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Splain this to me Lusy,


mickeyrom

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Goldfish are judged on movement, physical aspects such as colour, also standards of body shape/development such as wens for Ranchu, backs for Ryukins, even eyes for Telescopes, etc... :)

http://www.americangoldfish1.org/goldfish%20standards.htm

Fish like Jikins have specific desired colour patterns, though.

Dog showing is quite a world! :o I'd love to have a Shiba someday. A Shiba and a Corgi. :heart

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You're right that at times it can be something to be skeptical on, but other times it leads to things like the dog study you mentioned earlier. 

 

 

Allan, goldfish also have standards for shows. It's neat. There are goldfish associations around the world that have breed standards and everything.

Oh I know that Chelsea. There are shows for virtually any species that man keeps. I have been to at least one dog show, while there was a fish show at the same venue. AKC is a big time organization. They are the sanctioning body for dog shows, or at least most of them. Is there such an organization for fish?

You know one difference though...we eat fish, and in most cultures we do NOT eat our best friends.....dogs.

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You're right that at times it can be something to be skeptical on, but other times it leads to things like the dog study you mentioned earlier. 

 

 

Allan, goldfish also have standards for shows. It's neat. There are goldfish associations around the world that have breed standards and everything.

Oh I know that Chelsea. There are shows for virtually any species that man keeps. I have been to at least one dog show, while there was a fish show at the same venue. AKC is a big time organization. They are the sanctioning body for dog shows, or at least most of them. Is there such an organization for fish?

You know one difference though...we eat fish, and in most cultures we do NOT eat our best friends.....dogs.

 

Yep, I eat fish too... but never carp, because I don't like the taste. I wouldn't imagine a goldfish to taste good either, since they're part of that family of fish. 

 

There's the American Goldfish Association, just like the AKC. http://americangoldfish.org/about-us/

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Fish are Fish....

 

Dogs are Dogs...

 

Cats are Cats ..... So we should leave it at that.....

 

Dogs and cats know when your upset... Goldfish are community fish and love attention... I dont think goldfish have the mental capacity to know or understand when a Human is upset (crying, mad ect.)  I will always love all my pets no matter what.... But I know that each pet is built for there own thing...Example my Geck wouldnt let me treat him like a a cat :no:  He was a Gecko treat him as such..... I dont see a goldfish being held and cuddled like a cat or dog...

 

I love goldfish as everyone can see but goldfish are water pets and just want your attention or affection..... thats all :)

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Goldfish are judged on movement, physical aspects such as colour, also standards of body shape/development such as wens for Ranchu, backs for Ryukins, even eyes for Telescopes, etc... :)

http://www.americangoldfish1.org/goldfish%20standards.htm

Fish like Jikins have specific desired colour patterns, though.

Dog showing is quite a world! :o I'd love to have a Shiba someday. A Shiba and a Corgi. :heart

 

Our Shiba, a Mickey grand doughter is going to be 15 in July. I am getting depressed just projecting her limited future. :(  Missy is doing fine ath this time, but even for a Shiba, she is old. Her father lived to almost 17, but it was not a great quality of life at the end. He was not euthanized. He just died.

Which Corgi do you like? Shibas are great dogs, but they can be snarky, and they shed an awful lot.

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Fish are Fish....

 

Dogs are Dogs...

 

Cats are Cats ..... So we should leave it at that.....

 

Dogs and cats know when your upset... Goldfish are community fish and love attention... I dont think goldfish have the mental capacity to know or understand when a Human is upset (crying, mad ect.)  I will always love all my pets no matter what.... But I know that each pet is built for there own thing...Example my Geck wouldnt let me treat him like a a cat :no:  He was a Gecko treat him as such..... I dont see a goldfish being held and cuddled like a cat or dog...

 

I love goldfish as everyone can see but goldfish are water pets and just want your attention or affection..... thats all :)

It just got sidetracked somehow Koko. Sorry about that.

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You're right that at times it can be something to be skeptical on, but other times it leads to things like the dog study you mentioned earlier. 

 

 

Allan, goldfish also have standards for shows. It's neat. There are goldfish associations around the world that have breed standards and everything.

Oh I know that Chelsea. There are shows for virtually any species that man keeps. I have been to at least one dog show, while there was a fish show at the same venue. AKC is a big time organization. They are the sanctioning body for dog shows, or at least most of them. Is there such an organization for fish?

You know one difference though...we eat fish, and in most cultures we do NOT eat our best friends.....dogs.

