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Vanessa Has A Hole In Her Wen


waterfaller1

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An update on Vann and his tankmates: It has been a very long trying time for me trying to get Vann well. And in the process, I lost Fu Man Chu the red/black ranchu on Sunday, and Lovey the white Oranda with the heart on her wen the night before last. :(

Lots of trial and error on the meds with Vann. The medicine from the koi show did nothing but make matters worse. I tried more baytril after, at a higher dose, and what was supposed to be a longer time, from a different vet. He tried to help, including phone and e-mail consultation at no charge. He was not responding to it, and had started to slime excessively.

As it turns out, I should have listened to Alex, and gone with metronidazole. I found someone willing to speak to me over the phone. She has gone way over and above for me{someone she does not know}, including overnighting me meds at no charge. We talked at great length, and she has helped me see things I have missed, including criticism of my entire goldfish setup. After going through all of the symptoms, she is pretty sure I am dealing with the parasite hexamita. And with Vann, the subsequent bacterial infection. My remaining three goldfish, are in qt with metronidazole and nitrofurazone green. I have ordered more to see me through.

So I am in the process of tearing down my 90, nuking it, and resetting it. No more substrate. No decor for now, and if I put any back it will be extremely minimal. Zen.

I am not certain which way to go with that yet, but that is my last worry at the moment. No more bags of Eheim media in the sump. They will be replaced with two custom cut pieces of Poret foam I ordered from Swiss Tropicals. A great guy btw, who answered my questions last Sunday night, and the box already arrived yesterday.

I do believe now that the tahitian moon sand is harmful to goldfish. They ingest it! And there is no good way to clean it. Barebottom is the way to go....back to that for me.

Back to Vann~ his face had really been necrosing. Sloughing off in pieces. I have some very scary photos. If you think it is ok I can post them. But now, just after a few days in the new meds it has finally stopped progressing. The bad news I had a few days back was he had quit eating. But yesterday morning I searched and found a website, and Koko shared a video with me in a PM on how to force feed. So I did that. I am happy to announce he is now eating on his own. I hope this will continue. And my biggest hope is that I am now on the right track, and my three remaining lovely fish will survive this nightmare. So I still have Vann,Charlie the lavender ranchu , and Moby the blue oranda.

Sorry for the long post.

Edited by waterfaller1
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Hi Carole,

I'm so sorry that you are having to go through this. I completely understand how you feel, having been there and having lost a number of much cherished orandas with this insidious problem. I hope Van pulls through, and we are always here for you. :hug

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Thank you Alex. And thanks so much for being here and trying to help. I think people need to stop saying "hexamita is not common with goldfish". While that may be true, in my case it made me dismiss and not pay attention to those particular symptoms. One of which is long white slimy poop, and another is a swollen belly. I never realized it is a parasite that attacks the gut. I just knew it caused HITH with saltwater fish. I pray to the fish gods that I am doing the right thing now. The progress in just a few days is short of miraculous. And I am a water changing fool right now. I do a 25% early in the day to remove morning waste, and a 50% later in the afternoon and replacement of meds. I am instructed to complete ten days of metro, and fourteen days of nitro.

My 90 gallon will be drained today. I will remove the substrate, and leftover stones. Refill and add a gallon of white vinegar. I cannot use bleach or other caustic things because of my birds. This will give a good clean out of my whole system and nuke any parasites that might be leftover. After a few days I will drain it and let it dry out a week before refilling it, making sure to clean up under the lip of the tank as well. I had to find a home for my loach and snails, and leftover live plants as they could not be treated. I was holding them in a five gallon for a couple days on my dining room table. I put an ad on CL and explained the situation and suggested they could be kept in a system with no other fish presently. Eventually the parasite should die off if present without any host. A very nice young fellow came and took them for free yesterday. One less tank to worry about..*whew*....

Edited by waterfaller1
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I agree. It's one of those things that we try very hard to balance here. Hexamita definitely affects goldfish, just not necessarily quite in the same way it affects other fish.

Don't beat yourself up about this. The problem is that we don't yet have a very good clue as to when metronidazole containing treatments work, and when they don't. I have had both situations, and was not able to dissect the fine nuances. I don't think anyone else has either. So, when it comes to problems like this, there is a bit of a methodical trial and error, unfortunately. :/

Good luck with your efforts!

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An Important NOTICE: I just started looking back through this thread from the beginning and wanted to post this very important thing. As I looked at my first photos.

Whenever you have fish in this condition you should be WEARING GLOVES! That was one thing the new person helping has instructed me to do. Not only for your own protection, but for the fish's protection. Even clean hands can introduce things, and especially with a fish with an open sore you are risking him getting another or worse problem.

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An Important NOTICE: I just started looking back through this thread from the beginning and wanted to post this very important thing. As I looked at my first photos.

Whenever you have fish in this condition you should be WEARING GLOVES! That was one thing the new person helping has instructed me to do. Not only for your own protection, but for the fish's protection. Even clean hands can introduce things, and especially with a fish with an open sore you are risking him getting another or worse problem.

This is good advice and something I think we often don't think about.

I hope Vann will recover :hug

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Hi Carole. I just wanted to wish you all the luck in the world treating Van. I just lost my black Oranda, Kol, to this a few days ago and I'm devastated. Sending healing vibes your way Van!!!

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Hi Carole. Sorry to hear about all the problem's your having. I thought I would let you know the mysterious person who has helped you is Cynthia form ECR. She is FANTASTIC!!!! She will do whatever she can to help your Goldfish!!!! My best to you and your Goldfish.

