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misssmountain

White markings on Oranda's tail have me stumped...

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I am planning on moving them to the 60 on Monday...can I start the 0.3% salt then? Should I transfer any of the old tank water over? The 60 has been filled for a couple of weeks now with the filter running.

 

When you move to the 60 don't move the tank water over. Use new water (just match temp and ph). Just move the filter and/or old filter media. The beneficial bacteria (bbs) is mostly in the filter bio media. Bbs is also in the gravel and tank and filter walls, but not as much as the bio media.

 

When you transfer everything, including fish, you may get a cycle bump (meaning the cycle may be off a bit). It would be good to watch the tank carefully for the first week to see if that happens. If you want to move to the 60 now, I would wait at least a week after that happens to make sure the cycle has stabilized.

 

If you do move to the 60, you will be using lots of salt. Your fish will love the space though.

 

Let me ask the moderators if they recommend moving to the 60 or staying with the 25 for the salt treatment...stay tuned...

 

We are on a bit of a time crunch as I need the 25 to be disinfected and ready to use for QT for a new fish arriving Jan. 7th :)

 

Just did an ammonia test and it came back at nearly 1.0! I did a water change yesterday...so I tested the tap and it's coming in right around 1.0. I dosed with Prime and will test again in the morning...maybe like last time, the bacteria just need a chance to catch up and hopefully this will resolve quickly.

 

I'm kind of wondering if all of this is coming up because we're a little overcrowded and it's time to move up? I'm wondering if things will resolve simply by giving everyone more space and fresh water...

 

Could you get a 10 gallon tank for QT? If so, you would just need an airstone with water changes every day or every other day.

 

An overcrowded tank does stress the fish which weakens the immune system. More room will help.

 

I do think a 0.3% salt treatment will help to reduce the parasite load.

I could, but the new fish is quite a bit larger than my current ones and I worry that would just be way too small, even for a temporary QT situation...unless it won't matter since I'm doing water changes all the time?

 

How big is the new fish? Standard length - body length without tail. What kind of goldfish is it?

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"How big is the new fish? Standard length - body length without tail. What kind of goldfish is it?"

 

 

Lionhead, maybe 5-6"? It's been a while since I've seen him in person. Shipping from out of state.

 

Nacho's eye seems to be irritated again...the HOB I have in the 25 gallon started making noise last night, and I have been trying to get it back to normal since then. Tried to get a photo of the eye but again it's been very difficult. It's just me living here at my house too, so unfortunately I don't have anyone to help. Will update in the morning. Right now I'm feeling very frustrated and tired. I'm discouraged that everything has seemed to be running perfectly for the past 10 months, and now that I'm ready to do the right thing and upgrade, everything seems to be falling apart. Filter crapping out, my light just died and had to be replaced (thank goodness for year-long warranties!), fish not feeling well...sorry for the mini-rant, I just wish things were going a little more smoothly at this current moment...

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Hang in there!!!! It will all workout!!!!!!

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Oh, I'm so sorry about how things are going for you right now. That feeling of "when it rains, it pours" feels very icky. We are here to help so you are not alone in this!

 

Is there a way to take a video of Nacho? You can try taking pictures after they eat. Fish slow down a bit after eating. Also, you'll want to turn off the bubbler so that the camera focuses on the fish and not the bubbles.

 

Hold off on salt treatment for now until we figure out what is happening with Nacho's eye.

 

Do you have plain Epsom salt on hand?

Edited by LisaCGold

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Regarding the filter, is the impeller making the unexpected noise?

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Regarding the filter, is the impeller making the unexpected noise?

 

Yeah, it's making a humming noise. I've tried cleaning it about 5 times, and while it's not as noisy as it was, it's still making noise.

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Best I could do of the eye for now...I could take a video, I just have no idea how to upload and post one? 

 

It's basically just that white discoloration you see along the bottom edge of the eye. In this pic you can actually see it all -- the eye, dorsal, and white marks on the tail.

 

IMG_20141228_132459272_zps56ec8c40.jpg

Edited by misssmountain

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Oh, I'm so sorry about how things are going for you right now. That feeling of "when it rains, it pours" feels very icky. We are here to help so you are not alone in this!

 

Is there a way to take a video of Nacho? You can try taking pictures after they eat. Fish slow down a bit after eating. Also, you'll want to turn off the bubbler so that the camera focuses on the fish and not the bubbles.

 

Hold off on salt treatment for now until we figure out what is happening with Nacho's eye.

 

Do you have plain Epsom salt on hand?

 

I don't have Epsom salt here, but I can easily grab one -- there's a pharmacy I can walk to.

 

Also, not sure if this matters, but one of my other fish split his tail fin weeks back as well, and so far it isn't healing up. Usually they start healing pretty quickly. He didn't have the same white marking that led to the split as Nacho did on her dorsal, but it is similar in that it's not sealing up for some reason. Doesn't look infected or anything to be alarmed about, I just don't know why these guys aren't healing.

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I think there may be some parasites we need to deal with using salt, but the eye may require something else. Can you take pic of Other eye so we can compare? Is the eye with white swollen like last time?

