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Upgrading my 30 to 60


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Morning guys,

 

So I have decided to use the opportunity of Christmas and a Christmas bonus to finally upgrade my 30 gallon to a 64 gallon.

 

I have ordered the aquarium and it should arrive some time next week. I am extremely excited.

 

I will also buy the Allpondsolution 2000EF external filter at a flowrate of 528gph. I am still hesitating whether to get the one with UV or not. Here is one of my questions how do I go about moving my cycle (i.e my good bacteria) to the new tank. Can I just transfer the media from one filter to another or do I need to follow a more complicated procedure.

 

I am also intending to upgrade the decoration. At the moment I have a planted tank with gravel. I have now several times had trouble when I gave the gravel a complete rinse and it released a lot of silicates. Also I think crud gets stuck in it easier. I was thinking of going with something thinner and  fancy the Tropica Plant Growth substrate (Lis used this in her 180g and I'm hoping for her input).

I am also open to suggestions for plants. A lot of my plants recently died after I treated the tank with prazi and salt and then had an algae bloom. I will probably start from scratch. At the moment I had crypts, java ferns, bolbitis and anubias.

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I have no complaints about the tropica growth substrate :) I only needed to use a thin layer of it (I used 5 bags - which are not very big - to cover the whole of the bottom of the 180). On the odd occasion when the fish have managed to dig through the sand down to the tropica substrate (only due to me feeding in one place) it didn't make a mess either, which I was pleased with :) I would use a sand cap with it though, as I don't imagine the plants would stay down in it too well without a cap (a sand cap is better than a gravel cap too, doesn't trap dirt)

In regards to moving your cycled media over, that is exactly what I did with the 180 (and I've always cycled my goldie tanks using cycled media from another tank). I've never had a cycle bump from doing this, but I know some people have, so if you do that you'll want to keep an eye on your parameters for a few weeks :) you could even just move your filter over to the new tank and just let it run on there for a while (I think I've read 3 weeks before but I think I'd leave it longer).

Your plant list sounds good, I have hygrophila, lotus' and aponogeton in my tank too, though I imagine if your guys were going to destroy anything it'd be the aponogeton (thin leaved and easily damaged). Will you be leaving the 60 running for a while planted up but without the fish? I'm not sure my planted tank would have been so successful if it wasn't for the fact that I left it running empty for a few weeks to give the plants a chance to grow in :)

Edited by Lis.
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I have no complaints about the tropica growth substrate :) I only needed to use a thin layer of it (I used 5 bags - which are not very big - to cover the whole of the bottom of the 180). On the odd occasion when the fish have managed to dig through the sand down to the tropica substrate (only due to me feeding in one place) it didn't make a mess either, which I was pleased with :) I would use a sand cap with it though, as I don't imagine the plants would stay down in it too well without a cap (a sand cap is better than a gravel cap too, doesn't trap dirt)

In regards to moving your cycled media over, that is exactly what I did with the 180 (and I've always cycled my goldie tanks using cycled media from another tank). I've never had a cycle bump from doing this, but I know some people have, so if you do that you'll want to keep an eye on your parameters for a few weeks :) you could even just move your filter over to the new tank and just let it run on there for a while (I think I've read 3 weeks before but I think I'd leave it longer).

Your plant list sounds good, I have hygrophila, lotus' and aponogeton in my tank too, though I imagine if your guys were going to destroy anything it'd be the aponogeton (thin leaved and easily damaged). Will you be leaving the 60 running for a while planted up but without the fish? I'm not sure my planted tank would have been so successful if it wasn't for the fact that I left it running empty for a few weeks to give the plants a chance to grow in :)

Congrats on the upgrade!! :nana

I have moved media and some of my substrate, and I did get a cycle bump. You might have read recently about Kat_M getting one when she moved too. I had about the same thing happen to me -- I had a nitrite spike, but it didn't last too long. So even if you don't get "instant cycle," you will be almost there. I would move the existing filter (at least temporarily) and seed the new one. Then just watch your parameters and dose with Prime and do WCs as needed. :)

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Congrats on your new tank!!!!!

 

 

Congrats on the update

 

Hi guys. Thanks for the nice comments.

