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Canadansk

Not Eating, not even opening mouth and mostly bottom-sitting

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A double dose is often recommended here for the first round if there is a heavy parasite load. It is perfectly safe to double dose, I have done it with my own fish. Prazi is quite gentle. It's possible it will not help, but it will not hurt.

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Were you able to actually open her mouth when you tried?

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Yes, I had the mouth open numerous times, but never for any great length of time.

If I get assistance, do you think the idea of feeding her a softened pellet has any merit?

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do you have a syringe at hand? perhaps a pharmacy near by that you can purchase one? I've had success at syringe feeding before, the food needs to be dissolved down to an almost runny paste & then fed to the fish in small amounts each time.

that close up shot is just too darling :wub:

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Yes, I have syringes. I'm sure with a second pair of hands we can at least get some food into her. With any luck, she won't spit it out. She spat water out each time I pried her mouth open. It seemed dark in there but I didn't get a good look. What should I be seeing?

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you should be able to do it yourself, it's not a huge task, just be sure to not apply any pressure when holding your fish, particularly around the gill area. those areas covered tend to cause panic to the fish. here's a very long time ago video I took when I needed to syringe feed one of mine.. after posting this, I will search for a couple of other vids I made specifically for the food consistency on syringe food preparations and post back.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwTpEiMkZRU

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Well, with the assistance of my wife, I subjected poor little Stella to another round of indignities. While I held her and pried her mouth open, my wife used a syringe to attempt to put some well-softened food into her mouth. We're hoping some of it stayed in there. Lots ended up in the container I was holding her in. After that, we attempted to take some shots of the inside of her mouth. She's a small fish with a crooked mouth, so our success was somewhat limited. Here's a shot. She's still not opening her mouth voluntarily, but at least we might have gotten some food into her.

StellaOpenMouth_zpse57fc4b6.jpg

Any observations are welcome, but I guess for now we just sit back and hope for the best.

She's still very feisty and can certainly move around the tank and thrash about when I hold her.

Thanks again, all.

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aaww, the most important thing is to remember to keep the feeding routine up until she decides that she's going to eat independently.. keeping up the strength through bouts of illness is very important. even if she just eats a little bit.. every little bit matters to her right now.

I would also like you to keep an eye on her poop and since you take very nice photos :D I would like a few poop photos please :D:rofl

all jokes aside, being able to observe her poop can provide us with many clues :)

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I would be very pleased if she were to start pooping again: at least I'd know she was getting something to eat. I don't have a lot of fecal-photography experience, though. :) (none, actually)

Edited by Canadansk

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the amount of times we will ask to see it, by the time we're through with this case, you're going to be a professional at it :P 'point n shoot' lol..

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Here is the link to the prazi protocol. Please follow the 5 day version and do 5-6 rounds :)

Let us know if you have questions. http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/105076-schedules-for-the-treatment-of-flukes-etc-using-praziquantel/

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Wishing you, your wife and Stella the best of luck. She is adorable and I hope all of this effort on your part pays off! :heart

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I have just noticed that you have a Mr. Stella there :o:rofl

how's our patient today? were you able to manage more feeds?

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My son (now 8) named her/him Stella when we first bought her/him in February 2011. As I said a while back, I really had no clue whether the fishy was male or female, but thanks for clearing that up. Maybe we can change it to Stellan: that's a good scandinavian boy's name. Do I dare ask how you could tell?

We're going to try another feeding shortly. There's no change today, that I can see: still sitting on the bottom, not opening HIS mouth.

My continued thanks for your interest and advice.

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Well, hello again.

Here's the latest development. This evening, I found myself again still holding Stella/Stellan in one hand and prying his/her mouth open with the other while my wife attempted to feed her some very mushy food from the tip of a syringe. The fish does not care for this procedure at all and usually spits water out whenever I get the mouth open.

Anyway, after I was satisfied that at least SOME food might have stayed in there, I returned the poor thing to the tank. As I was peering in, observing the behaviour, my eyes fell upon something odd. It appeared to be a very thin filament of poop but with something clinging to the end of the strand. I carefully removed the object with an eye-dropper and brought it to better light for examination. I am convinced it is a very tiny tooth. Is this what goldfish teeth look like?

I'm now wondering if Stella/n has been gnawing away at something all this time, causing the bottom-sitting behaviour.

As I posted originally, I didn't think there were any objects small enough for her/him to put inside her/his mouth, but I suppose it's possible.

Stella has never been one to poke at the substrate much, preferring to only eat the food I give.

If there is something lodged in the mouth, I certainly can't seem to see it, but it's very difficult to get a good look.

I suppose another possibility is that the tooth came off naturally and has been making its way through her system.

Any suggestions or theories?

Here are some photos I took of the "tooth".

Thanks in advance.

StellasTooth_zps4d5dce21.jpg

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It does look like a tooth to me, but let's see what the others have to say. :)I have quite the tooth collection, and I keep them in an old baby food jar. :)

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that is definitely a goldfish tooth ;) It is actually typical for them to lose teeth regularly. With larger fish in a bare bottom tank you will see teeth on the bottom of the tank all the time.

Since doing the syringe feeding regularly have you seen her open her mouth at all on her own? during feedings or after?

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Thanks. I was pretty certain it was a tooth. My concern was that it seems to have made its exit out the back. Would this indicate a problem, or would it perhaps explain the odd behaviour lately?

No, Stella has yet to voluntarily open her/his mouth.

Still hoping…

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Thanks. I was pretty certain it was a tooth. My concern was that it seems to have made its exit out the back. Would this indicate a problem, or would it perhaps explain the odd behaviour lately?

No, Stella has yet to voluntarily open her/his mouth.

Still hoping…

I am honestly not sure which way they typically exit. My hunch is that exiting out the back would not be atypical, since the teeth are in the pharynx of the fish (basically the throat), so I would think that as they are chewing, if one comes loose it might go down the digestive system as opposed to coming out the mouth, however this is not based on any sort of fact. I would be interested in hearing what others might think :idont

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Totally a tooth! I have about thirty of them and the teeth from my 13 inch common could pass for a human vampire baby tooth. I'm pulling for Stella!

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Well, hello again.

Just an update, plus some observations on Stella (who we may rename Fella, after being told she is a he)

Anyway, miraculously, Stella is still alive. I honestly don't know how or why.

She's on the second round of Prazi treatment, but still shows no signs of opening her mouth or wanting to do anything but bottom sit.

We still struggle to get some food into her, with my wife feeding her by syringe while I try to hold the mouth open.

We attempted to get a few decent photos looking down her throat to see if anything was awry, but this proved difficult to get good focus.

Nonetheless, I have enclosed a shot. I know little of fish anatomy, so if you see anything of note, please let me know.

I did notice some unusual blackish colouration on two of her fins (see photo) which almost resembles mould. Again, I don't know enough to interpret this.

Lastly, you'll see by the top-view shot that Stella doesn't exactly seem to be wasting away, as far as shape goes, although I really don't understand why, seeing as she seems to get very little nutrition.

Still no sign of any poop, either, so the mystery continues.

I'm not sure how much longer we should go on with this.

I don't mind the extra effort, and it's certainly been a learning experience for us, but I also don't want to inflict any needless suffering on Stella.

Thanks again for your interest, advice and support.

DSC02660_zpsff4e50a7.jpg

DSC02664_zpsf2ae9419.jpg

DSC02673_zps5c9c4806.jpg

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