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newharmony7

Swim Bladder Treatment

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Posting here because I've tried practically everything (will list) and can't seem to get her up and about.

First, here's a video:

Background:

We relocated and have been in place for several months. The local water has a high PH and, when tested, shows some ammonia, so we were using filtered bottled water until we could get tap water to be just right. We obtained PH correctors and learned from our LFS that the ammonia showing on the test is just chloramines and it is always like this in our area, so we picked up the suggested water conditioner (Seachem Prime) and began using tap water.

Our goldies seem to do best in 6.8-7.0 PH, so we’ve been adjusting accordingly, but my orange telescope eye started getting floaty and having trouble staying upright. We did research on swim bladder and hadn’t seen her do her business in a while, so we fed peas and she seemed to get better, but was bottom sitting a lot afterward. Our black moor started bullying her, so we put her in quarantine (10 gallon bare bottom).

Since then, she keeps switching from floating to bottom sitting – it’s like she gets bound up and we keep having to treat her. We have used Epsom salts (intense solution dips and light solution in tank), peas, Pimafix, Melafix, fasting, cleaning filters really well, cleaning the tank really well, frequent water changes, and she is still as you see her in the video.

Right now, she’s in a 20g quarantine (we picked up a 40+g bowfront and swapped her into the bigger tank) with about 3 tsp of Epsom salts and has been fasted for 1 day.

I’m curious to see if anyone has any alternatives to the standard swim bladder treatments – I’m worried she (I’m 90% sure she’s female due to breeding behavior observed earlier) might have eggs bound up or something else…

Any suggestions are welcome – Thank you all!!

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I'm sorry to say, but once she's flipped over like that, it may be permanent. You can try to give her course of Metronidazole containing foods, but that's about all I can think of.

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What are you feeding besides peas?

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Her original diet was sinking pellets, omega one, soaked before feeding. I recently got some Repashy Soilent Green (I'm still pretty new to the hobby).

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What a pretty fish. Sorry she's having issues. :(

I've been struggling with swim bladder issues with my ryukin for some time, and have found that feeding only veggies (red leaf lettuce, duckweed which I'm now growing in one tank, spinach, etc) and frozen foods are a bit easier on her.

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Thanks! She's my little love and I am trying so hard not to lose her. She moved cross country with me from Michigan to California on a five day road trip... I'm thinking about doing something like is for her:

Edited by newharmony7

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Oops, double post - darned unreliable internet!!

Edited by newharmony7

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I'm going to update the original post with all the required information - I got approved this morning and had to post in a hurry and didn't quite follow the rules, but I wanted to see if I could get help ASAP - I'm too worried!!! Now that I know she's lasted the day and had a chance to do a water test, edit time!

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- Tank Ammonia - Between 0 and .25
- Tank Nitrite - 0
- Tank Nitrate - 0
- Tap Ammonia - Between .25 and .50
- Tap Nitrite - 0
- Tap Nitrate - 0
- Tank PH - 7-7.2
- Tap PH - 8.8+ I think it's higher than the test really goes....
- API Freshwater Master Test Kit
- Water Temp - 74
- Tank Size - 20g - cycled
- Whisper filter 40g rated
- Water changes every few days, last change was to clear gravel, so 100% water change done two days ago.
- 1 fish - about 4 inches
- Epsom Salt, Seachem Prime, Tetra Correct PH fizz tabs
- Main diet of omega one soaked sinking pellets, recent change (after issues) to Repashy Soilent Green and Peas
- No new fish added
- Tried Pimafix and Melafix to no effect
- Nothing too abnormal - possible extremely light fin damage
- Bottom sitting, floating, bottom sitting, upside down, was lethargic today
 
Took a new video of her. Since I took it she's been moving about a bit, not really swimming per se, but just wiggling around on the bottom. She was completely upside down this morning and is now on her side like you see her in the video.
 

 

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Will you see if you can locate some metronidazole powder ASAP? I think I want to do a bit more, but this first ingredient should be started as soon as we possibly can.

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I'm going to have my husband contact our LFs to see if they have it. If they do, is it something I can stir into some gel food? How is it administered?

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Doing a little research online - looks like we can get metronidazole containing medications and things like Tetra Parasite Gaurd and API General Cure and Seachem Metroplex - will these things work or do we specifically need the powder?

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If those are *all* you have access to, I'd say go for them. I've used General Cure in place of Metro because it was the only thing I had on hand and no way of getting anything else. It did the job. The only down side are how many are needed for larger tanks, but I only used it for a 10g.

If you can order Metro on eBay, Amazon, Tastyworms, then choose that option. It'll last longer.

Edited by Chai

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She's in a 20 right now, but I have a 10 I can move her to. Might be better actually, less pressure. Hubs is on the hunt today (he's on break from grad school) and is going to get whatever he can find.

I told him the powder is what we really want, but if no one has it, the other Metronidazole containing stuff might work in a pinch.

There are a couple of smaller more specialized LFS here that might just have the powder on hand.

I've also asked if he could grab another air pump since I only have one for my 40 bowfront right now. Maybe the added oxygen will help?

Not sure if moving her to the 10 at this point would be too stressful for her - any thoughts?

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You can use the 20. The cost here will be that you'll have to use twice as much meds, but if you are OK with that, this is absolutely fine.

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Cost isn't really an issue, I just want to do what's best for her. If she'd be better off in the 10, I'll ask hubs to move her... I just want to see her upright and swimming again...

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Cost isn't really an issue, I just want to do what's best for her. If she'd be better off in the 10, I'll ask hubs to move her... I just want to see her upright and swimming again...

 

The 20 is fine. 

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Seachem Metroplex is the one we usually recommend as its only metronidazole.

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Hubs hit the LFS and they had the Metronidazole by seachem. Says it sounds like it's a powder... Blue bottle with orange cap if that helps... Hate doing this secondhand!!

Should we follow directions on the packaging or is there an alternative method of administering it?

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Seachem metronidazole is the one you want :) dnalex should get back to you on dosage :)

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Decided sooner would be better and mixed a dose into some gel food and fed her. Should I do 2 feedings per day of the Metro-food? Or just one?

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After feeding, she sat on her head for a while - looks like she might be clamping a little?IMG_20150108_205941100_zpswyyuhgng.jpg

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I've moved this into the disease diagnosis forum. That forum gets more traffic so it won't be easily missed.

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