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Oh Carole, I'm so sorry for what you're going through, and for the loss of Lovey and Fu Man Chu. I admire the lengths you're going to to help Vann get better, and I really hope things work out :hug

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Oh thanks for saying so Heidi. Whoever she is she does know what she is talking about, and has been absolutely wonderful! Thank you too Lis.

More good news. Vann's wen is growing back! There is new tissue over what you see where it is white in those last photos. I just did a 50% water change. I will get some more pics. I still have to upload the others from yesterday as well. I am so excited..but still half of me says don't get your hopes too high. The other half keeps telling me he is going to make it. I will say this...that is one little fighter!

We are fighting the good fight...together. :wub:

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Oh Carole, I'm so sorry to hear about your losses. What you and your goldies have been going through is terrible. I hope the worst is over and I am sending positive thoughts that Van continued to improve with this new treatment plan. You are doing an amazing job!

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An update on Vann and his tankmates: It has been a very long trying time for me trying to get Vann well. And in the process, I lost Fu Man Chu the red/black ranchu on Sunday, and Lovey the white Oranda with the heart on her wen the night before last. :(

Lots of trial and error on the meds with Vann. The medicine from the koi show did nothing but make matters worse. I tried more baytril after, at a higher dose, and what was supposed to be a longer time, from a different vet. He tried to help, including phone and e-mail consultation at no charge. He was not responding to it, and had started to slime excessively.

As it turns out, I should have listened to Alex, and gone with metronidazole. I found someone willing to speak to me over the phone. She has gone way over and above for me{someone she does not know}, including overnighting me meds at no charge. We talked at great length, and she has helped me see things I have missed, including criticism of my entire goldfish setup. After going through all of the symptoms, she is pretty sure I am dealing with the parasite hexamita. And with Vann, the subsequent bacterial infection. My remaining three goldfish, are in qt with metronidazole and nitrofurazone green. I have ordered more to see me through.

So I am in the process of tearing down my 90, nuking it, and resetting it. No more substrate. No decor for now, and if I put any back it will be extremely minimal. Zen.

I am not certain which way to go with that yet, but that is my last worry at the moment. No more bags of Eheim media in the sump. They will be replaced with two custom cut pieces of Poret foam I ordered from Swiss Tropicals. A great guy btw, who answered my questions last Sunday night, and the box already arrived yesterday.

I do believe now that the tahitian moon sand is harmful to goldfish. They ingest it! And there is no good way to clean it. Barebottom is the way to go....back to that for me.

Back to Vann~ his face had really been necrosing. Sloughing off in pieces. I have some very scary photos. If you think it is ok I can post them. But now, just after a few days in the new meds it has finally stopped progressing. The bad news I had a few days back was he had quit eating. But yesterday morning I searched and found a website, and Koko shared a video with me in a PM on how to force feed. So I did that. I am happy to announce he is now eating on his own. I hope this will continue. And my biggest hope is that I am now on the right track, and my three remaining lovely fish will survive this nightmare. So I still have Vann,Charlie the lavender ranchu , and Moby the blue oranda.

Sorry for the long post.

I am so sorry for your recent losses of Lovey and Fu Man Chu. I was in awe every time you posted photo's of them. They were gorgeous fish. :hug My deepest condolences to you Carole.

What wonderful news of Vann you've shared with us all. Sounds like you've been to hell and back. What fighters you both are. I too had an Oranda (Jet) that passed away from this awful disease last September. It's devastating. Sounds like your doing a lot for your tank and other fish to keep them from getting this. When Jet died I treated my other fish in the main tank with metronidazole as a preventative action. When I purchased my most recent Oranda last Oct. I also used this medicine the last 10 days of qt. after using Prazi and Salt. From my research and understanding this is contagious. (I have a topic on this) I applaud you for your actions taken and for what your still doing to complete a healthier environment. I also plan on taking out the sand in my tank. I just recently put this all in and also just recently having problems with a fish of mine. I believe it's all related. So bye bye sand.

What a wonderful Angel you have, that you now know who she is.

I can't wait to see Vann's recent photo's of his wen healing. :) I'm sending continued good thoughts for Vann's full recovery.

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Carole, I'm so sorry for your losses. Thank you for sharing your journey with us. I admire all that you have done to help your fishes. You have given me much to think about.

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Thank you for your kind thoughts everyone. All of you have been awesome. The new pics are uploading. I will post the new pics of Vann here, then I will post a new build thread with my mess photos haha! Have to run a quick errand, but will be back in a bit. HUGS :bighug

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Hi Carole. I just wanted to wish you all the luck in the world treating Van. I just lost my black Oranda, Kol, to this a few days ago and I'm devastated. Sending healing vibes your way Van!!!

I am so very sorry for your loss. :rip: Kol

Thanks for the kind words. Heart hugs to you.

Edited by waterfaller1
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Carole, please make sure to have Metro-meds on hand. There is a possibility that he will pinecone if the infection somehow progresses to that point.

This is going to be especially true if it turns out to be hexamita, one of the primary agents causing dropsy.

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Last one for now...look how pretty

newpicsmarch28025.jpg



Carole, please make sure to have Metro-meds on hand. There is a possibility that he will pinecone if the infection somehow progresses to that point.

This is going to be especially true if it turns out to be hexamita, one of the primary agents causing dropsy.

Ok..I do! Thank you

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Your poor baby Vann. You should continue taking photo's of him as he heals. (at least every couple of days) I'm glad Vann's behavior has improved and that he's eating again. This is all wonderful news.

Added: I just saw all your fish above. They are all gorgeous as always.

Edited by 4prettyfish
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