 

Yep, I eat fish too... but never carp, because I don't like the taste. I wouldn't imagine a goldfish to taste good either, since they're part of that family of fish. 

 

There's the American Goldfish Association, just like the AKC. http://americangoldfish.org/about-us/

 

Please don't tell me there are GF that are registered and they have bloodlines which you can trace. Do they also sanction the shows?

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You're right that at times it can be something to be skeptical on, but other times it leads to things like the dog study you mentioned earlier. 

 

 

Allan, goldfish also have standards for shows. It's neat. There are goldfish associations around the world that have breed standards and everything.

Oh I know that Chelsea. There are shows for virtually any species that man keeps. I have been to at least one dog show, while there was a fish show at the same venue. AKC is a big time organization. They are the sanctioning body for dog shows, or at least most of them. Is there such an organization for fish?

You know one difference though...we eat fish, and in most cultures we do NOT eat our best friends.....dogs.

 

Yep, I eat fish too... but never carp, because I don't like the taste. I wouldn't imagine a goldfish to taste good either, since they're part of that family of fish. 

 

There's the American Goldfish Association, just like the AKC. http://americangoldfish.org/about-us/

 

Please don't tell me there are GF that are registered and they have bloodlines which you can trace. Do they also sanction the shows?

 

I'm pretty sure they do have bloodlines, but not exactly like dogs. There are things like "Bluebelly" and different strains of fish from different origins, like Thai vs. Chinese Orandas. There's a lot that rides on genetics with goldfish.

 

According to the AGA website, they do sanction shows.

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Wait til Mikeyrom finds out that Koi can sell for $30,000 and more!

I just found out, but why would anybody pay that much for any fish? BTW some friends of ours, about 20 years ago, sold an Alaskan Malamute to people in Japan for 40K, I didn't even like him.

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Wait til Mikeyrom finds out that Koi can sell for $30,000 and more!

I just found out, but why would anybody pay that much for any fish? BTW some friends of ours, about 20 years ago, sold an Alaskan Malamute to people in Japan for 40K, I didn't even like him.

 

Many reasons. Fish are shown to standards, just like dogs. Body conformation, color, pattern, quality etc all play a roll. People will pay more for a champion than they will a pond mutt. And yes, they do follow family line etc. 

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The AGA sanctions shows and judges.  Goldfish do not have pedigrees.  Typically breeders use two males with a female for spawning.  They are, however, often using linebred strains in which the members are so closely related, that breeders can recognize them as belonging to that strain.  

 

Goldfish varieties are not breeds as dog breeds are.  The goldfish belongs to the variety indicated by its phenotype.  The earliest characteristics breeders cull are deformities and fish that lack the characteristics of the variety their parents belong to.  The very exotic varieties with many mutations may produce mostly offspring that do not qualify as members of the parental variety.

Edited by shakaho
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Sharon, what else can the fish do? Complain to their owner? They just keep swimming, and hope for the best i.e. more food.

 

They can express discomfort pretty well, as well as beg with the best dog. All a single goldfish will want to do is interact with you and your wife. 

 

All she wants is food. She knows that one of us gives her pellets or peas, or whatever, but when the food stops, she leaves. As a dog lover, it is really hard to compare a fish to a dog. Try cuddling a fish. It just is not the same. I felt bad when Goldie died, but I still miss our dog who died last year. Is this heresy to the fishy people?

 

If she gets food, of course she will go away and look for more. It's goldfish behavior.

I find that my fish, after getting used to my hand being in the aquarium, will come up and request a little pat or rub themselves against my arm, or nibble me. I even had an Oranda awhile back that would shove his face into my palm and rub it against that. He also was known to allow me or my significant other to rub his tummy. I can easily liken goldfish to dogs in terms of their begging and general behavior, physical interaction included if you put time into gaining their trust and interacting with them. 

 

Basically, everything to do with goldfish is about putting the right time and effort in. However, that's the same with any and all pets. There really is no 'set it and forget it' kind of live animal.

 

Atcually Cows are this way. Learn a cow a trick and it will never forget it. Plus they are very easy to train and only requires minimum food/pleasure to do tricks.

