Jump to content

Nitrate poisoning?


Orandafish

Recommended Posts

  • Regular Member

Amonia - 0

Nitrite- 0

Nitrate- currently 10ppm (was about 100 24 hours ago)

Nitrite tap- 0

Nitrate tap - nearly 0

ph - 7.6

AVI test kit

(crap! forgot to get a water temp, but it's just room temperature, no heater)

125 gallon, set up for about 6 years

Magnum 350 canister and Eheim pro series 2078 (takes up over 1/3 of the cabinet space under the tank). In the Eheim I have added Nitrate neutralizing bags

36" bubble wall for added air

I was religious about weakly water changes until about a month ago when my job changed. Today is my first day off 12 hour days in several weeks.

I normally changed anywhere from 15-25% water during frequent changes, but last night I changed 50%

inhabitants:

Shane: 8.5 inch blue oranda (the one who is sick)

Fluffy 6.5 inch red oranda

Nemo: 5 inch red ranchu

Solomon: 8.5 inch red/white veiltail telescope

Cleo: 5 inch orange fantail

Minnie: 3.5 inch orange pearl scale

3 small cory cats

Live plants: 4 marimo balls and 1 pathetic sword

API water conditioner and aquairum salt (maintenance salt, not medication doseage)

Feeding: New Life Spectrum pellets, offset with algae pellets, freeze dried shrimp, steamed broccoli and boiled/shelled peas on occasion

No new fish and no medication in the tank

Last medication to the tank was well over a year ago for lice. One treatment cleared all. No new infestations. Never had ick, flukes, fin rot, etc. I'm not a huge fan of medications, just clean water (or at least I was)

I was religious about weakly water changes until about a month ago when my job changed. Tomorrow is my first day off after working 12 hour days for several weeks. Before this work schedule change, I normally changed anywhere from 15-25% water during weekly changes, but last night I changed 50%

I came home from work at midnight last night to find my 3 year old big blue oranda listing lazily to the left. He would rest on the bottom of the tank, then slowly turn almost completely on his side. I found a few red streaks where his tail fins meet his body. No other signs of physical distress. He seemed to want to get up but the task was too daunting for him. He seemed to want to eat but again, did not have the strength. I tested the water to find my nitrate threw the roof, probably about 100 ppm. I did a 50% water change and cleaned the Magnum filter. I did not clean the Eheim filter as I didn't want to "over clean" anything. I did not medicate the water, only replaced the salt I took out during the water change. (about one rounded teaspoon for every 5 gallons). This morning, he was not better. The nitrates were now about 10ppm. Back to work...... At midnight tonight (24 hours later) nitrate is still at about 10ppm. Shane is even more listless than before, but I suppose it could be that it's just late. He is on the bottom of the tank on his side. He is not bent in half and he doesn't seem to be breathing heavily. He is not pineconing. No other fish in the tank seem to be affected in any way.

My research is telling me he is suffering from Nitrate poisoning brought on by my own lack of water quality control. Right now I'm looking for suggestions on what to do to help him recover. Do I quarantine him in a hospital tank? I would think moving him would stress him. Do I medicate? If so, do I use medicated food or a water supliment? The only hospital tank I have is a cycled 10 gallon. That might be pretty cramped for a boy his size.

Tired does not even begin to describe me. I hope I've typed this with a modicum of sensibilty and a low amount of typos. I'm off to bed and hope to rise in the morning to some good advise from people who care about "just a fish", like i do. I might be able to get a video tomorrow, but not tonight.

I feel so badly for Shane. I feel like I failed him.

Good night.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I'm so sorry you are having issues.

The symptoms that you described could be ascribed to having an acute response to high levels of nitrates, and you are having that.

I am glad that you were able to do a big WC, but I'm confused. If you think you have 100ppm (or more) nitrates, half of that is still 50, not 10. So, to be safe, I would do daily 10-20% WCs for now, regardless of what the nitrate tests say. At this point, we want to reach a state where nitrate is consistently less than 5, and then we will see what we must do next.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I've also been there. It sure is stressful. Here's to an easy recovery for Shane!!! :hug

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I'm so sorry you are having issues.

