (like pictured above) with two small fish in it. I remember being horrified at first but as I went through the thread I saw that it was actually maintained very well and the fish were stunning!

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There is a huge difference between the giant bowls that the ancient chinese used and a 'rice bowl' like the article suggests using. The giant chinese bowls mimic pond life, from what I have read. Tiny bowls definitely do not do that.

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A goldfish in a dish bowl is about the same as a goldfish bowl :no: Goldfish bowls are small portable things too, still not any better in a dish. And just because the fish are in small containers like bowls or dishes doesn't mean the water will be changed every day. I have known lots of people who had owned goldfish or Bettas in bowls and have gone to a month or more without a water change. A person that doesn't change the water in his/her tank regularly will not be more likely to change the bowl water daily, maybe even less likely because that person will have to change the bowl water once to twice a day compared to once to twice a week. Guess it all depends on how well you take care of your fish whether in a tank or bowl. It all depends on the individual I suppose, but most people I know already take bad care of their fish so putting the fish in a bowl is a bad idea. :badidea

 

Also a fish in a dish is still an idea I wouldn't do because imagine carrying a dish around sloshing water all over or dropping the dish while walking or having it knocked over off of the counter, table or desk etc. by you, friend, a child or pet, etc.. :o

 

Being in a tank doesn't mean the goldfish are distanced from us. I can say I always go look in on my fish many times a day. Some for feedings throughout the day, checking the temp of the thermometer, seeing how the filters are doing, turning lights on or off, or just going to watch the fish I am interacting with them in one way or another. I talk to them, put my hands on the glass, open the lid sometimes to hand feed a snack. At least I know my fish is safer in the tank than in a bowl.  

 

Some cultures may have done this for years, but it is not my choice. And what happens when they outgrow the bowl? they are bound to end up in a tank or pond in the end anyway right? :idont

 

The only time I will use a bowl will be for a short photo shoot, or video while doing their weights, measurements or for close inspection or medical treatment for some reason.

 

To each their own if they can do it properly, but I just don't think it is a very good way to keep a fish, but that is my opinion :)

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It is also part of their "culture" in some areas to rape women, mutilate genitals, and slice off heads. Doesn't make it right.

Sounds like fun we should add that to culture week in elementary schools :yikes
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You can absolutely keep goldfish in shallow dish or bowl safely and healthfully, provided you follow the actual advice used for centuries of changing the water every day, preferable morning AND evening. It's not necessarily cruelty at all. Just like the best filtering agent for a goldfish tank is arguably a sponge filter and frequent, large water changes. High tech and complex isn't necessarily better, and more space isn't necessarily better if it leads to lax maintenance routines.

I do believe that was his point, and if his advice is followed properly it is a good turn for the hobby compared to the current recommendations most people seem to believe are beneficial, outside of places like Koko's.

The danger is that someone will put their goldfish in a dish or bowl and NOT do religious daily water changes. That's trouble waiting to happen. But ornamental goldfish with bred and kept enormous and healthfully for centuries with just such practices as he is advocating, and I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the wisdom behind shallow containers and plentiful fresh, properly aged water.

Edited by Arctic Mama
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You can absolutely keep goldfish in shallow dish or bowl safely and healthfully, provided you follow the actual advice used for centuries of changing the water every day, preferable morning AND evening. It's not necessarily cruelty at all. Just like the best filtering agent for a goldfish tank is arguably a sponge filter and frequent, large water changes. High tech and complex isn't necessarily better, and more space isn't necessarily better if it leads to lax maintenance routines.

I do believe that was his point, and if his advice is followed properly it is a good turn for the hobby compared to the current recommendations most people seem to believe are beneficial, outside of places like Koko's.

The danger is that someone will put their goldfish in a dish or bowl and NOT do religious daily water changes. That's trouble waiting to happen. But ornamental goldfish with bred and kept enormous and healthfully for centuries with just such practices as he is advocating, and I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the wisdom behind shallow containers and plentiful fresh, properly aged water.

Please tell me how an enormous fish fits in a soup bowl. I'm bewildered. I would and do dismiss his idea immediately. I had a fish in a 15 gallon qt once that was taking ammonia to 1 ppm in 24 hours. I don't even consider him enormous. The bowl the guy suggests is less than half a gallon which would mean ammonia at about 30 ppm by the end of 24 hours? That's a dead fish guaranteed.

Edited by DieselPlower
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Oh I don't agree with what he said or the bowl he suggest. The only thing I agreed with is that some people with the tank and filters as a "I dont have to do anything" excuse and end up with a less than favorable result.

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I avoided opening this thread for about half an hour because of the title.  Curiosity got me I guess, for I ended up opening it and reading the story.

 

That is sick.  Just sick.

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How can anyone advocate this? I can't really tell how much of the blame for this article rests on Mr Okamoto or the reporter.

1. How does a bowl objectify the goldfish any less than a tank? And what is meant by objectification anyway...keeping any animal can be seen as objectification as by definition the animal becomes our personal belonging. But with this should hopefully come respect and responsibility for that animal. If anything a large glass tank is more enjoyable than an opaque bowl as you can admire your fish better and watch its behaviours...if people are going to neglect a fish in a tank they're going to tire of having a fish squished in a bowl even quicker.

2.Build the same relationship you have with a dog or a cat? I'm not saying that fish can't be personable but if you want a dog or a cat, buy one. We love our fish and our fish love food. Some animals, fish, snakes, small rodents etc aren't huggable emotionally dependant animals and as a responsible owner it's more important to let a fish be a fish, ie give it plenty of space to swim, then put it in a little bowl so that you can stroke it as though it were a puppy. It's not.

3. " Goldfish are man-made fish that can't live without human care." As mentioned, not true. And since when could we do what we liked with an animal just because it's selectively bred? This is the same attitude that started the craze of dressing up dogs every morning, painting their nails and carrying them everywhere. Let animals be animals.

5. Finally the guy who's talking about the positives of his fish bowl, " doesn't take up too much space and easy to move around." I think that if you're not willing to commit enough space for your fish then simply don't get one. Why does anyone need to carry a fish around anyway? Surely this would stress out a fish if it were constant? I think that's what worries me most about this, at least the financial commitment of buying a tank, filter, lights etc, probably filters out lots of people who only want the fish as a novelty. Selling fish cheaply in bowls is just going to result in spontaneous buying and then neglect. :(

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