There is a women who trains cows for farmers, so that they stand still during milking, vet exams ect. and she can come back 5-10 years later and the cow still knows all the tricks - even the ones that she only "performs" with the cow. Pretty fun fact :)

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Fish are a much lower on the food chain. (no pun intended) As a species, they will eat almost anything they can get into their mouth. They are cannibals, aren't they? I am fond of our fish, because I love all animals, fish included. I know the difference in a relationship with a mammal or a fish or a reptile. We have owned a Tortoise and box turtles. I cried when one of those baby turtles that you used to be able to buy at the dime store died. Because we love a fish or another species, it does not put them all on the same level, as far as intelligence, or the level of interaction, or how they love us , or how they interact with others of their species. Dogs can and do mourn when their owners, or even doggie friends die, I have seen that. Fish? If they are in a tank which has a dead fish, they likely will munch on it. I am fond of all of our fish, all 9 of them, but I don't think that I can love them as I love our Missy, or Joey, or the departed Fred and Rio.

Now that Koko's GF forum has made me feel guilty for not treating our GF as family members, I will do more WC for all 3 of our tanks, but the 40 should be fine with what I have mentioned being as there is one fish in it. I mean Gracie, of course. BTW, GF are no friendlier than some Mollies I have had, and Bettas can have personalities, but Zebras and Cories despite being very cute, have no interest in humans.

 

Are you trying to convince us that because fish aren't at the same level as other animals that we shouldn't love them or care about them as much as some of us do? You're welcome to take that position for yourself, but please stop trying to convince others that they should adopt that point of view. How we feel about our pets is subjective. Personally, my fish are more important to me than anything. I would not trade my fish for any dog or cat or furry creature offered to me. I would re-home my cat before I would re-home some of my fish if forced to choose.

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  http://molometer.hubpages.com/hub/Koi-Carp-An-Ancient-Long-Lived-Ornamental-Fish

 

I don't know if the $2.2 million is true or not,   but Japanese grand champions have gone for seven figures.

 

Why?  Because rich people like to prove they can can afford whatever they want.

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They know their names. They know certain words: 'hungry' means food, they will start doing a feed-me dance, 'no' means stop what you're doing, 'turn around' means turn in the opposite direction, among others. They come when called, and only the one I call comes.

 

I'd REALLY like to see a video clip of "calling" a particular goldfish by name & only that one responding!! And "stopping" when told. Turning around when told. I'd like to see all that!! That would be quite amazing!!!

Edited by Jeana727
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Now that Koko's GF forum has made me feel guilty for not treating our GF as family members, I will do more WC for all 3 of our tanks, but the 40 should be fine with what I have mentioned being as there is one fish in it. I mean Gracie, of course. BTW, GF are no friendlier than some Mollies I have had, and Bettas can have personalities, but Zebras and Cories despite being very cute, have no interest in humans.

 

I'm sorry you feel this way. If it makes you feel any better I'm somewhat the same. I've never known how to classify fish, hasn't really mattered what species I've kept. I think for the most part I have considered them family insofar they live in the home we've made, my brother and parents interact with them and like seeing them, they have names, I care for them, etc, but they certainly aren't anthropomorphised to the extent my dogs are. I'll always love fish, enjoy watching their little personalities, get sad when they get sick or die, but unlike my dogs, they never transcend being fish and the subsequent relationship—they don't become an honorary brother, sister, son or daughter.

 

 

I will just touch on one point you made about how dogs (unlike fish) can not take the role of an honourary brother, sister or child.

As you feel this way about fish to dogs, I feel the same of just about any pet to one's child.

My brother on the other hand...

In all seriousness, I love pets of all kinds, but when comparing them to my kids, there is no contest.

Just speaking as a parent, nothing ranks with my kids.

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  http://molometer.hubpages.com/hub/Koi-Carp-An-Ancient-Long-Lived-Ornamental-Fish

 

I don't know if the $2.2 million is true or not,   but Japanese grand champions have gone for seven figures.

 

Why?  Because rich people like to prove they can can afford whatever they want.

Haha yeah that's true. I've called out a few people on a koi site for that. They didn't seem to appreciate it.

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They know their names. They know certain words: 'hungry' means food, they will start doing a feed-me dance, 'no' means stop what you're doing, 'turn around' means turn in the opposite direction, among others. They come when called, and only the one I call comes.

I'd REALLY like to see a video clip of "calling" a particular goldfish by name & only that one responding!! And "stopping" when told. Turning around when told. I'd like to see all that!! That would be quite amazing!!!
I will be able to provide that video once this batch of fish is as well-trained as my others have been. :) I wish I still had my videos of Clementine and Tsumo doing it! They by far were the best at it. (may they both RIP)
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