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Zinedane

A Big Stocking Question! Help!

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50 gal is too small for koi. They have very specific pond needs with the minimum size being 1000 gal. That fish most likely died from compiling disease and parasites due to water quality. If your brother doesn't listen there isn't much yu can do.

Definitely qt your fish. You can start a thread and we will help you through the process. :)

As your fish grow larger watch the nitrates. If they get too high you will need to be doing two or three large water changes a week instead of one large weekly. The other option is to get a larger tank, you could also be fine. It depends on the growth of the fish and the quality of their water. :)

I know but he just doesn't listen to me. *sigh and i think the problem is that too, as some of the fishes in the pond have died recently without any reason. Alright, well i'll try to get some funds to get a QT.

Alright, thank you for the much appreciated information! that's if i get the Oranda in time though. I'll be watching him/her closely. but if i do put both of them in the 30 Gallon Tank. how much time do i have before i need to upgrade? hopefully, as i graduate my course i can upgrade but that'll be two more years or so if everything goes well. does it depend on their growth rate?

Alright :) , I guess roughly 50 Gallons? it's kind of small. that's why i told my brother that he's quite overstocked but he doesn't listen. so Oh well.

and no i don't think so that the Oranda has been quarantined in the past. but i don't see him showing any signs of infection or what not, even the Koi look healthy, I leave everything in the pond up to my brother.

Unfortunately 50 gallons is not an adequate size to house koi and goldfish. Koi can grow quite large, although they do emit a growth inhibiting hormone. Realistically, the koi would be better off in an exponentially larger body of water (the general consensus on here is 300 gallons per koi with 1000 gallons minimum). However, if you've already told him and he has refused to listen, then there's not a lot that can be done about it unfortunately.

This thread is in similar vain to yours.

http://www.kokosgoldfish.invisionzone.com/forum/index.php?/topic/112854-just-curious/

Oops, Una posted whilst I was distracted.

Yes, i'm pretty well aware of that. It's what i think one of the info. I read here on the forums. Sadly though my Big Bro doesn't quite listen to me. Maybe because he thinks fish can LIVE in a small sized tank or pond. He doesn't take in to consideration that they will thrive. *sigh. and thanks by the way! :)

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Best wishes and best of luck! As far as your Bro goes, from your posts it seems like you care a lot about him. :)

For schooling him on Koi pond stocking, it's kind of like some situations with our teenaged kids -- "You can either believe me now, or find out the hard way later."

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Hi! It's great you're concerned about your brother's fish including Oranda. I'm really worried about the Oranda too. Of course, protect your Ryukin's health above all.

imo the Oranda is at way bigger risk in its present location than from any possible chemical exposure from a temporary container, which is a remote risk at worst and hypothetical at best.

My understanding is that GF are best not kept with Koi unless in very understocked conditions with lots and lots of room. iirc Koi bully the GF and compete for food to the GF's disadvantage.

If you can get any plastic storage bin like Rubbermaid or Sterilite at least 100 liters/30 US quarts or larger, grab it to use as a temporary/QT! If you're willing to do the water changes (basically, daily), all you'd need at first to rescue the Oranda is the empty container. I'm right there with you about the funds btw.

GF do like and thrive with having another GF for company -- a healthy eventual tankmate for your Ryukin, likely both will be very happy. Although it's the smallest tank that would be recommended, 29 gallons is very safe for two fancy GF. Of course water quality has to be monitored but this is true of any tank. Likely the 29 gallon tank will be big enough for quite a long time. Some say, fish grow somewhat more slowly if they're in a small-ish container, so that should help here.

If you decide to rescue the Oranda, quarantine her/him at least 4 weeks and preferably 8 weeks NO MATTER WHAT. If you'd like to rescue him, do it at the very earliest possible moment you can manage!

Nothing like Craigslist where you are (Phillippines?)? Let's start a business! CL has succeeded very well here.

Yup i'll try to get a large container! :) that's if i get some funds atm. and i Actually found out now that we have a spare 8Gallon Tank lying around LOL! One of my Bro's old tanks. anyways, can i use this as a QT? and if so though. how long can i keep the oranda and my Ryukin in the 30 Gallon Tank?

well there is Nationally but not Locally, it's mainly focused on the Northern Island (Main land).