 

 

 

I have no complaints about the tropica growth substrate :) I only needed to use a thin layer of it (I used 5 bags - which are not very big - to cover the whole of the bottom of the 180). On the odd occasion when the fish have managed to dig through the sand down to the tropica substrate (only due to me feeding in one place) it didn't make a mess either, which I was pleased with :) I would use a sand cap with it though, as I don't imagine the plants would stay down in it too well without a cap (a sand cap is better than a gravel cap too, doesn't trap dirt)

In regards to moving your cycled media over, that is exactly what I did with the 180 (and I've always cycled my goldie tanks using cycled media from another tank). I've never had a cycle bump from doing this, but I know some people have, so if you do that you'll want to keep an eye on your parameters for a few weeks :) you could even just move your filter over to the new tank and just let it run on there for a while (I think I've read 3 weeks before but I think I'd leave it longer).

Your plant list sounds good, I have hygrophila, lotus' and aponogeton in my tank too, though I imagine if your guys were going to destroy anything it'd be the aponogeton (thin leaved and easily damaged). Will you be leaving the 60 running for a while planted up but without the fish? I'm not sure my planted tank would have been so successful if it wasn't for the fact that I left it running empty for a few weeks to give the plants a chance to grow in :)

Congrats on the upgrade!! :nana

I have moved media and some of my substrate, and I did get a cycle bump. You might have read recently about Kat_M getting one when she moved too. I had about the same thing happen to me -- I had a nitrite spike, but it didn't last too long. So even if you don't get "instant cycle," you will be almost there. I would move the existing filter (at least temporarily) and seed the new one. Then just watch your parameters and dose with Prime and do WCs as needed. :)

 

 

Unfortunately I do not have enough space to have both the 30 gal and 60 gal running at the same time. So I guess it is going to have to be seeding the new filter and running the old one on the new tank. Am I causing trouble for myself by replacing the gravel. Any ideas on how to get the gravel out of the tank?

 

 

I have no complaints about the tropica growth substrate :) I only needed to use a thin layer of it (I used 5 bags - which are not very big - to cover the whole of the bottom of the 180). On the odd occasion when the fish have managed to dig through the sand down to the tropica substrate (only due to me feeding in one place) it didn't make a mess either, which I was pleased with :) I would use a sand cap with it though, as I don't imagine the plants would stay down in it too well without a cap (a sand cap is better than a gravel cap too, doesn't trap dirt)

In regards to moving your cycled media over, that is exactly what I did with the 180 (and I've always cycled my goldie tanks using cycled media from another tank). I've never had a cycle bump from doing this, but I know some people have, so if you do that you'll want to keep an eye on your parameters for a few weeks :) you could even just move your filter over to the new tank and just let it run on there for a while (I think I've read 3 weeks before but I think I'd leave it longer).

Your plant list sounds good, I have hygrophila, lotus' and aponogeton in my tank too, though I imagine if your guys were going to destroy anything it'd be the aponogeton (thin leaved and easily damaged). Will you be leaving the 60 running for a while planted up but without the fish? I'm not sure my planted tank would have been so successful if it wasn't for the fact that I left it running empty for a few weeks to give the plants a chance to grow in :)

 

 

Lis it looks like the tropical substrate is a kind of grey colour. Is that correct? I didn't realise you used a sand toping. Makes sense I was wondering how you got the plants to grow in such shallow substrate. Did you use a specific brand?

I am very tempted by your lotus and am pondering getting one. It's a shame I won't be able to leave the plants to grow for a while.

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I'm not a fan of gravel, so I don't think you are causing yourself trouble by replacing it. Moving it would be one more step toward having "instant cycle," but if you don't want it, this is the perfect time to replace it. You could put some in a stocking to help seed the new tank, but you can do without it too. 

 

As for plants, it would be nice to do what Lis did, but I couldn't do that either. The new tank replaced the old tank, so there was no option to let the plants settle in. So I resign myself to replanting often until the plants get established. ;)

Edited by ShawneeRiver
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Lis it looks like the tropical substrate is a kind of grey colour. Is that correct? I didn't realise you used a sand toping. Makes sense I was wondering how you got the plants to grow in such shallow substrate. Did you use a specific brand?

I am very tempted by your lotus and am pondering getting one. It's a shame I won't be able to leave the plants to grow for a while.

The tropica substrate is brown, I then added a thick layer of sand as a cap to stop the fish getting to the tropica substrate :) I imagine plants would be fine if you planted it up and moved the fish straight in, I used a lot of stem plants and knowing my bunch they would have ripped them all out without them being established. I replant new cuttings weekly, so if you're up for a bit of replanting for a while until they root, it'll be fine :) I used a JBL sand, but any would do :)

The lotus grew fast, so I don't think it would be an issue if you put it in at the same time as the fish :)

Edited by Lis.
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Thanks Dandy, that's very sweet of you :) yeah the sand is JBL 'black' (I love it because it's not black :teehee)

I enjoy replanting 80% of the time! it can be quite therapeutic I think :)

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I assume you will be getting a larger or second filter for the new tank. Set up the new filter and get it running in the new tank, then move the old filter, with its medium in place, into the new tank as well. The microbes in the old filter will colonize the medium in the new filter. 

