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Does this happen to anyone else?

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Recently, I've noticed that my black moor likes to sit on the bottom of the tank whenever people are not around (I noticed by peering in through the window when coming home one day) but the moment he sees a person, he goes back to his normal, active self. I know that I worry way too much about everything concerning my goldfish :wacko:, so I was just wondering if anyone else has noticed their goldies being lethargic when not being watched, and hyper and "acting normal" when people are around?

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I have a telescope with long fins who bottom sits a lot during the day. It's his "norm". It's not bad if a goldfish bottom sits every once in a while

How long does he sit?

Other members will chime in, and it may be suggested to start a thread in the D&D section :)

Edited by teleSC

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It's always good to be sure noting is the matter but . . . goldfish will sometimes just relax or sleep by the bottom of the tank when things are less active around the house.

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He doesn't sit for very long. I mean, when I see it. As soon as he sees me come in he perks up again. I'm sure I am just worrying, which is why I didn't bother making a D&D thread. ^_^

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My big Red Cap Oranda does the same thing.

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He doesn't sit for very long. I mean, when I see it. As soon as he sees me come in he perks up again. I'm sure I am just worrying, which is why I didn't bother making a D&D thread. ^_^

Great! :D

Edited by teleSC

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My fish like to rest on the bottom at times too. If you're worried, you should check your water parameters and temperature, etc. and make sure everything is normal :o

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I always FREAK OUT when I see my goldie on the bottom of the tank. I rush over and stare at her but she's usually just fine :)

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In my experience, bottom sitting is something to worry about. I've seen my fish sit on the bottom and didnt take action until it was too late.

Just my opinion

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In my experience, bottom sitting is something to worry about. I've seen my fish sit on the bottom and didnt take action until it was too late.

Just my opinion

Agreed 100%. There is a difference in the occasional sitting or hovering versus actually sitting.

I have a ryukin who is now probably 300+ grams, but he never once sits.

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My big guy Rusty kind of hangs near the bottom when no ones around the tank ;) the other smaller guys are always busy all over the tank though ;)

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My fancies hover near the bottom when nothing is going on but they don't sit on the bottom. Sitting on the bottom sends me into water change mode.

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I also think there is a difference between sitting and hovering...

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Hi

fwiw dnalex and Midnight most likely are right (again!)

Bottom-sitting is something you def. should worry about, particularly if it's a change (even a subtle one) over time. Like Midnight, we have lost Goldfish for whom this was the earliest change. What makes it harder, if your Moor is like ours was, there's absolutely nothing else to go on, at least in the beginning.

Did your fish get Prazi'd? Gills look OK? Poops OK? Fins 100% OK? These may be obvious questions, please accept apologies, just hope you can avoid having someone whom you care about get sick. Filter media cleaned periodically? No tank deco with hidden cavities, no outlaw plants coral or wood? Substrate not too thick? Again, apologies...what you wrote makes me worry. If this happens to another one of our fish, imo something is going wrong until/unless completely proven otherwise.

If absolutely everything on all your fish, in your tank, and in your system comes up clean, maybe someone who's had similar can advise on what to do next...personally if this happens to us I'll ask the Koko's people what would be most likely and go ahead and treat for that. Poor little Goldfish -- their small bodies give them so little reserve that by the time they're in visible distress, hope is fading.

Best wishes, and please keep us posted.

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Steve:

My fish didn't get Prazi'd, they were all rescued and at the time I couldn't afford the medicine. I've considered buying it for them now, but haven't since I haven't seen any signs of anything until this. Gills, poop, and fins are all perfect. He does seem like he's been changing colors slightly...but that's the only noticeable difference.

No decorations in the tank, as my black moor is half blind and I don't want him running into stuff. I have four live plants. I clean my water and filter consistently, 50-60% water changes weekly. I'm in the process of completely removing the gravel I have in the bottom of the tank, taking out only 10-20% with each water change to avoid cycle bumps.

Since I posted this, I have realized that he only sits when the light is off and there is no traffic in the area. He shows no other signs of any illness, and is very active and eating like normal, so I was thinking that maybe it's just his new sleeping spot? He is never there for very long either. and it's always in the same spot in the tank.

I'm watching all of my fish very closely, and haven't observed anything. I was considering feeding metro-med to them, to rule out internal parasites, but I also know that then the medicine will be less effective if I need to feed it to them later on. :(

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Thanks for the update, it'd be reassuring if he only sits when the light is off. Personally, if this is a change from several months ago I would stay vigilant.

Have you considered going ahead with Prazi? I've read that all GF have gill flukes. Bacteria breech the GF's defenses & get a foothold where the parasites attach. imo it's wise to think twice before using antibiotics but MM may not be that farfetched if you haven't had the opportunity to treat for parasites yet (would still need to de-parasitize even if you gave MM to remove the original insult). Actually Medi-Gold may be your winner here given that Aeromonas is always hanging around. I think we've lost a couple fish to internal Aeromonas that showed up as decreased activity followed by bottom-sitting then lethargy, weakness and eventual dtopsy that failed to rrspond to Epsom/heat/MM's.

Subject to input from Forum sages and your own judgement, of course.

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My goldie has done that since I got her, I think she wears herself out and that is how she rests. At night when I cut the lights out she goes to the back corner and sits there, then in the day shes swimming like normal!

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I have considered going through the Prazi treatment, since none of my three have ever gotten it. Is that something I could just put in their current tank to treat, or would I need to separate them into a QT tank for it?

Also, the reason I suggested MM is because I have it on hand, but if medi-gold is better I can always consider ordering it as well.

He is not lethargic at all, and it really just seems like he sleeps there, on the bottom. He has always slept in this same place, but he would normally hover slightly above the rocks, and then recently he just goes and sits instead, with still occasional hovering.