Best wishes and best of luck! As far as your Bro goes, from your posts it seems like you care a lot about him. :)

For schooling him on Koi pond stocking, it's kind of like some situations with our teenaged kids -- "You can either believe me now, or find out the hard way later."

Of course, he is my Brother most of all. :) and *sigh maybe he'll learn sooner or later! thanks a lot for the input btw! :)

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It really depends on the growth of the goldfish how long they can be kept together. Most big growth is done in the first two years of life and then the goldfish levels off but of course that is not the case for every goldfish. Again it depends on the goldfish,what type of diet they are getting and the water quality provided.

I don't really have a definite number for you but I'm sure they could be housed together for at least a two year time frame. You will know better when you check your levels at the weekly water change when your nitrates are starting to creep up. There's also the whole world of plants that you can get into to manage some nitrate waste as well. But it is very addicting as many can attest. :)

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It really depends on the growth of the goldfish how long they can be kept together. Most big growth is done in the first two years of life and then the goldfish levels off but of course that is not the case for every goldfish. Again it depends on the goldfish,what type of diet they are getting and the water quality provided.

I don't really have a definite number for you but I'm sure they could be housed together for at least a two year time frame. You will know better when you check your levels at the weekly water change when your nitrates are starting to creep up. There's also the whole world of plants that you can get into to manage some nitrate waste as well. But it is very addicting as many can attest. :)

Ohh, so it means that it will really be quite okay for a while? but does it assure that they will grow to their full potential, as long as i follow the 20Gallon for first Goldfish and another 10 Gallon for an additional Goldfish? or the 15 Gallon each rule?. And does this mean that even if they are full grown, just as long as i can keep up the water Quality everything will go well?

Well, I've also been leaning to put plants in the Tank but due to budget or funds constraints i still have yet to go to my LPS. XD

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i Actually found out now that we have a spare 8Gallon Tank lying around LOL! One of my Bro's old tanks. anyways, can i use this as a QT?

how long can i keep the oranda and my Ryukin in the 30 Gallon Tank?

Koko's moderators may say it's not perfect, but -- we gotta do what we can, with what we have.

Sure, use the 8 gallon tank as a quarantine tank. Start today as soon as you can! fwiw we always use 27- or 30-quart Rubbermaid-type bins, that hold 7 gallons more or less. When there's no filter for the QT you just have to test and change the water every day. Some say (weloveteaching.com/puregold) it's actually better to give a sick fish 100% new water each day!

bodoba (is that Una?) already said it about the 29-gallon tank. Water testing will tell you if your fish get too big, because the chemistry will start to fluctuate with wastes going up quickly where they once were stable. Plants can help a lot. Quite possibly you'll never need a bigger tank for just the two of them.

First, though, rescue and quarantine the poor Oranda. Sounds as if some salt in the water may be called for right away...

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i Actually found out now that we have a spare 8Gallon Tank lying around LOL! One of my Bro's old tanks. anyways, can i use this as a QT?

how long can i keep the oranda and my Ryukin in the 30 Gallon Tank?

Koko's moderators may say it's not perfect, but -- we gotta do what we can, with what we have.

Sure, use the 8 gallon tank as a quarantine tank. Start today as soon as you can! fwiw we always use 27- or 30-quart Rubbermaid-type bins, that hold 7 gallons more or less. When there's no filter for the QT you just have to test and change the water every day. Some say (weloveteaching.com/puregold) it's actually better to give a sick fish 100% new water each day!

bodoba (is that Una?) already said it about the 29-gallon tank. Water testing will tell you if your fish get too big, because the chemistry will start to fluctuate with wastes going up quickly where they once were stable. Plants can help a lot. Quite possibly you'll never need a bigger tank for just the two of them.

First, though, rescue and quarantine the poor Oranda. Sounds as if some salt in the water may be called for right away...

Alright! Use the 8 Gallon as QT it is! and it'll be the first thing i do once i go home tomorrow from school, as i have classes tomorrow from 7 am to 3 pm :) im hoping for the best though for the Oranda! :) I really feel the Urge to get him/her and put him/her in the 30g.

