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angies71

White Cauliflower Tumor on Oranda

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Test Results for the Following:

  • * Ammonia Level(Tank) 0
  • * Nitrite Level(Tank) 0
  • * Nitrate level(Tank) 20
  • * Ammonia Level(Tap) 0
  • * Nitrite Level(Tap) 0
  • * Nitrate level(Tap) 0
  • * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) pH 8.2, KH 240, GH 180
  • * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) pH 8.0, KH 240, GH 180

Other Required Info:

  • * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API Master Test Kit; API Strips for KH & GH
  • * Water temperature? 78
  • * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 75 gal., 8 yrs.
  • * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? Running 2 Magnum 350 Canister Filters with Dual BioWheels
  • * How often do you change the water and how much? 20% every 2 weeks.
  • * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? 3 days ago; 50%
  • * How many fish in the tank and their size? 4 (1 Lg. Oranda, 1 Med. Oranda, 1 Sm. Ranchu, 1 Med. Fantail
  • * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Stress Coat
  • * What do you feed your fish and how often? Once each evening
  • * Any new fish added to the tank? 2 months ago (Fantail)
  • * Any medications added to the tank? No
  • * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. Used Melafix & Pimafix for 10 days about two months ago. When no progress was made, put Oranda in hospital tank for 5-day Maracyn Two treatment which made no difference in tumor. Returned Oranda to main tank & started all fish on Medi-Gold & Metro Meds which they’ve been on for the last month with the exception of the last few days.
  • * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Cauliflower-like tumor near left gill plate.
  • * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? Lays on bottom frequently but still fairly active.

Hi there! I am hoping to find some advice on possible treatment for my Choku, a large Oranda. I've had him for a little over 2 years now.

Choku has a white, cauliflower-like tumor near his left gill plate that appeared 2 months ago. This occurred after adding a new fish to my 75-gallon tank (there is a total of 4). The new fish (Penny) was quarantined for two weeks and showed no signs of illness and was added to my tank. Even now, she remains healthy and shows no signs of illness. This is the only "event" that seems to coincide with my Choku's mysterious tumor. It may or may not be related to his illness.

The tumor started pretty small but grew very quickly. While administering several treatments over the last two months (outlined in my details below), the tumor never changed (didn't shrink; didn't grow). I discontinued all treatment just a few days ago (to give my gang a break), and Choku's tumor started growing again. Now a small white bump has developed on his left gill plate. Tonight, I added aquarium salt and hope to find some other alternative to continuous Medi-Gold & Metro Meds through the more knowledgeable people here.

Choku's best bud Ray (a smaller Oranda) lays around quite a bit since Choku's illness began two months ago, but shows no visible signs of illness. Penny and Leonard (a small Ranchu) appear healthy and active. Everyone is happy and active at dinner time. :)

Choku also appears to have issues with his vision since his tumor developed. He completely misses the food as it drops. However, he has learned to hand feed very nicely.

I've been very fortunate not to have any issues with my fish for nearly two years. I have dealt with several illnesses over the years, but this is the first time I've dealt with a tumor.

Below are photos. I appreciate and am grateful for any advice. Thank you!

choku-tumor1_zpsd4e7e594.jpgchoku-tumor2_zps788d4e61.jpg

Test Results for the Following:

  • * Ammonia Level(Tank) 0
  • * Nitrite Level(Tank) 0
  • * Nitrate level(Tank) 20
  • * Ammonia Level(Tap) 0
  • * Nitrite Level(Tap) 0
  • * Nitrate level(Tap) 0
  • * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) pH 8.2, KH 240, GH 180
  • * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) pH 8.0, KH 240, GH 180

Other Required Info:

  • * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API Master Test Kit; API Strips for KH & GH
  • * Water temperature? 76
  • * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 75 gal., 8 yrs.
  • * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? Running 2 Magnum 350 Canister Filters with Dual BioWheels
  • * How often do you change the water and how much? 20% every 2 weeks.
  • * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? 3 days ago; 50%
  • * How many fish in the tank and their size? 4 (1 Lg. Oranda, 1 Med. Oranda, 1 Sm. Ranchu, 1 Med. Fantail
  • * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Stress Coat
  • * What do you feed your fish and how often? Once each evening
  • * Any new fish added to the tank? 2 months ago (Fantail)
  • * Any medications added to the tank? Used Melafix & Pimafix initially (2 months ago)
  • * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. Used Melafix & Pimafix for 10 days about two months ago. When no progress was made, put Oranda in hospital tank for 5-day Maracyn Two treatment which made no difference in tumor. Returned Oranda to main tank & started all fish on Medi-Gold & Metro Meds which they’ve been on for the last month with the exception of the last few days. Added aquarium salt tonight.
  • * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Cauliflower-like tumor near left gill plate.
  • * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? Lays on bottom frequently; very active at dinnertime.

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I forgot to add the type of food. I use Mazuri Gel Food from Goldfish Utopia. I've fed this for several years.

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In sorry he's not feeling well. :hug

I would recommend upping your water changes to at least 50% weekly if you can. Also switch to prime once the stress coat runs out. The prime hives you much more for your buck. It neutralizes up to 1ppm of ammonia for 24 hours. It's also I think Sharon (shakaho) calculated bit and it was $3.60 to treat 1,000 gallons of water and I believe she said it was around 10-16 dollars for the dress cost. I don't remember that exact price, but I know it was considerably higher.

Also, he's very pretty!!! :heart

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Can you elaborate on how you administered the Metro Meds and Medi Gold? Did you feed them both at the same time? Did you feed them to the fish individually according to wieght?

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Could you please get some closer shots of the affected area, if possible?

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In sorry he's not feeling well. :hug

I would recommend upping your water changes to at least 50% weekly if you can. Also switch to prime once the stress coat runs out. The prime hives you much more for your buck. It neutralizes up to 1ppm of ammonia for 24 hours. It's also I think Sharon (shakaho) calculated bit and it was $3.60 to treat 1,000 gallons of water and I believe she said it was around 10-16 dollars for the dress cost. I don't remember that exact price, but I know it was considerably higher.

Also, he's very pretty!!! :heart

Thank you, Mikey! I am just about out of Stress Coat and will give Prime a try. I've done 50% water changes (about every 10-14 days) for the last two cleanings because the med foods seem to cause the tank to get dirty pretty quickly. Yes, he's a handsome little fellow, isn't he! :-) Thank you for your suggestions!

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Can you elaborate on how you administered the Metro Meds and Medi Gold? Did you feed them both at the same time? Did you feed them to the fish individually according to wieght?

Thank you for your reply, Jared. I initially used Metro Meds. Although I keep my med foods in an air-tight container, the jar was over 2 years old. I was out of Medi Gold at the time. I used the old stock while waiting for my shipment of Metro Meds and Medi Gold. After the shipment arrived, I used both for 14 days. When there was no improvement, I quarantined Choku and tried the Maracyn Two for 5 days and continued the Metro Meds and Medi Gold for just him. The rest of the tank, I put on Jumpstart while Choku was in the hospital tank.

I just finished another 14 days of just the Medi Gold this time. For the last 3 days, they've been back on their regular Mazuri Gel food to give them a break from the continual med foods. I am unfamiliar with feeding according to weight, so no I did not do that. As far as Choku, he eats mostly by hand since he seems to have trouble seeing it and getting to the food before the other 3. Since he was just learning to feed by hand, we had a lot of "misses". I'll have to "guesstimate" that he probably was getting 4-5 pellets of each med food actually in his mouth.

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Could you please get some closer shots of the affected area, if possible?

