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MagicCat

Help With Velvet and/or Ich

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Test Results for the Following:

* Ammonia Level(Tank) Oppm

* Nitrite Level(Tank) 0ppm

* Nitrate level(Tank) 10ppm

* Ammonia Level(Tap) 0ppm

* Nitrite Level(Tap) 0ppm

* Nitrate level(Tap) 0ppm

* Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 7.4; Currently don't own a Gh/Kh test. Not sure about chloramines.

* Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 7.4

Other Required Info:

* Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API Drops

* Water temperature? Probably around 75-78F. My thermometer broke a day or two ago but that's the temp range it usually is.

* Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 40 gallon, about 4 months

* What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? AquaClear 50 & Aquatech 20-40 (<<<Wal-Mart Cheapy). Together they filter 350 gph I think.

* How often do you change the water and how much? 50% once or twice a week.

* How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? Two days ago, 50%

* How many fish in the tank and their size? Two Fantails. One is about 2-3" the other is 5-6"

* What kind of water additives or conditioners? Seachem Prime.

* What do you feed your fish and how often? Omega One Sinking Pellets, twice a day. I throw in veggies every so often too.

* Any new fish added to the tank? No.

* Any medications added to the tank? No.

* List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. -Not sure. I've only had the fish for about two months, and I haven't treated them for anything. They are PetSmart "rescues" though, so not sure what they may have been given in the past.

* Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? Not that I can tell.

* Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? No. They're currently active and responsive.

Hi. I'm new here, but I've taken a lot of info from this forum in the past few months. You guys have really helped me out so thanks for that :)

Okay. So, here's my problem. About a week ago, a long-term power outage basically destroyed my cycle. I ended up getting some cycled media and substrate from my Aunt's tropical tank to keep my water safe. My issue is she informed me her fish have either ich or velvet yesterday (or both?). So my goldies have probably been exposed. Neither of them are displaying any symptoms of either parasite so far. Should I go ahead and treat to be on the safe side?

When I purchased my tank on Craigslist, and the woman gave me some meds and stuff, so here's what I have on hand:

Mardel Coppersafe (1/2 a bottle)

API Aquarium Salt

Tetra Paraguard (Unopened)

I can run to my LFS tomorrow morning if I need a specific med. Thanks for reading.

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have or had? have you seen your Aunt's fish? did you notice anything sickly about them? sometimes people wrongly suspect something is the problem when it could be something else.

rather than panic at this point and treat with unnecessary medicines, if your fish are not displaying any sickness or parasitic infestation for the time being, i would wait for the beginnings of symptoms before treating.

the first step with ich would be salt and increased heat with additional aeration.. in fact, that's all we really use to treat Ich with. so, keep an eye on your fish's fins. if you begin to see Ich cysts.. post back and we'll guide you through setting up for it.

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have or had? have you seen your Aunt's fish? did you notice anything sickly about them? sometimes people wrongly suspect something is the problem when it could be something else.

rather than panic at this point and treat with unnecessary medicines, if your fish are not displaying any sickness or parasitic infestation for the time being, i would wait for the beginnings of symptoms before treating.

the first step with ich would be salt and increased heat with additional aeration.. in fact, that's all we really use to treat Ich with. so, keep an eye on your fish's fins. if you begin to see Ich cysts.. post back and we'll guide you through setting up for it.

I saw them the day I got the media, and they seemed okay for the most part. Admittedly, I didn't examine them as close as I probably should have. And I won't treat unless you guys advise otherwise, but being the cautious person I am, I thought it wouldn't hurt to ask. I just don't want them to get sick.

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Edited by MagicCat

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:) fingers crossed that you will not need to treat.

I notice that you didn't QT your fish for the common parasites such as flukes and tapeworms. it is very normal now that fish will have these parasites from the time we buy them, given the condition they came in. often, at a chain store, all tanks or most tanks will share the same filtration and water flow. meaning, the same water passes through most, if not all goldfish tanks. so, if there is an ich or fluke outbreak, those sharing the same system even though they are in different tanks, will become affected.

so, the mildest treatment available is Prazi.. Prazi is available in two types. the powder prazi from www.goldfishconnection.com or the liquid type from www.tastyworms.com and the product is http://tastyworms.com/aquarium-solutions-prazipro.html

because this treats the problem direct and is friendly to the fish and cycle, we waste no time to just treat. always assume because it is most likely that your fish have been exposed to flukes. most here on kokos treat preventative rounds every 6 to 12 months even in a closed, well established community. I will advise that you go ahead and treat for the possibility of flukes at your earliest convenience. if there are none, this medicine will not harm your fish.

if there are flukes, symptoms are bottom sitting, thrashing, thickened slime coat, yawning, rubbing against glass & ornaments (sometimes gravel) etc..

prazi will not treat Ich or Velvet. if your fish are to display Ich and/or Velvet, we can treat with salt & heat as mentioned in my previous post. prazi liquid can be used with salt up to 0.2% at single doses and double the dose when using salt at higher than 0.2%

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I hope won't have to either. :)

Oh, yikes. I didn't quarantine them. I got them from the same store, so I didn't think it was necessary. My fish haven't been bottom sitting or rubbing on stuff though.. but I wouldn't be surprised if have they have flukes or worms.