Ohh! Now i get it! :) sorry if i didn't get it the first time! I hope so though that maybe i'll never need a bigger tank but still I am very willing to upgrade it sooner or later! :) and Will do! :) it's already 10pm here though so it'd be best to do it tomorrow. I'm sure he/she will get through the night.

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im hoping for the best though for the Oranda! :) I really feel the Urge to get him/her and put him/her in the 30g.

it's already 10pm here though so it'd be best to do it tomorrow. I'm sure he/she will get through the night.

Resist this urge at all costs! At least, until after 4-8 weeks of successful quarantine. I think I know what you mean, though.

You sound like a man of decisive action -- awesome! And apologies, the time difference escaped me. You're pretty wise to get good rest, that's key for everything else. Personally I've made mistakes and also have read about others' disasters when trying to do fish care late at night.

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im hoping for the best though for the Oranda! :) I really feel the Urge to get him/her and put him/her in the 30g.

it's already 10pm here though so it'd be best to do it tomorrow. I'm sure he/she will get through the night.

Resist this urge at all costs! At least, until after 4-8 weeks of successful quarantine. I think I know what you mean, though.

You sound like a man of decisive action -- awesome! And apologies, the time difference escaped me. You're pretty wise to get good rest, that's key for everything else. Personally I've made mistakes and also have read about others' disasters when trying to do fish care late at night.

Got it! XD wouldn't want to get any more additional problems at the moment! and maybe i guess, i always try to be very effective in everything i do. That's why i tend to ask properly first before getting myself into anything. It's like gathering info. first before taking the plunge, as what's taught in our class about management and marketing. and that's fine! :) that's what i think so too, and it'd be pretty unwise running around the house so late at night while everybody else is sleeping. XD

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I'm surprised everyone is allowing a 3 inch Oranda with another fish in a 29 or 30 gallon tank. For me, I think that's a little cramped, even for temporary reasons. I wouldn't get anything smaller than a 40, plus think about all that waste just one puts out. I would hate to rescue the fish, then have numerous problems due to water quality.

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I'm surprised everyone is allowing a 3 inch Oranda with another fish in a 29 or 30 gallon tank. For me, I think that's a little cramped, even for temporary reasons. I wouldn't get anything smaller than a 40, plus think about all that waste just one puts out. I would hate to rescue the fish, then have numerous problems due to water quality.

This is why everyone is saying 'make sure to check your parameters and react accordingly.' I agree with you, but the main thing is that this is only temporary housing. If we follow the bare minimum gallonage requirements, they technically would have enough space at 15 gallons each. (again, I always say 20g per fish because I have seen what goldfish growth can be like.) The OP has been informed that they will have to upgrade in a reasonable timeframe, so all we can do is see how short that timeframe is and help when needed.

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I'm surprised everyone is allowing a 3 inch Oranda with another fish in a 29 or 30 gallon tank. For me, I think that's a little cramped, even for temporary reasons. I wouldn't get anything smaller than a 40, plus think about all that waste just one puts out. I would hate to rescue the fish, then have numerous problems due to water quality.

This is why everyone is saying 'make sure to check your parameters and react accordingly.' I agree with you, but the main thing is that this is only temporary housing. If we follow the bare minimum gallonage requirements, they technically would have enough space at 15 gallons each. (again, I always say 20g per fish because I have seen what goldfish growth can be like.) The OP has been informed that they will have to upgrade in a reasonable timeframe, so all we can do is see how short that timeframe is and help when needed.

But goldfish growth also can be slow and fish can turn out to be small. We really can't know. A 30 could be fine forever.

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Also 3inches as a total length (including the tail) is not that large of a goldfish. A 3 inch nose-peduncle length would be larger.

This fish is currently in a quarantine so the op is checking the params and will get a feel on the water change adjustments. :)

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Also 3inches as a total length (including the tail) is not that large of a goldfish. A 3 inch nose-peduncle length would be larger.

This fish is currently in a quarantine so the op is checking the params and will get a feel on the water change adjustments. :)

He said here that it was three inches not including tail, though. So that's nose to peduncle length.

I Think the Oranda's about 3" not including the tail.

But goldfish growth also can be slow and fish can turn out to be small. We really can't know. A 30 could be fine forever.

This is very true as well.

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