Each time you do a water change, please take out some of the gravel. Ideally, you take out all gravel eventually until the fish are healthy.

You would need to upload video to youtube then post link here.

Go ahead and pickup epsom salt just in case.

A couple of other mods chimed in behind the scenes. They both suggest treating your fish in the smaller tank and not introducing parasites/bacteria into the larger tank for now.

For the fish that is coming, you can get a 15gallon sterile plastic tub with airstone.

The bottom line: I think the 0.3% salt will help heal the markings and tears on the fish, but we need to figure out Nacho's eye. By taking out the gravel we can get the water quality to be pristine and the places for parasites and bad bacteria to colonize are minimized.

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I would recommend a getting a couple of plastic totes for quarantining your new fish.  You can do a 100% water change simply by moving the fish from one container to the other.  Add prime every day to inactivate the ammonia in your tap water.


 


An alternative would be to quarantine the new fish in the new tank.  If you are going to do that, you should first remove the gravel.  Quarantine and hospital tanks should be bare bottom for cleanliness.  


 


I am not at all concerned about a few white spots on the fins.  I think most of my mature fish have some of these.  I don't know what they are, but I think they might be scars from minor injuries to the fins.  There seems to be some erosion of the fins near the split.  We usually first treat this symptom with clean salted water, which I believe you are already doing.


 


Just out of curiosity, what are the dimensions of your tanks? It must be the angle of the picture, but the two tanks look almost the same size.

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I would recommend a getting a couple of plastic totes for quarantining your new fish.  You can do a 100% water change simply by moving the fish from one container to the other.  Add prime every day to inactivate the ammonia in your tap water.

 

An alternative would be to quarantine the new fish in the new tank.  If you are going to do that, you should first remove the gravel.  Quarantine and hospital tanks should be bare bottom for cleanliness.  

 

I am not at all concerned about a few white spots on the fins.  I think most of my mature fish have some of these.  I don't know what they are, but I think they might be scars from minor injuries to the fins.  There seems to be some erosion of the fins near the split.  We usually first treat this symptom with clean salted water, which I believe you are already doing.

 

Just out of curiosity, what are the dimensions of your tanks? It must be the angle of the picture, but the two tanks look almost the same size.

Sharon, what about the swollen eye?

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Let's see what other mods have to say about the eye before starting the salt treatment.

A video will help.

Edited by LisaCGold

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Okay, let's try this:

Move hob filter to the 60 gallon with the two fish who do not have eye issues. Don't start salt treatment yet. Just watch the water parameters. Setup your canister filter on this tank to get that filter established.

Keep Nacho in the 25 gallon with just an airstone. Treat her with Melafix (no Pimafix) until 1/5. Hopefully with an uncrowded tank the melafix will help Nachos's eye. Since this tank will be uncycled, you'll need to watch the parameters carefully. Ideally you'll want to do a full water change every day. If that doesn't work with your schedule then: If ammonia is less than 1.0 ppm then double dose of Prime and check water next day. If ammonia more than 1.0 then do a big water change.

Assuming eye is better, move Nacho to 60 gallon on 1/6. Disinfect the 25 gallon for the new fish.

Start 0.3% salt treatment on both tanks on 1/8.

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Okay, let's try this:

Move hob filter to the 60 gallon with the two fish who do not have eye issues. Don't start salt treatment yet. Just watch the water parameters. Setup your canister filter on this tank to get that filter established.

Keep Nacho in the 25 gallon with just an airstone. Treat her with Melafix (no Pimafix) until 1/5. Hopefully with an uncrowded tank the melafix will help Nachos's eye. Since this tank will be uncycled, you'll need to watch the parameters carefully. Ideally you'll want to do a full water change every day. If that doesn't work with your schedule then: If ammonia is less than 1.0 ppm then double dose of Prime and check water next day. If ammonia more than 1.0 then do a big water change.

Assuming eye is better, move Nacho to 60 gallon on 1/6. Disinfect the 25 gallon for the new fish.

Start 0.3% salt treatment on both tanks on 1/8.

 

That all sounds great, except now we have one MAJOR problem.

 

The tank is too close to the wall and the HOB won't fit behind it. The sides are out too, as the tank is designed with two glass planks on either side, presumably to act as "shelves" that the lid will sit on. It can go on the front and be a massive eye sore, which would work out fine in the short term, but long term not so much...

 

So, I am now going to have the drain the whole thing, then move it, then refill it, and wait a while to get the airflow going and the PH stabalized.

 

Really throws a wrench in this whole operation...I am about to lose it here.

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I would recommend a getting a couple of plastic totes for quarantining your new fish.  You can do a 100% water change simply by moving the fish from one container to the other.  Add prime every day to inactivate the ammonia in your tap water.

 

An alternative would be to quarantine the new fish in the new tank.  If you are going to do that, you should first remove the gravel.  Quarantine and hospital tanks should be bare bottom for cleanliness.  

