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Kittycat

Concerned about my fish

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My four year old female pearlscale, Elrond, has had floaty issues for a while now. Last summer/fall, she spawned several times. The floaty problems got worse when the males chased her, but she was not releasing any eggs. Finally, she released a LOT of eggs (several times, about a week apart), resulting in a very large and very successful spawn. After that, she still had the problem with her bouncy, floating to the top of the water when resting, with her tail at the top of the water and her nose pointed down. She's been fine like this for about half a year, as she has her little places where she can rest and sleep, with her tail and abdomen safely underwater using some floating plants.

Lately, she's been getting worse. I moved her over to another tank (along with all the other fish in her tank) while I redid her tank with dirt substrate. I set up a place for her to rest, using a loop of airline tubing to contain floating plants for her to sleep under. The only problem was that she chose to rest next to it, not underneath it, no matter how many times I tried to make it more attractive for her to rest under. After several days of this, she developed a reddened area on her abdomen underneath her tail, where it was getting exposed to air. I put vasaline on it, then cleaned her old aquarium to get it ready for her to go back into. After getting back in her original tank, she got back to her old resting spots, and the red area cleared up after several days. While all of this was happening, her floating problems seemed to get worse, and they haven't improved. Before, she was floating nose-tip down, now she's tipping over a little closer to upside down, or rolling to the side a little bit. She's also having trouble swimming downwards for long enough to get food. I've taken to helping her out by holding her in one hand while giving her food with the other. She's still eats like a pig this way and me holding her does not stress her out at all (she's the friendliest of my fish), but it's very distressing to see my lovely little Elrond, mother to so many little fish, in this sort of a situation.

I went ahead and moved her to her own ten gallon tank, and put a tsp of Melafix in. She has a pantyhose over airline tubing loop to keep her tummy wet, which seems to be working for her. I sort of fear that she may have a bacterial infection, and I'm not entirely sure which medication to give her. I have a full box of API Triple Sulfa, and enough E. erythromycin to start her first dose, but I don't know if those or some other medication might be better in this situation, or if I should just continue with the Melafix.

Levels for 10 gal. quarantine:

Ammonia: 0.5 ppm (the tapwater had ammonia in it, but I use Seachem Nuetral Regulator and Prime)

Nitrite: 0ppm

Nitrate: 5ppm

pH: 7.8

Filter: Aqueon 10-15

Previous tank (75 gallon with four other fish)

Ammonia: 0ppm

Nitrite: 0ppm

Nitrate: 10ppm

pH:7.9

Filters: Aquatop 370 with UV, Penguin 200 biowheel

The tank before both of these was a 40 gallon that was temporarily overstocked due to the major redecorating of the 75 gallon.

All tanks have been running for about a year or more.

Thank you! :)

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Hello,

I'm sorry to say, but I don't think any treatment will reverse the issue.

The best thing to do is to make different accommodations for her, such has housing in a shallow (12 inches or less) container.

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I hope she feels better.

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Hello,

I'm sorry to say, but I don't think any treatment will reverse the issue.

The best thing to do is to make different accommodations for her, such has housing in a shallow (12 inches or less) container.

:) I know that she'll always be floaty and have problems with it. I'm just concerned that this sudden increase in her swim bladder problems might be indicative of a bacterial infection, perhaps developed from the red place she had gotten from overexposure to the air.

Here's a picture of her I took this afternoon.

111111_zpsa34d3e5f.jpg

She seems to have some fraying of one of her back anal fins. The Melafix is supposed to help with that, so perhaps I should continue with that before I pull out the antibiotics?

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I'm sorry that your fish isn't doing well, can you also get us some clear side and top view photos?

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Do you have Metro-meds handy? If not, I think we should consider getting some to have on hand.

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Here are the pictures. If they aren't clear enough, I can take some more with better lighting, perhaps, but I didn't really want to stress her out more than I had to.

1a_zpsdf5646fc.jpg

1_zps14337853.jpg

1b_zps4dce3b68.jpg

In the last picture, you can see the scales at the base of her tail. It's hard to tell for sure because she's a pearlscale, but I really hope she's not pineconing (I really don't like saying it, poor little Elrond :undecided: ). The medication I have on hand at the moment (besides the Melafix) are E.M. Erythromycin (enough for the initial dose), and Furan-2. I also have Quickcure, but that's not going to do anything in this instance. If needed, I can go out tomorrow and try to find the Metromeds, if they would be best.

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Hello,

Metro-Meds would have to be ordered from goldfishconnection.com, or if you are in an emergency, a Koko's forum member might be able to ship some to you faster. So, let us determine if it's needed in the next day or so.

With pearlies, it's not really possible to conclude dropsy based on scale appearance. What we can do is to look for bubbles on the body that look like blisters, which can be of varying sizes. Several of the mod team members that they saw this at the base of the tail, and that's why we are hoping you can help us ascertain if this is true or not.

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Hello,

Metro-Meds would have to be ordered from goldfishconnection.com, or if you are in an emergency, a Koko's forum member might be able to ship some to you faster. So, let us determine if it's needed in the next day or so.

With pearlies, it's not really possible to conclude dropsy based on scale appearance. What we can do is to look for bubbles on the body that look like blisters, which can be of varying sizes. Several of the mod team members that they saw this at the base of the tail, and that's why we are hoping you can help us ascertain if this is true or not.

The scales by her tail have never been completely smooth, but they are definitely appearing more fluid filled. On her tummy and sides heading towards the base of her tail, her scales don't look quite normal, more fluid filled and blistery. There's a white dot in the center of each of them, which usually isn't as obvious as it is right now.