I tried taking some shots with my better camera this morning. The first is a picture out of the water. The second is me holding him under water in the tank. After importing and lightening the picture, the picture is showing several small dots on his gill plate that I can not see with the naked eye. I'm not sure if that's due to the photo editing or if they're actually there. The white dot that was on his gill plate appears to be gone this morning. The only thing I did last night was add aquarium salt. Perhaps it's helping?

choku-tumor-3_zpsc58d6a87.jpg

choku-tumor-4_zpscea8b75b.jpg

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I've done some online research since Choku's tumor appeared. One article I found that seemed to match the description of this tumor was about a disease called Lymphocystis. The article I read says that it's infectious but not fatal. The author's only suggestion was to euthanize the infected fish to prevent an outbreak. I am having a hard time accepting this as the only remedy since the other fish do not appear to be "infected" and all seem to behave normally except Choku and his buddy seem to lay around a lot. However, they will wake right up if anyone passes by the tank and start begging for their dinner.

Another article suggested doing my own surgery to remove the tumor, but I really do not feel qualified to even attempt that.

Overall, I haven't found anything online to suggest a cure. However, antibiotics appear to keep the tumor from getting larger. They just haven't been successful in getting rid of it.

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I think the spots on the gill plates are just breeding stars. I have no clue about the tumor though.

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I've done some online research since Choku's tumor appeared. One article I found that seemed to match the description of this tumor was about a disease called Lymphocystis. The article I read says that it's infectious but not fatal. The author's only suggestion was to euthanize the infected fish to prevent an outbreak. I am having a hard time accepting this as the only remedy since the other fish do not appear to be "infected" and all seem to behave normally except Choku and his buddy seem to lay around a lot. However, they will wake right up if anyone passes by the tank and start begging for their dinner.

Another article suggested doing my own surgery to remove the tumor, but I really do not feel qualified to even attempt that.

Overall, I haven't found anything online to suggest a cure. However, antibiotics appear to keep the tumor from getting larger. They just haven't been successful in getting rid of it.

According to Johnson and Hess, Lymphocsytis is actually only weakly transmissible and is unlikely to spread. It can actually be treated with acriflavine baths. However, I don't know if that is what this is. Carp Pox also causes these warty growths and can be improved with with warm water and 0.3% salt. Both of these conditions are viral and will not respond to antibiotics. In addition, for Metro Meds and Medi Gold to work properly, you must weigh each fish and feed them 1% of their body weight of food. It is best to isolate the sick fish in a quarantine tank so you can be sure they are eating the correct amount.

I am going to report this to the other moderators to get some feed back on these new pictures you have provided. Please wait for someone to get back to you with an appropriate treatment plan. Hang in there :)

Edited by jmetzger72

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Thank you for the information, Jared! That is comforting to know that research on Lymphocystis. I am unfamiliar with Carp Pox. I did see some improvement overnight just from adding salt to the tank as Choku's small white bump on the gill plate disappeared. The tumor looks about the same but at least it hadn't "blossomed" as it did after I discontinued the antibiotics. Hmmmm... I'm wondering if you're on to something here.

Also, thank you for the information on weight-based feeding for Medi Gold & Metro Meds. I've never really had much luck with those meds in the past. Perhaps this is why.

Thank you for passing along Choku's case to the other moderators. I look forward to hearing their thoughts, too. :rolleyes:

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Hello, I also suspect that it's lymphocystis, although I have read about it and not seen it in my fish myself. It may also just be a tumor that has the gross resemblance of one induced by the lymphocystis virus. Whatever the case, there is no treatment, but aside from it perhaps looking unsightly, it doesn't really cause much harm.

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Hello, I also suspect that it's lymphocystis, although I have read about it and not seen it in my fish myself. It may also just be a tumor that has the gross resemblance of one induced by the lymphocystis virus. Whatever the case, there is no treatment, but aside from it perhaps looking unsightly, it doesn't really cause much harm.

Thanks dnalex! If we're just dealing with something unsightly, we can certainly deal with that. As long as my little fellow is happy, that's all that matters to me.

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