A question: Is "Prazi" short for Praziquantel? If so, that Tetra Parasite med has it listed as an active ingredient, but.. Diflubenzuron, Metronidazole, and Arciflavine are also listed. Not sure what those are or if they'll hurt the fish. I'll pick up the PraziPro stuff if you think the Tetra may be harmful or ineffective.

And if I see ich/velvet, how much salt do I add to get to O.2?

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Edited by MagicCat

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Whoops.. I hope *I* won't have to.

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I would go with the PraziPro rather than the ParasiteGuard. If only Prazi is needed, then only treat with Prazi. Less is more whenit comes to treating. A doctor wouldnt treat something with an antibiotic-steroid combination if only an antibiotic is needed . . .

For 0.2% salt, you add 2 tsp of aquarium salt per gallon of tank water. If you're using some other salt let us know as there may need to be an adjustment in the amount of salt used. :)

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I would go with the PraziPro rather than the ParasiteGuard. If only Prazi is needed, then only treat with Prazi. Less is more whenit comes to treating. A doctor wouldnt treat something with an antibiotic-steroid combination if only an antibiotic is needed . . . For 0.2% salt, you add 2 tsp of aquarium salt per gallon of tank water. If you're using some other salt let us know as there may need to be an adjustment in the amount of salt used. :)
You're probably right. I'll order the PraziPro tomorrow. I found the same product on Amazon, so I think I'll order it from there. And thanks for the salt info. If my fish get ich or velvet, I'll use the salt treatment for sure. :)Sent from my Android using Tapatalk Edited by MagicCat

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And just so you know what to look for, ich looks like salt has been sprinkled on the fish whereas velvet looks like gold dust sprinkled on the fish. Just keep an eye on your fish. Ich is very common, which is why quarantine is so important. In fact, every fish I have ever purchased from the store displayed ich within the first week. I quarantine all new fish for at least a month because other diseases may not be noticed immediately.

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Just my opinion, but I like Tetra ParasiteGuard. When I have a fish that I think might have parasites -- as opposed to treating prophylactically -- I use ParasiteGuard for the first round because of those extra ingredients. Then I switch to prazipro for the following rounds.

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Just my opinion, but I like Tetra ParasiteGuard. When I have a fish that I think might have parasites -- as opposed to treating prophylactically -- I use ParasiteGuard for the first round because of those extra ingredients. Then I switch to prazipro for the following rounds.

I like this product as well, Sharon, and have suggested its use. I will also in the future.

However, there is a huge caveat. This product contains metronidazole, and as with any antibiotic, should not be used for just a few days. Metro really should be used for 14 days at least. So, if you want to use TPG, and there is no reason not to, you need to dose it for 14 days continuously.

Velvet is not really treatable by TPG, nor is ich. The salt in it is too low.

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Just my opinion, but I like Tetra ParasiteGuard. When I have a fish that I think might have parasites -- as opposed to treating prophylactically -- I use ParasiteGuard for the first round because of those extra ingredients. Then I switch to prazipro for the following rounds.

I like this product as well, Sharon, and have suggested its use. I will also in the future.

However, there is a huge caveat. This product contains metronidazole, and as with any antibiotic, should not be used for just a few days. Metro really should be used for 14 days at least. So, if you want to use TPG, and there is no reason not to, you need to dose it for 14 days continuously.

Velvet is not really treatable by TPG, nor is ich. The salt in it is too low.

If my fish don't need an antibiotic, would the TPG still need to be dosed for 14 days? And wouldn't the antibiotic damage my cycle? Sorry if I ask too many questions, lol.

Also, the fish still have no signs of velvet or ich.. maybe I got lucky and it didn't make it into the tank, but I'll keep checking to be safe. Hopefully they don't get it. I'm going to treat for flukes/tapes as Helen suggested with Prazi.. whenever it finally comes in the mail, at least.

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Edited by MagicCat

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Well, if your fish don't need antibiotics, then don't administer it for ANY day. That's the problem with TPG, you cannot remove the ingredient. Metronidazole happens to be the singularly most useful med in goldfish keeping, so it's particularly important not to raise tolerance against it in your fish.

No, you will not destroy your cycle with metronidazole.

