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Ugh! Bottom Sitting Today!


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  • Regular Member
  • Test Results for the Following:
    • * Ammonia Level(Tank) 0
    • * Nitrite Level(Tank) 0
    • * Nitrate level(Tank) 20ppm before today's water change
    • * Ammonia Level(Tap) 0
    • * Nitrite Level(Tap) 0
    • * Nitrate level(Tap) 0
    • * Ph Level, Tank (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 8.2 (yes, it's always been this high) I don't have a test for KH/GH but will get one
    • * Ph Level, Tap (If possible, KH, GH and chloramines) 8.2
    • Other Required Info:
      • * Brand of test-kit used and whether strips or drops? API drops
      • * Water temperature? 78
      • * Tank size (how many gals.) and how long has it been running? 30g - 6 months (fishless cycled before that)
      • * What is the name and "size of the filter"(s)? a marinland biowheel 200 with fluval sponge and media and a fluval AC 50
      • * How often do you change the water and how much? twice a week 50%
      • * How many days ago was the last water change and how much did you change? Yesterday - 50% and this morning 50%
      • * How many fish in the tank and their size? Just one (Francisco) 6" body ryukin
      • * What kind of water additives or conditioners? Just Prime
      • * What do you feed your fish and how often? 3 small meails daily. Mix of veggies (kale, chard, broccoli, but mostly peas), pellets (just switched to Pro-Gold), and few days ago I gave him frozen bloodworms (he has had this before but not for several weeks)
      • * Any new fish added to the tank? No
      • * Any medications added to the tank? No
      • * List entire medication/treatment history for fish and tank. Please include salt, Prazi, PP, etc and the approximate time and duration of treatment. About 6 weeks ago I treated Franciso and Tom (who died two weeks ago) with Medi-Gold and then salt --- then I found out Tom had a tumor and meds wouldn't help. There hasn't been salt in the tank in about 3 weeks.
      • * Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? ​Absolutely nothing
      • * Any unusual behavior like staying at the bottom, not eating, etc.? Gulping last night and now sitting on the bottom today. :(

So yesterday I joined Kokos and showed off Francisco and thought "all is good with the world." Then, last night Francisco was surface gulping (did a regular water change of 50% yesterday morning - the wc before that was 4 days prior of 50%) -- which he has never done in the past. I wasn't sure what his deal was, but I wasn't concerned because he just had a water change. I woke up this morning to him bottom sitting. Really freaked me out as he has NEVER sat on the bottom before (not even to sleep). He acts like he can't get his belly off the bottom, swimming around the bottom looking for food with his belly on the sand. He does swim up a few times every 10 minutes or so, but he's really mostly on the bottom. I tested the water and was shocked to see 20ppm Nitrates (just did a 50% wc yesterday!) - so I did another 50% water change this morning. Still bottom sitting/swimming. Feed him nothing but peas today -- which he gobbled up within seconds. The only changes lately are that I started introducing Pro-Gold two days ago. Could this be it? I have never treated him for parasites - ever. Of course my mind is racing with "what ifs."

Ugh. I'm worried. :no:

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He seems slightly, only slightly, less attached to the bottom now. Here is a video.

<embed width="600" height="361" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowFullscreen="true" allowNetworking="all" wmode="transparent" src="http://static.photobucket.com/player.swf" flashvars="file=http%3A%2F%2Fvid1292.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb577%2FGoldyFran%2FCA7E46AC-D432-439E-A30F-26FD9C175230-2215-0000033906DC3B49_zps310e4ba2.mp4">

http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/GoldyFran/media/CA7E46AC-D432-439E-A30F-26FD9C175230-2215-0000033906DC3B49_zps310e4ba2.mp4.html

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His poop was very long yesterday (not totally unusual for him) and today he only has a couple very small (about 1/2" long?), thick green poops.

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Let's fast him a couple of days and see how he does, OK? :D

Let us know if anything changes--more/less bottom sitting, any other symptoms . . .

And since you've never treated for flukes, you may want to see if you can locate some PraziPro and salt (aquarium or Morton's canning and pickling salt).

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I saw that Francisco was the one being discussed and thought, "I don't remember seeing there was anything going on with him in the intro!" Then I saw the last bit you wrote here :(

I swear, jinxing does happen in the Goldie world

I hope fasting is all it takes to get him back up. Hang in there, and good luck!

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I really hope he feels better soon! You are in good hands here! I know nothing about diagnosing but someone told me this and it helped "Don't Panick!" and follow the advise you get here you are in good hands.