The symptoms that you described could be ascribed to having an acute response to high levels of nitrates, and you are having that.

I am glad that you were able to do a big WC, but I'm confused. If you think you have 100ppm (or more) nitrates, half of that is still 50, not 10. So, to be safe, I would do daily 10-20% WCs for now, regardless of what the nitrate tests say. At this point, we want to reach a state where nitrate is consistently less than 5, and then we will see what we must do next.

I agree with this. I don't see how a level of 100 could be reduced to 10 with a 50% change. But whatever.... If the test reads 10 new I would do another 50% change at least to reduce it down further. Then I'd take a nap :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Good luck. I don't know what your WC routine is, but if you are working a lot, get a water changer if you don't have one. I use mine with a cheap pond pump to drain the water. The water changer is the best piece of equipment ever.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

After a solid 8 hours of sleep, I got up and changed another 25%, this time using Prime water conditioner. I also rinsed out my marimo balls. Now the Nitrate reading is 40ppm. I guess I must have read the results incorrectly last night. Shane is on his side on the borrom of the tank and is even more listeless. Again, everybody else is fine. Would moving him to a tank with under 20ppm Nitrate be too much of a shock for him? I can only assume it would be the same reaction as a human coming up from a deap sea dive too quickly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Are you able to do another large water change of over 50%, if you could do two back to back it would be better? Getting nitrates to zero too fast doesn't affect them. It's just less poison so they can heal faster.

The point right now is to keep him in clean water so the fish can heal itself or so that the environment is safe enough to administer medications if they are needed at this time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Like bodoba, I would move him to a hospital tank with clean water. Make sure you match temperature and pH to avoid shocking the fish. I know of no reason that rapidly lowering nitrate is harmful. It's not like "the bends" which is caused by bubbles of nitrogen gas in the blood. :)

It might not help if the illness is not caused by excess nitrate or other water quality problems.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Shane is a pretty big boy, even for an oranda. He's about the size of my outstretched hand. Should I put him in my cycled little 10 gallon hospital tank or should I run out and buy a large plastic tote to use as his hospital tank? I've heard of people quarantining fish in these totes but wondered if the plastic would leach chemicals into the water.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I did an 85% water change tonight. We're down to 10ppm nitrate.. I'm holding off putting him in another tank. I think moving him would be too stressful. Right now he is completely motionless on his side on the bottom of the tank. His good buddy, Solomon (telescope veiltail), keeps going over to him, almost like he's checking on him.

Is there anybody on this group that has brought a fish back to health after having it act like this due to the nitrates being so high? I'm \trying to determine what to expect as far as time and behavior of recovery.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

I believe people who successfully treat their fish when they are not behaving normally are the ones who isolate the fish in a quarantine.

I still suggest moving him into a situation where he will have regular clean water and providing pics or video of any changes from his current behaviour as we are checking to make sure the fish doesn't end up with an infection from compromised health in the water conditions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Nothing wrong with that.... There was at least one other fish in the tank with Nitrates at 40 so the large change was needed anyway. Hopefully someone will chime in if there us something to bee done other than putting the fish in a QT tank and changing the water in it daily.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

OF,

Is it possible to do two tubs, so that you can move him over to a tub with fresh aged water daily? I think this is the best way to do 100% WCs, and when a fish is in severe distress, is probably the best tonic.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Two tubs works best if you set up both at the same time, put the fish in one tub, then gently transfer him the next day, and empty, rinse and refill the first tub right away. This assures that the water is as familiar as possible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

Two tubs works best if you set up both at the same time, put the fish in one tub, then gently transfer him the next day, and empty, rinse and refill the first tub right away. This assures that the water is as familiar as possible.

This is what I mean. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Regular Member

http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/Orandafish/media/shane_zps95159410.jpg.html

http://s1104.photobucket.com/user/Orandafish/media/20130802_112306_zps401d781e.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0

Shane is in tub one of the two-tub hospital set up. I added a air pump with an air stone to keep his water circulating. He is just resting on his side on the bottom. He is not gasping for breath but he is not trying to move either. He does not swim at all. If this works correctly, there SHOULD be two photos. One of him before he got sick and one of him in his hospital tub.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...