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Well, if your fish don't need antibiotics, then don't administer it for ANY day. That's the problem with TPG, you cannot remove the ingredient. Metronidazole happens to be the singularly most useful med in goldfish keeping, so it's particularly important not to raise tolerance against it in your fish. No, you will not destroy your cycle with metronidazole.

Thank you so much for your help. I'll just use the PraziPro and maybe salt if I see ich or the other. It's good to know that TPG contains antibiotics for future reference..maybe it'll come in handy one day. I'm kind of new to medicating so please forgive my ignorance.

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Edited by MagicCat

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No need to apologize! And, please ask as many questions as you'd like. We'd rather you ask us who/what/when/where/how if you don't understand than blindly do what we say. :o

Also, please let us know when the PraziPro arrives before you add it so we can see how they are doing with just the salt. :D

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No need to apologize!? And, please ask as many questions as you'd like.? We'd rather you ask us who/what/when/where/how if you don't understand than blindly do what we say.? :o

?

Also, please let us know when the PraziPro arrives before you add it so we can see how they are doing with just the salt.? :D

Thank you. I'll keep you guys informed :)

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I think I'm seeing velvet now but I'm not sure. If there is some, it's a very small amount. It's so hard to tell though.. especially with their coloring. I'll try to upload some pics or maybe a video soon. I don't have a regular camera, so they will I will have to use my phone. I'm a little confused on how to post pictures/video.. I may just have to link them if I can't figure it out.

I'm getting so paranoid about this. :/

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Video is uploading. I couldn't get them to sit still for any good pictures..

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I had trouble uploading the other day. I ended up taking some screen shots from my video, so I apologize in advance for the low quality. Maybe you guys can see something I can't. Sorry it took so long.

Screenshot_2013-11-19-13-39-35_201311191Screenshot_2013-11-19-13-39-14_zps9555be2013-11-14-09-36-20_zps3ec35b4c.jpg2013-11-19-13-38-10_zpsb0051c74.pngScreenshot_2013-11-19-13-38-41_zps47bc79

It doesn't show up in the pictures well, but the orange guy (Kirby) has a few gold specs on top of his head and around his gills. I've noticed he's breathing a bit heavier than usual and he's missing a few scales. He seems a lot shinier too, which I've been read is slime coat thickening in response to the parasites, but I'm not sure. Pebbles (the calico) seems fine. Aside from Kirby's breathing, they've been behaving fairly normal.

Please let me know what you think.

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Edited by MagicCat

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good luck :)

I apologize if I'm a bother, but no one has responded yet and I'm not sure what to do other than ask for help directly. Could you take at my photos and tell me if you notice anything out of the ordinary? I'm not sure if I'm panicking or not. I'd like a second opinion.

Also, the Prazi came in the mail this morning. I'm supposed to treat for a month, correct?

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I'm not able to tell from the pics but I am not terribly familiar with velvet. It may help if you held the fish and took the pics closer, or you hold the fish and have someone else take the pic. iPhone pics should be fine. That's what many of us use for this type of pic.

I will see if any of the other mods can help with a treatment plan . . .

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I certainly can't see anything from the pics, but this is not unusual if it's velvet, since the gold dusting of velvet is not easily seen on even very clearly pictures.

Here is my suggestion - go for 2 weeks at 0.3% salt first. This will take care of ich, velvet, and a lot of other parasites. Then we will work in prazi.

Are there are symptoms right now that concern you? What are their behaviors?

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I'm not able to tell from the pics but I am not terribly familiar with velvet. It may help if you held the fish and took the pics closer, or you hold the fish and have someone else take the pic. iPhone pics should be fine. That's what many of us use for this type of pic.

I will see if any of the other mods can help with a treatment plan . . .

The orange one has a few gold-ish yellow specs on his head and near his gills. My Android has a crappy camera, but they're easily visible in person with a flash light. I asked my roommate to take a look and he saw them as well. I don't have an iPhone.

I certainly can't see anything from the pics, but this is not unusual if it's velvet, since the gold dusting of velvet is not easily seen on even very clearly pictures.

?

Here is my suggestion - go for 2 weeks at 0.3% salt first. This will take care of ich, velvet, and a lot of other parasites. Then we will work in prazi.

?

Are there are symptoms right now that concern you? What are their behaviors?

Thank you. Do I add the salt all at once or in 12 hr intervals? The calico is behaving fine but she seems to be the healthier of the two. As I stated earlier, the orange guy is breathing a bit heavier than normal. This morning I noticed him dart to the other side of the tank and basically smash into my false plant. He's never done that before.. Also, there's the specs..

Sorry for my persistence, but I'm extremely worried. I know the odds are against them anyway since they're from a pet shop.

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