Regular Member goldiegeek Posted April 14, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 Hi Guys, I was jealously browsing Rainforest last night and came across "Ranchu with dorsal fin". Very cool looking. Would these be considered flawed fish? Is a ranchu with a dorsal fin still a ranchu? Is a lionhead a ranchu with a big full head wen? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporter Helen Posted April 14, 2014 Supporter Share Posted April 14, 2014 link? it's most likely due to inbreeding... and the breeder missed culling it at fry ages. sometimes it's harder to cull when they're looking more like cute fish 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Mikey Posted April 14, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 link? it's most likely due to inbreeding... and the breeder missed culling it at fry ages. sometimes it's harder to cull when they're looking more like cute fish They are adorable!! if I had room I would have one http://www.raingarden.us/1075a.JPG and he's a nacreous 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporter Helen Posted April 14, 2014 Supporter Share Posted April 14, 2014 what a cutie 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Lis. Posted April 14, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 I would love a ranchu with a dorsal, I think it just makes them special 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin koko Posted April 14, 2014 Admin Share Posted April 14, 2014 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Daniel Posted April 14, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 That's really neat! I think he looks adorable with a dorsal. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member jmetzger72 Posted April 14, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 (edited) Hi Guys, I was jealously browsing Rainforest last night and came across "Ranchu with dorsal fin". Very cool looking. Would these be considered flawed fish? Is a ranchu with a dorsal fin still a ranchu? Is a lionhead a ranchu with a big full head wen? Yes, most Ranchu breeders, judges, etc. would regard this as a flawed fish. I agree with Helen's answer. However, we as collectors can love and appreciate any fish regardless of official standards The Lionhead is the original Chinese dorsaless fish. An ideal Lionhead has a straight back and it's head is large in proportion to it's body. There should also be considerable, bumpy headgrowth. The tail leaves the peduncle at a gentle angle and there is no tuck. The Ranchu is the refined Japanese version of the original dorsaless breed. They cultivated and bred fish with rounder backs and tight tail tucks. An ideal Ranchu has a smooth arched back, a smaller head proportion to the body and less wen. The wen is also smoother than that of a Lionhead. Finally, the tail should leave the peduncle at a sharp angle. Of course, there are many blends of these breeds such as the Lionchu which show traits of both fish. Edited April 14, 2014 by jmetzger72 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member *Amanda* Posted April 14, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 I saw this too last week, and thought it was really cute! I've never seen a ranchu with a dorsal fin in person, but the ones sold in my area have very little if any wen. I heard that ranchu have the most defects because they are a relatively new breed compared to the other varieties, and it takes time to suppress the "unwanted" traits. Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member goldiegeek Posted April 14, 2014 Author Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 However they came to be, I think they are AWESOME! They look like they have a little costume fin on. lol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member goldiegeek Posted April 14, 2014 Author Regular Member Share Posted April 14, 2014 Hi Guys, I was jealously browsing Rainforest last night and came across "Ranchu with dorsal fin". Very cool looking. Would these be considered flawed fish? Is a ranchu with a dorsal fin still a ranchu? Is a lionhead a ranchu with a big full head wen? Yes, most Ranchu breeders, judges, etc. would regard this as a flawed fish. I agree with Helen's answer. However, we as collectors can love and appreciate any fish regardless of official standards The Lionhead is the original Chinese dorsaless fish. An ideal Lionhead has a straight back and it's head is large in proportion to it's body. There should also be considerable, bumpy headgrowth. The tail leaves the peduncle at a gentle angle and there is no tuck. The Ranchu is the refined Japanese version of the original dorsaless breed. They cultivated and bred fish with rounder backs and tight tail tucks. An ideal Ranchu has a smooth arched back, a smaller head proportion to the body and less wen. The wen is also smoother than that of a Lionhead. Finally, the tail should leave the peduncle at a sharp angle. Of course, there are many blends of these breeds such as the Lionchu which show traits of both fish. Gotcha! I could never tell the difference. Okay, so is a buffalo head the one with the full face wen? I am curious bgecause I have a ranchu with a huge "entire head" wen. lol. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Tuba Toothpaste Posted April 15, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 15, 2014 Awww such a cutie! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member jmetzger72 Posted April 15, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 15, 2014 Hi Guys, I was jealously browsing Rainforest last night and came across "Ranchu with dorsal fin". Very cool looking. Would these be considered flawed fish? Is a ranchu with a dorsal fin still a ranchu? Is a lionhead a ranchu with a big full head wen? Yes, most Ranchu breeders, judges, etc. would regard this as a flawed fish. I agree with Helen's answer. However, we as collectors can love and appreciate any fish regardless of official standards The Lionhead is the original Chinese dorsaless fish. An ideal Lionhead has a straight back and it's head is large in proportion to it's body. There should also be considerable, bumpy headgrowth. The tail leaves the peduncle at a gentle angle and there is no tuck. The Ranchu is the refined Japanese version of the original dorsaless breed. They cultivated and bred fish with rounder backs and tight tail tucks. An ideal Ranchu has a smooth arched back, a smaller head proportion to the body and less wen. The wen is also smoother than that of a Lionhead. Finally, the tail should leave the peduncle at a sharp angle. Of course, there are many blends of these breeds such as the Lionchu which show traits of both fish. Gotcha! I could never tell the difference. Okay, so is a buffalo head the one with the full face wen? I am curious bgecause I have a ranchu with a huge "entire head" wen. lol. Buffalos usually have large growth under the eyes and on either side of the mouth which protrudes forward. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member goldiegeek Posted April 15, 2014 Author Regular Member Share Posted April 15, 2014 Hi Guys, I was jealously browsing Rainforest last night and came across "Ranchu with dorsal fin". Very cool looking. Would these be considered flawed fish? Is a ranchu with a dorsal fin still a ranchu? Is a lionhead a ranchu with a big full head wen? Yes, most Ranchu breeders, judges, etc. would regard this as a flawed fish. I agree with Helen's answer. However, we as collectors can love and appreciate any fish regardless of official standards The Lionhead is the original Chinese dorsaless fish. An ideal Lionhead has a straight back and it's head is large in proportion to it's body. There should also be considerable, bumpy headgrowth. The tail leaves the peduncle at a gentle angle and there is no tuck. The Ranchu is the refined Japanese version of the original dorsaless breed. They cultivated and bred fish with rounder backs and tight tail tucks. An ideal Ranchu has a smooth arched back, a smaller head proportion to the body and less wen. The wen is also smoother than that of a Lionhead. Finally, the tail should leave the peduncle at a sharp angle. Of course, there are many blends of these breeds such as the Lionchu which show traits of both fish. Gotcha! I could never tell the difference. Okay, so is a buffalo head the one with the full face wen? I am curious bgecause I have a ranchu with a huge "entire head" wen. lol. Buffalos usually have large growth under the eyes and on either side of the mouth which protrudes forward. Here's my girl, definitely has some under the eye action going on: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member ahardeay Posted April 15, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 15, 2014 I have had ranchu with dorsal fins with my fry before. Breeders usually cull them, but my LFS will take them and my friend with a pond like to take "oddballs" sometimes too. I think it would be fun to breed one to an oranda to make ....I'm blanking on the name for it, but there is a shorter rounder bodied oranda now gaining popularity. I don't have a large enough setup to take on that project though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member jmetzger72 Posted April 15, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 15, 2014 I have had ranchu with dorsal fins with my fry before. Breeders usually cull them, but my LFS will take them and my friend with a pond like to take "oddballs" sometimes too. I think it would be fun to breed one to an oranda to make ....I'm blanking on the name for it, but there is a shorter rounder bodied oranda now gaining popularity. I don't have a large enough setup to take on that project though. Ingot 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member goldiegeek Posted April 15, 2014 Author Regular Member Share Posted April 15, 2014 I have had ranchu with dorsal fins with my fry before. Breeders usually cull them, but my LFS will take them and my friend with a pond like to take "oddballs" sometimes too. I think it would be fun to breed one to an oranda to make ....I'm blanking on the name for it, but there is a shorter rounder bodied oranda now gaining popularity. I don't have a large enough setup to take on that project though. Ingot I thought Ingots were short bodied Ryukin with Oranda. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member jmetzger72 Posted April 16, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 16, 2014 I have had ranchu with dorsal fins with my fry before. Breeders usually cull them, but my LFS will take them and my friend with a pond like to take "oddballs" sometimes too. I think it would be fun to breed one to an oranda to make ....I'm blanking on the name for it, but there is a shorter rounder bodied oranda now gaining popularity. I don't have a large enough setup to take on that project though. Ingot I thought Ingots were short bodied Ryukin with Oranda. Well, they call them Ingot Orandas is all I know. I think they are really a cross of a Ryukin and a Ranchu. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member goldiegeek Posted April 16, 2014 Author Regular Member Share Posted April 16, 2014 Wonder where one could be found.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member jmetzger72 Posted April 16, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted April 16, 2014 Wonder where one could be found.... Dandy Orandas has them sometimes 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member goldiegeek Posted April 23, 2014 Author Regular Member Share Posted April 23, 2014 Nice! I'll be checking that out:) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Rhea Posted May 6, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted May 6, 2014 Mine are going to be oranda-ranchus haha. Mom is ranchu and dad oranda. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Remo AkaGizmo Barcellone Posted May 7, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted May 7, 2014 ... That's cool! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member Pearlscaleperfect Posted May 7, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted May 7, 2014 Hi Guys, I was jealously browsing Rainforest last night and came across "Ranchu with dorsal fin". Very cool looking. Would these be considered flawed fish? Is a ranchu with a dorsal fin still a ranchu? Is a lionhead a ranchu with a big full head wen? Yes, most Ranchu breeders, judges, etc. would regard this as a flawed fish. I agree with Helen's answer. However, we as collectors can love and appreciate any fish regardless of official standards The Lionhead is the original Chinese dorsaless fish. An ideal Lionhead has a straight back and it's head is large in proportion to it's body. There should also be considerable, bumpy headgrowth. The tail leaves the peduncle at a gentle angle and there is no tuck. The Ranchu is the refined Japanese version of the original dorsaless breed. They cultivated and bred fish with rounder backs and tight tail tucks. An ideal Ranchu has a smooth arched back, a smaller head proportion to the body and less wen. The wen is also smoother than that of a Lionhead. Finally, the tail should leave the peduncle at a sharp angle. Of course, there are many blends of these breeds such as the Lionchu which show traits of both fish. When you started talking about Ranchu it should be clear you're describing a side view Ranchu which is actually developed in China. Japan has developed the top view Ranchu. They have a totally different set of traits and things like tail tuck and sloping of the back are not as important because the animal is only Bred to be viewed from above. They're less round when viewed from above and should be kind of an oblong shape. The head growth is very important, especially the "cheeks" which are known as the funtan. The splay of the tail and how strong it is also defines a good TVR. (Red and white is a TVR and orange is a SVR) Just wanted to clear that up! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regular Member jmetzger72 Posted May 7, 2014 Regular Member Share Posted May 7, 2014 (edited) I was making a general distinction between a Lionhead and a Ranchu. Yes, there are different kinds of Ranchu as I said in my last statement. But, both the top and sideview Ranchus show more of a curved back, less head growth and a sharper tail tuck than does a traditional Lionhead. I, also disagree that the sideview Ranchu was developed in China. All of my reference books on Goldfish (including the Chinese books) say Japan. Here is a traditional Chinese Lionhead: https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRNvc4NLOmF9e9rYuhEFMCL1sI9D9J3lFcFHZDMPy4E-d9Ht1gy You can see what I mean about a strait back, larger head and less of an angle from the peduncle to the tail. Edited May 7, 2014 by jmetzger72 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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