Thanks for your input. :)

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AFAIK if treating all the Goldfish -- like you'd be doing -- you just treat in the main tank. Plants and the biofilter bacteria don't even notice Prazi. Not sure about scaleless fish or invertebrates, though, if your Goldfish happen to have roommates... Unless a fish was in QT for other reasons, we've always just treated the main tank. Only GF in it though.

Prazi is so non-stressful for GF, hopefully you'll consider going ahead and dosing yours. One of those things one might as well go ahead and do before there's an urgent need, you know?

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Yeah, they're by themselves, so it would probably be so easy, I think I will go ahead ad just do that. Where do you order prazi?

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Hi,

I order 10-gram containers of Prazi-Pond Plus powder from pondrx.com, about $25.00 each. The site owner is very pleasant (Ted, iirc) and ships fast. Double-checking the site before posting just now it took some searching to find the 10-gram size but it's there. If you live near a koi/pond specialty shop, they may have Prazi-Pond Plus powder & you wouldn't have to mail-order.

Powdered prazi is tough to dissolve in water. It takes about 5 min of shaking in a jar of tank water. The dose is 5 milligrams of powder per 1 liter of tank water. A digital milligram scale is needed if you use prazi powder. Amazon.com has pocket digital scales for pretty cheap. I got one for about $10.00, not including shipping, that measures down to the level of 10 mg which is fine. If you decide to order prazi on line and you put in an order for the milligram scale at the same time, maybe they both arrive by the time you need them? fwiw the digital scale has come in handy for several other GF applications here, including antibiotics and medicated food

I went with prazi powder because moderators on the forum I went on before finding Koko's -- very sadly, closed down because of illness of the site's owner/administrator -- felt really, really strongly that they had seen multiple treatment failures with PraziPro liquid. Maybe due to the strength/concentration of PraziPro? I don't remember that they recommended the 3% salt dips for stripping off slime coat before each Prazi treatment, which Koko's mods recommend, and which may be what you need for success with the liquid? If the other site recommended dips I must have overlooked.

Do you have any specialty/hobbyist LFS's in your area? A couple of smaller, non-chain LFS around here sell PraziPro but not biggies like Petco or Petsmart as far as I can tell. National online sellers like Drs. Foster and Smith also offer PraziPro but it seems it takes a specialized site for the powder.

Koko's Forum's excellent prazi dosing calendar is the one to use imo, whether you go with PraziPro liquid or the powdered form.

Best wishes, and keep us posted!

Edited by Steve1107

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Hi,

I order 10-gram containers of Prazi-Pond Plus powder from pondrx.com, about $25.00 each. The site owner is very pleasant (Ted, iirc) and ships fast. Double-checking the site before posting just now it took some searching to find the 10-gram size but it's there. If you live near a koi/pond specialty shop, they may have Prazi-Pond Plus powder & you wouldn't have to mail-order.

Powdered prazi is tough to dissolve in water. It takes about 5 min of shaking in a jar of tank water. The dose is 5 milligrams of powder per 1 liter of tank water. A digital milligram scale is needed if you use prazi powder. Amazon.com has pocket digital scales for pretty cheap. I got one for about $10.00, not including shipping, that measures down to the level of 10 mg which is fine. If you decide to order prazi on line and you put in an order for the milligram scale at the same time, maybe they both arrive by the time you need them? fwiw the digital scale has come in handy for several other GF applications here, including antibiotics and medicated food

I went with prazi powder because moderators on the forum I went on before finding Koko's -- very sadly, closed down because of illness of the site's owner/administrator -- felt really, really strongly that they had seen multiple treatment failures with PraziPro liquid. Maybe due to the strength/concentration of PraziPro? I don't remember that they recommended the 3% salt dips for stripping off slime coat before each Prazi treatment, which Koko's mods recommend, and which may be what you need for success with the liquid? If the other site recommended dips I must have overlooked.

Do you have any specialty/hobbyist LFS's in your area? A couple of smaller, non-chain LFS around here sell PraziPro but not biggies like Petco or Petsmart as far as I can tell. National online sellers like Drs. Foster and Smith also offer PraziPro but it seems it takes a specialized site for the powder.

Koko's Forum's excellent prazi dosing calendar is the one to use imo, whether you go with PraziPro liquid or the powdered form.

Best wishes, and keep us posted!

I have used PraziPro with my new fish LP and my other fish Basil when I found that they had a high infestation of flukes. I also now use it every 3-6 months as a precaution. I did/do not do a salt dip before hand and I'm not sure it should be done unless a mod recommends it specifically for the fish as it is pretty stressful for the fish. Usually this is suggested when the infestation is so large that using the Prazi effects the fish negatively. What I did have on hand as an extra precaution is KanaPlex because a high infestation could rarely lead to secondary infection. This happened to LP and I was glad to have it on hand. PraziPro really does the job when used properly but it's up to you in the form of Prazi used as either will work.

PraziPro is sold by Tastyworm.com, our sponser, and they have it at a very good price. I'd suggest getting a 4 oz. bottle of it and starting a D&D thread explaining your concerns and that your are going to do a Prazi treatment. From there Alex or another mod can walk you through it and they will be there if anything happens. :)

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Hi Steve,

We've bandied around with the whole question of whether the powder prazi works better than Prazipro or not, and personally I have not derived any satisfactory answers. We know that they both work, and some people have the impression that the liquid didn't work as well, but not much by way of real data to back it up. Because of that, we make sure to let people know that there are both options, with distinct advantages and disadvantages.

Btw, a little bit of vodka goes a long way in dissolving the powder. :)

As for the salt dips, this treatment used to be recommended a lot, but somehow fell out of favor. To me, it's quite a good treatment, and one worth keeping around.

We are all sorry that Betty is not well, and hope that she gets better soon!

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