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Thanks everyone! I think I totally cursed him - he's been the picture of health. <sigh>

I just tested his nitrates again - twice - and they are 0 both times. How does this happen? They were 20ppm before his 50% wc - shouldn't it be 10ppm now? Maybe the 20ppm was a mistake this morning? And I panicked and did another 50% wc for nothing? Hmm...

E96054CF-34C2-4A87-ADF5-8A481505EF75-221

Okay - I will fast him. This is not going to be easy ... he is totally going to give me a huge guilt trip. THREE DAYS?! Yikes! :o Okay.... gonna stay strong (and try not to look him in the eye :lol3 ).

I'll order the PraziPro also --- can I use general cure? I think that's available locally (I have paid sooooo much shipping lately in fish related stuff!). If PraziPro is better I will do that.

Thanks everyone! This place is really great.

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Let's fast for 2 days and let us know how his behavior is. :D (I hate fasting them too :rofl )

Check out PraziPro on our sponsors website:

http://tastyworms.com/aquarium-solutions-prazipro.html

They offer flat rate shipping for $4.99 so toss in some Repashy too. :rofl Or if you have a locally owned pet store, they may have it. It's also available on amazon. :idont I would suggest the 4 oz size.

General Cure has prazi and metronidazole. It's best not to treat with metro unless it's needed for bacterial/internal parasite infections.

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Hello,

I hate to be a bearer of bad news, but from the video, it looks like Francisco may be on his way to becoming a sinker, where is swim bladder completely malfunctions. You can see that he tries really hard to get to the top, to gulp air etc., but he eventually sinks down. He doesn't otherwise exhibit any sort of behaviors of a sick fish with an internal infection (lethargy, hiding, refusing food, etc.).

The thing that jumped to mind was the Medi-Gold. How long was he on it? How much did you feed? Medi-Gold can be too strong for a fish sometimes.

Do you have Metro-Meds on hand?

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Fantailfan1 -- you have an excellent handle on my condition already... how did you know I could find several other products to buy with flat rate shipping?! :no:

Dnalex -- I hope very much you are wrong. :( Would it start just overnight like that?? And the almost no pooping all day? He does seem to be spending less time on the bottom as the day goes on.

He was on Medi-Gold for 14 days (was the suggestion of an experienced goldfisher on another forum) with his tankmate -- I fed him his normal amount (no other food except peas). I ordered Metro-Meds today -- just to have around. Awww... I really hope I didn't hurt him. :unsure:

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Let's observe him for the next couple of days. Lisa's suggestions are excellent, and we will know more in a day or two.

I hope that I am wrong, as well. :)

______________________

Sudden onset bottom sitting can and does occur. Most typically, this is from overfeeding and constipation. However, in those cases, the fish won't be much interested in food.

Edited by dnalex
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Ok. <inhale, exhale> I shall not panic. :doh11:

He gobbled up the peas today and looked at me like "I'm starving! Give me fooooood!" Everytime someone walks near him (he's in the kids' playroom, so its a busy place) he rushes over and looks for incoming edibles. But, I have never seen him turn down food -- ever. I just hope he doesn't start munching on the java fern (he has done this before) during his fasting.

Hopeful the fasting is a religious experience for us all -- in the healing sense. :I-Thank-You:

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Short Update:

I survived 24 hours of Francisco fasting. Another 24 hours to go. He's been trying to nibble the java ferns and sucking on the filter intakes... I'd say he's hungry and probably annoyed that I keep coming and watching him without dropping anything in.

He is still bottom sitting - but not as much as he was that first day. He seems to struggle less to get to the surface and doesn't sink right down --- but he is probably spending 40% of his time sitting on the bottom.

He has not pooped -- I am assuming this is to be expected (but did he ever poop out all those peas from yesterday???).

Hoping tomorrow he's up more.

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This morning, I thought, he was bottom sitting a lot more than yesterday. Maybe he was just hunkering down to conserve energy given the recent famine. Around 3pm - there was a small green poop in the tank. This evening he is quite active and seems to swim around much easier. Doing A LOT of java fern munching. :whistle

Here is a video from earlier today. (Sorry about the background noise - toddler son and two pugs in the room.) Most of the video is him surface gulping which I think is actually more food begging than actual gulping. He seems to be doing this when I approach his tank - but not when the kids do (he knows small humans and pugs look, but don't feed). http://s1292.photobucket.com/user/GoldyFran/media/B88DA497-9A3D-44B7-B5E4-F18D503544A8-3931-0000043D2A761CE6_zpsb371f013.mp4.html

What do you think? Can he eat tomorrow morning? If so, what should he have?

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