Jump to content

Rescued goldies--not sure I'm doing the right things for them


Sara Shissler

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 255
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • Regular Member

I've noticed the fantail bottom-sitting and clamping her fins since adding the prazipro. Right now she's huddled in the corner with her tail spread out, and her other fins are clamped down. Her gills are also moving a little more than normal.

Is this because of the flukes dying? The telescope did that a little the first day, but he is back to normal. If I go over to the the tank, she gets excited like it's feeding time, but then she sits back down. Nothing else in the tank has changed. The water parameters are all good, and I did a water change two days ago.

It's the second day on a double-dose of Prazipro + 0.3% salt.

It's technically the second round of Prazipro I've done, but I probably under-dosed the first round.

It's likely a reaction to the prazi treatment. I hope that she will begin perking up tomorrow, or the next day at the latest. If not, then she has developed a secondary infection. :(

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

My fish had a hard time with fluke die-off. It's hard to watch. My fish got through it. Healing energy to your babies!

Can you remind us of the antibiotics you have on hand? Do you have metro meds from goldfish connections? If she doesn't pull out soon, Alex/mods will potentially direct you to use some form of antibiotics. (Ideally you use antibiotics only if you need to.) Keep us up to date daily or more if necessary, so that Alex/mods can guide you through this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

My fish had a hard time with fluke die-off. It's hard to watch. My fish got through it. Healing energy to your babies!

Can you remind us of the antibiotics you have on hand? Do you have metro meds from goldfish connections? If she doesn't pull out soon, Alex/mods will potentially direct you to use some form of antibiotics. (Ideally you use antibiotics only if you need to.) Keep us up to date daily or more if necessary, so that Alex/mods can guide you through this.

Thanks, Lisa--that makes me feel better.

Yes, I have Kanaplex, Melafix. Medigold, and ParaGuard.

She is about the same today. She has energy, and is eating well, she just looks very uncomfortable, she will swim around a little, but then she goes back to her corner and sits with her fins clamped and her mouth opening. I feel bad that I didn't know about the flukes until now. I used to call her "grumpy fish", but maybe she was just feeling the flukes.

The oranda is also a bit lethargic--I can only describe it as "spacy". He is usually constantly swimming around and sifting through the sand, but he's just been hanging out mid-tank today, sometimes almost vertical in the water, with his head up. I don't know if that is something to worry about, but it's different behavior than normal.

Their fins also look like they maybe have backslid and gotten a little worse again. Could this also be from the flukes? I might be obsessing, but it seems like some of the places where the tears looked better are ragged again. It's still better than it originally was though. Do they go back and forth as they heal? I hate these flukes!

What are the symptoms of a secondary infection?

Edited by Saracatt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

My fish had a hard time with fluke die-off. It's hard to watch. My fish got through it. Healing energy to your babies!

Can you remind us of the antibiotics you have on hand? Do you have metro meds from goldfish connections? If she doesn't pull out soon, Alex/mods will potentially direct you to use some form of antibiotics. (Ideally you use antibiotics only if you need to.) Keep us up to date daily or more if necessary, so that Alex/mods can guide you through this.

Thanks, Lisa--that makes me feel better.

Yes, I have Kanaplex, Melafix. Medigold, and ParaGuard.

She is about the same today. She has energy, and is eating well, she just looks very uncomfortable, she will swim around a little, but then she goes back to her corner and sits with her fins clamped and her mouth opening. I feel bad that I didn't know about the flukes until now. I used to call her "grumpy fish", but maybe she was just feeling the flukes.

The oranda is also a bit lethargic--I can only describe it as "spacy". He is usually constantly swimming around and sifting through the sand, but he's just been hanging out mid-tank today, sometimes almost vertical in the water, with his head up. I don't know if that is something to worry about, but it's different behavior than normal.

Their fins also look like they maybe have backslid and gotten a little worse again. Could this also be from the flukes? I might be obsessing, but it seems like some of the places where the tears looked better are ragged again. It's still better than it originally was though. Do they go back and forth as they heal? I hate these flukes!

What are the symptoms of a secondary infection?

Melafix and Paraguard don't contain antibiotics.