Is there something that I can give her while I wait for the Metro Meds to ship? Perhaps some other medication that has metronidazole in it that I could soak some food for her in?

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Holy crap, I was cleaning her tank, and she has honest to goodness blisters on her! They're almost clear and see-through, so I didn't see them until I took her out of the tank and put her in a different bucket for tank cleaning.

I went ahead and bought the Metro Meds. They should get here in 1-5 business days, it said, but unfortunately the weekend is coming up. I may run to the pet store and see if there is some sort of antibiotic I can put in the water until then. I really don't want to lose Elrond, as she is one of my favorite fish, along with being one of the ones I've owned the longest and being the mother of all the fry I kept! :(

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See if you can find metronidazole powder or tablet. If you can convince your vet to give you some, that will work as well. I will help with dosages. Also, get furan-2 or bifuran if you can. Then, let me know once you have these. :)

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I have Furan-2 already with me. Will that work for now until the Metro-Meds come in? I don't know about my ability to smooth talk a vet into getting me some metronidazole. :P

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I have Furan-2 already with me. Will that work for now until the Metro-Meds come in? I don't know about my ability to smooth talk a vet into getting me some metronidazole. :P

See if you can find metronidazole powder. It is also made by Seachem, and is called Metroplex. The Pets won't have them, but your local stores might.

The other option is to get API General Cure, which does have metronidazole (along with prazi) in it. We would use that with the furan.

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See if you can find metronidazole powder. It is also made by Seachem, and is called Metroplex. The Pets won't have them, but your local stores might.

The other option is to get API General Cure, which does have metronidazole (along with prazi) in it. We would use that with the furan.

Ok, I got 5 grams of 100% Metronidazole (Seachem) at the LFS, along with the Furan-2 already on hand :)

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See if you can find metronidazole powder. It is also made by Seachem, and is called Metroplex. The Pets won't have them, but your local stores might.

The other option is to get API General Cure, which does have metronidazole (along with prazi) in it. We would use that with the furan.

Ok, I got 5 grams of 100% Metronidazole (Seachem) at the LFS, along with the Furan-2 already on hand :)

Fantastic! We can begin, but I need to make a correct first. We will be using Tri-Sulfa, and not Furan. The reason is that the furans are very poorly absorbed, so while it's great for superficial problems, it's not going to be useful for dropsy.

Please put your fish in a 10 gallon QT, if you haven't already.

- dosage of metro is 200mg per 10 gallons (2 scoops I think)

- dosage of TS is according to the box

- add 2x Prime after 24h

- after 48h, do a 100% WC and re-add meds

Follow this cycle until the MMs arrive.

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Fantastic! We can begin, but I need to make a correct first. We will be using Tri-Sulfa, and not Furan. The reason is that the furans are very poorly absorbed, so while it's great for superficial problems, it's not going to be useful for dropsy.

I went ahead and put the Metronidazole in. I have to go get the Tri-sulfa now (all I have is the Furan-2), but I'll put that in when I get it.

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Sorry for the confusion. You did great adding the metro first. :)

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Sorry for the confusion. You did great adding the metro first. :)

Well, in my original post, I said that I had Triple Sulfa, when I really had Furan-2.:P Either way, I got the triple Sulfa and it's in the tank with her now.

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:thumbs:

If you don't mind updating us at least once a day, that would be great!

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:thumbs:

If you don't mind updating us at least once a day, that would be great!

Ok, I will :) Thanks for all your help/advice! I really hope she pulls through this. Do you know what the general success rate of this treatment usually is?

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:thumbs:

If you don't mind updating us at least once a day, that would be great!

Ok, I will :) Thanks for all your help/advice! I really hope she pulls through this. Do you know what the general success rate of this treatment usually is?

It's hard to say. I would like to think that it's somewhere around 75% or more, but that is really with Metro-Meds, when used early enough.

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Sorry to see your little pearlie isn't well. She looks like a real sweetie, I have all my fingers and toes crossed for a speedy recovery for her :)

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Fantastic! We can begin, but I need to make a correct first. We will be using Tri-Sulfa, and not Furan. The reason is that the furans are very poorly absorbed, so while it's great for superficial problems, it's not going to be useful for dropsy.

Please put your fish in a 10 gallon QT, if you haven't already.

- dosage of metro is 200mg per 10 gallons (2 scoops I think)

- dosage of TS is according to the box

- add 2x Prime after 24h

- after 48h, do a 100% WC and re-add meds

Follow this cycle until the MMs arrive.

I may have misread your instructions. :doh11: I added a second dose of both medications this evening (two more scoops of metronidazole and another packet of Tri-sulfa) without a water change, but 24 hours after the initial dose. The packages say to add a pack of the tri-sulfa for the second day of treatment, but the metronidazole says to add a dose every two days. I maybe should have added the second pack of tri-sulfa, but skipped the metronidazole for today. Either way, it did say that there was little danger of overdosing the metro on the packaging and 24 hours had passed since the previous dose.

She seems to be pretty much the same today. The blisters are still there, but there does not seem to be an increase in their numbers, which is good. She's also continuing to eat, although I still have to hold her and feed her by hand.

Sorry to see your little pearlie isn't well. She looks like a real sweetie, I have all my fingers and toes crossed for a speedy recovery for her :)

She is a little sweetie. She's the fish in my profile picture looking straight at the camera. :heart

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I would like for you to go with our modified directions if possible, which is to dose in meds every 2 days following a 100% WC, but add 2x Prime daily. :)

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Do you want her to use Epsom at all, Alex? :idont

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