 

 It is true that there are some nitrifiers in the substrate.  However, you really don't need them.  

 

One of things I find very hard to explain to people about bacteria is that in a healthy ecosystem, such as an aquarium, a bacterial population will continue to increase in number until the average bacterium is at the edge of starvation.  At that point the population is at the "stationary phase" of the bacterial growth curve.

 

06-20_MicrobialGrowth_L-1.jpg

 

(The decline phase is something you get when you put some bacteria into a tube of medium and don't add any fresh medium or remove any waste.)  

 

So suppose that 25% of your nitrifying microbes are on the tank glass or substrate and 75% are in the filter.  When you  transfer the filter to the new tank, you are transferring 75% or the nitrifiers to the new tank.  But remember, they are half starved.  Now they have more food and they will gobble it up. 

 

Considering that you have had some health problems, the LAST thing you should consider is transferring the substrate to the new tank.  I strongly recommend that you set the new tank up bare bottomed until all fish are healthy.  You can put your plants in pots.  Once you are sure all fish are healthy, you can add new substrate if you wish.

 

 

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If you go with epiphytes there's no reason to spend on a plant substrate, you only have to dose the water column. I know you're a fan of Amano, so I'll use him as an example. The tanks he sets up long term, like his big personal tank or the one at Sumida Aquarium, generally just have anubias, ferns, moss, etc. They are much easier to deal with than stems.

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Grr So annoyed with myself. They were going o deliver my new tank today!!! On ebay it said that I was to expect it Monday or Wednesday next week. So when someone called me today and I missed the call and I didn't recognise the number I didn't call back. It was them!!! Grrr. He said he promises to deliver it by Wednesday.

 

 

Awesome! Congrats on you getting a new bigger tank!

 

 

Congrats on the bigger upgrade. That's exciting. :)

 

 

Congrats on the upgrade! Tiger lotuses are cool. I had one until my comet ripped it to shreds and jammed the bulb between two rocks  :rofl

 

 

That's great news on the new tank DP, I hope you have fun with the expansion.

 

Thanks guys. I'm very excited about this. I have been wanting to upgrade for a while. Now that I live with my bf and not my flatmates I can do it.

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If you go with epiphytes there's no reason to spend on a plant substrate, you only have to dose the water column. I know you're a fan of Amano, so I'll use him as an example. The tanks he sets up long term, like his big personal tank or the one at Sumida Aquarium, generally just have anubias, ferns, moss, etc. They are much easier to deal with than stems.

 

 

 

I assume you will be getting a larger or second filter for the new tank. Set up the new filter and get it running in the new tank, then move the old filter, with its medium in place, into the new tank as well. The microbes in the old filter will colonize the medium in the new filter. 

 

 It is true that there are some nitrifiers in the substrate.  However, you really don't need them.  

 

One of things I find very hard to explain to people about bacteria is that in a healthy ecosystem, such as an aquarium, a bacterial population will continue to increase in number until the average bacterium is at the edge of starvation.  At that point the population is at the "stationary phase" of the bacterial growth curve.

 

06-20_MicrobialGrowth_L-1.jpg

 

(The decline phase is something you get when you put some bacteria into a tube of medium and don't add any fresh medium or remove any waste.)  

 

So suppose that 25% of your nitrifying microbes are on the tank glass or substrate and 75% are in the filter.  When you  transfer the filter to the new tank, you are transferring 75% or the nitrifiers to the new tank.  But remember, they are half starved.  Now they have more food and they will gobble it up. 

 

Considering that you have had some health problems, the LAST thing you should consider is transferring the substrate to the new tank.  I strongly recommend that you set the new tank up bare bottomed until all fish are healthy.  You can put your plants in pots.  Once you are sure all fish are healthy, you can add new substrate if you wish.

 

 

 

Yes that is exactly why I didn't want to transfer my substrate and I think I am going to take your advice and remain bare bottom until Blacky has healed and they are all completely healthy. I just ant everyone to be healthy and together in their new tank again.

 

I will be getting a new filter and after the cycle is fully established in the new tank, I will remove the old one.

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Great news. My new tank finally arrived today it's huuuge. Standing on the floor right now.

I have decided to wait until I am back from my holidays in two weeks to set it up and move my babies.

I will set up the new filter with my old tank and the old filter for now.

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