Can you afford to purchase Metro Meds from goldfishconnection? The other option is to have powdered metronidazole on hand. You could get that at a local fish store. The chain pet stores won't have it. Metro Meds is preferable because it has more antibiotics than just metronidazole. (I can't remember the other two.) If it doesn't clear soon, it maybe that Alex/mods will recommend powdered metro until you get the Metro Meds (which may take 5 days to get to you starting Monday). I can't recall them recommending Kanaplex for a secondary infection (but I could be wrong here).

My fish eventually had to go on Metro Meds, but they were looking distressed for many days during the prazi treatment. I did a three round prazi treatment, and during that time they had their good days and bad days (clamped fins, bottom sitting, sometimes floaty, darting around, one of them would shove themselves into the java moss so they would effectively anchor themselves to something while they rested). At the end of the treatment, they were a bit better but then slowed way down just after a day or two--clamped fins, bottom sitting, just looking forlorn and grumpy essentially--so Alex had me feed them Metro Meds and that resolved the problem. I'm not saying that Metro Meds will definitely resolve your problems, but it is an effective medicine food to have on hand for secondary infections.

Does this help?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

Ok--they definitely have the powdered metronidazole at the LFS, so I could get that any time. How is that different than the Medigold? I don't mind buying the Metro Meds, I'm just wondering.

They had a huge improvement on the Medigold.

Edited by Saracatt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I don't know for sure the difference--I don't think Medigold contains metronidazole. I've only read on this forum (as far as I can remember) that Metro Meds (MMs for short) were used for secondary infections due to fluke treatment.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Sara, if tomorrow she is still downtrodden, I would like to start an antibiotic course. We will decide when the time comes based on whether she/they have appetites to eat medicated food or not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

Sara, if tomorrow she is still downtrodden, I would like to start an antibiotic course. We will decide when the time comes based on whether she/they have appetites to eat medicated food or not.

Ok--she's a little better today. I was really afraid last night before I went to bed--she just sat down, and pretty much stayed there. But she has more energy today is swimming around more than she was yesterday, although she still has periods of bottom-sitting withs fins down and yawning.

Her tail looks worse though. It has more of the straight cuts, and both she and the oranda have developed areas with a red tinge on towards the ends of the tail fins.

They are all eating like normal--no problems there--so I could definitely do a medicated food.

Today is the last day of this round of prazi--maybe she will feel better after the water change.

Should I wait, or medicate?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

So now I'm mad. The telescope has started attacking the fantail's tail! It's in shreds. Why would he do this? It must have started within the last few hours. I've never seen this behavior before now. He just won't leave her alone. It's like he's trying to eat her tail. She was doing even better earlier after I changed the water, but now she's bottom sitting again--probably recovering from the attacks.

Could this be the start of a new mating again? He didn't eat her tail last time.

I took him out of the tank so he's in a five gallon bucket with an air stone. Argh!

I just called the fish store, and they have a tank divider that would fit my tank. Would this be a good idea for now if he doesn't stop this soon? I have a 16 gallon that I was going to keep around as a QT, but it's not ready. I actually just put some bleach in it this weekend to disinfect it.

Edited by Saracatt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I like the idea of a tank divider as long as medication is able to cross the divider. Maybe the shredded tail is a combination of tail flukes, breeding behavior, and the fittest picking on the weakest. The latter is bully behavior that does happen in a overcrowded tank (which I seem to remember is not an issue here) or when one of the fish is trying to establish dominance. In any case, a permeable tank divider would be good if he doesn't stop it soon. Some people have used a floating colander.

You said that you had not seen this behavior before, but I'm wondering if it has been happening while you are not looking.

Can you post pictures of the fantail's and oranda's fins?

How is the oranda doing? Still spacey?

Edited by LisaCGold
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

Well, she was the biggest and toughest one in the tank until now, but she's not feeling well, so maybe he is taking his chance...

I've seen them all nip at one another at times, but nothing as aggressive as this.

The oranda seems good today. And he's a good boy who doesn't nip tails!