 

I am not at all concerned about a few white spots on the fins.  I think most of my mature fish have some of these.  I don't know what they are, but I think they might be scars from minor injuries to the fins.  There seems to be some erosion of the fins near the split.  We usually first treat this symptom with clean salted water, which I believe you are already doing.

 

Just out of curiosity, what are the dimensions of your tanks? It must be the angle of the picture, but the two tanks look almost the same size.

 

 

The 25g is 18x18x18 and the 60 is 24x24x24.

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Okay, let's try this:

Move hob filter to the 60 gallon with the two fish who do not have eye issues. Don't start salt treatment yet. Just watch the water parameters. Setup your canister filter on this tank to get that filter established.

Keep Nacho in the 25 gallon with just an airstone. Treat her with Melafix (no Pimafix) until 1/5. Hopefully with an uncrowded tank the melafix will help Nachos's eye. Since this tank will be uncycled, you'll need to watch the parameters carefully. Ideally you'll want to do a full water change every day. If that doesn't work with your schedule then: If ammonia is less than 1.0 ppm then double dose of Prime and check water next day. If ammonia more than 1.0 then do a big water change.

Assuming eye is better, move Nacho to 60 gallon on 1/6. Disinfect the 25 gallon for the new fish.

Start 0.3% salt treatment on both tanks on 1/8.

 

Alright, well -- this photo was a little more clear on my phone than it is here, but here's another shot of the eye...it looks like excess white skin or something. When I look down from the top, it looks like it sticks out a little. Not the entire eye, just the white stuff. Looks a little stringy I guess.

 

I just increased to 0.2% salt and will bump up to 0.3 in the morning. I didn't make the move tonight, as I had to drain the tank in order to move it forward so the HOB can fit (plus I was hoping to switch the gravel to sand anyway, so that was kind of an excuse to do that as well). Want to give it a couple of days to let the water age and let the sand settle, so the fish won't be moving until Thursday at the earliest.

 

Dearly as I love my fish, and I will do everything possible within my means, unfortunately I don't have the space or the time for 2 QT tanks in addition to a main tank. So whatever the best course of action is, it kind of has to stay between the 25 and the 60 :(

 

eye_zps4e0b6e02.jpg

 

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I understand about the QT situation.

 

Let's see how the Melafix works on Nacho's eye when he has the 25 gallon tank to her/him-self.

 

Did you start putting salt into the 60 gallon? I was hoping you'd wait until all three fish are in there before you start doing the salt. That's okay, but you'll not want to introduce the two fish to the 60 gallon when there is 0.2 or 0.3% salt. Introducing them when there is 0.1% is fine, then bump up to 0.2% 12 hours later, and then to 0.3% 12 hours after that. That way the fish's systems don't get overwhelmed. If you have 0.2% in the 60, then just do a 50% water change and that should bring the salt concentration back down to 0.1%.

 

Sand is great stuff. What color did you get?

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I understand about the QT situation.

 

Let's see how the Melafix works on Nacho's eye when he has the 25 gallon tank to her/him-self.

 

Did you start putting salt into the 60 gallon? I was hoping you'd wait until all three fish are in there before you start doing the salt. That's okay, but you'll not want to introduce the two fish to the 60 gallon when there is 0.2 or 0.3% salt. Introducing them when there is 0.1% is fine, then bump up to 0.2% 12 hours later, and then to 0.3% 12 hours after that. That way the fish's systems don't get overwhelmed. If you have 0.2% in the 60, then just do a 50% water change and that should bring the salt concentration back down to 0.1%.

 

Sand is great stuff. What color did you get?

I have not added salt or anything besides water conditioner to the 60. I had to drain and refill it, therefore I have not moved any fish over either as I wanted to give the water a chance to sit for at least 24 hours.

I am adding the salt to the 25. If I get up to 0.3% in the 25, theoretically I could add that much to the 60 for when i switch them as it would be the same concentration, correct? Will move the 2 fish on Thursday and nacho will have the 25 to herself for 4-5 days until I need it for qt. Let's hope she feels better by then!!

I went with black sand. Looking pretty slick! Still getting 0.5-1.0 ammonia in both tank and tap water too...I have timms one and only to add to the 60, hope that helps. I feel like my water changes have been so counterproductive! Don't know where my beneficial bacteria went...sleeping on the job? Been adding prime every day as a precaution...

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Black sand is very cool. One day I'll use that.

 

Correct on the salt.

 

What are your nitrites and nitrates in the 25?

 

Edit: Actually I'm not too sure we want to have a high salt concentration with Melafix. Let me check.

Edited by LisaCGold

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Is the Melafix in the 25 with salt?

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So far no evidence that the salt and Melafix is the wrong combo. How is Nacho's eye?

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So far no evidence that the salt and Melafix is the wrong combo. How is Nacho's eye?

 

The same...not any better, but not really any worse either I don't think. 

 

I'm going to move everyone over to the 60 tomorrow I think, since she is eating and behaving normally. Hoping more space will equal better water quality and help to clear things up.

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You'll want to make sure your airstone is on full blast in the 25 when you move the filter over to the 60. Melafix treatments require extra oxygen.

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