Edited by Saracatt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

So to summarize: The oranda has more energy today but has red at the tips of the caudal fins. And the fantail's tail is more shredded today and has red tips. The tele is contributing to the fantail's tail problem. The fantail's energy was good this morning, but has slowed down since the tele's aggression.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

I put a divider in the tank. The telescope is in jail!

I also picked up some powdered Metronidazole, so I have Kanplex, Medigold, and that if they need it. The fantail is back to being lethargic in the corner. ):

Edited by Saracatt
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Yeah, I noticed that when my fish were going through treatment, they would be fine earlier in the day, then they would really sloooow down later in the day.

One thing that Alex may guide you to do is to either put the powdered metro in the water or in some food. The latter is preferred so that it gets into their bodies more effectively. So in preparation for that, do you have any repashy gel food or do you have agar agar to make some medicated gel food? Another option is gelatin.

Thanks for the pics. They'll be helpful to Alex.

Aw, tele, behave!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

Yeah, I noticed that when my fish were going through treatment, they would be fine earlier in the day, then they would really sloooow down later in the day.

One thing that Alex may guide you to do is to either put the powdered metro in the water or in some food. The latter is preferred so that it gets into their bodies more effectively. So in preparation for that, do you have any repashy gel food or do you have agar agar to make some medicated gel food? Another option is gelatin.

Thanks for the pics. They'll be helpful to Alex.

Aw, tele, behave!

He wasn't doing this before, so I hope he'll learn his lesson soon!

I have plain gelatin that I could use for the meds. I would be nervous to add anything to the main tank again for fear of ruining my biofilter. The first thing they told me to do at the fish store was to put Kanaplex in the tank, and the biofilter went away even though they promised that it wouldn't....that wasn't fun.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

You are right--putting any antibiotics directly in your main tank will be probably the demise of your beneficial bacteria. Thank goodness for medicated food. (Although, I would carefully monitor for a cycle bump even then.)

If you do need to make the medicated food (because Alex won't have suggested MediGold), you can make the food using gelatin, powdered antibiotic(s), and the NLS pellet food (I seem to remember you were feeding them that). You can use that food until you get the MetroMeds (if Alex suggests MMs).

Let's see what Alex recommends you do with regards to applying antibiotics or not.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

You are right--putting any antibiotics directly in your main tank will be probably the demise of your beneficial bacteria. Thank goodness for medicated food. (Although, I would carefully monitor for a cycle bump even then.)

If you do need to make the medicated food (because Alex won't have suggested MediGold), you can make the food using gelatin, powdered antibiotic(s), and the NLS pellet food (I seem to remember you were feeding them that). You can use that food until you get the MetroMeds (if Alex suggests MMs).

Let's see what Alex recommends you do with regards to applying antibiotics or not.

I think that's it! When I did an image search, it matched them exactly. Are they a problem? They probably came in with the plants. Next time I add plants I'll disinfect first. I haven't seen them lately though, so I wonder if the salt did them in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

that or the prazi got em.they do not hurt anything other than the aesthetics of the tank.they act much ,like pond snails.their numbers wax and wane with food availability.there is a product called no-planaria on ebay that has been reported to kill them,along with snails.this product is fish and shrimp safe.they can be squashed and fed to your goldfish though,as they are tiny freshwater mollusks.i have read that if goldfish get a taste for them they will hunt them down,and suck them off of the glass.lets hope they are gone and you will not have to deal with them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

How are they doing today, Sarah? If they are still mopey and I am still not around, would you ask one of the mods/helpers online to guide you with how to deal with secondary bacterial infections.

Basically, if eating, then Medi-Gold.

If not, then metro + kana in the water. Beware the cycle.

Lisa, thank you so much for your continued invaluable contributions to this thread. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Supporter

How are they doing today, Sarah? If they are still mopey and I am still not around, would you ask one of the mods/helpers online to guide you with how to deal with secondary bacterial infections.

Basically, if eating, then Medi-Gold.

If not, then metro + kana in the water. Beware the cycle.

Lisa, thank you so much for your continued invaluable contributions to this thread. :)

Okay--then I guess it's Medi-Gold--it would take a lot for these fish not to want to eat!

Is there something I could do for her tail? Would bathing in Melafix help?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...