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Goldies & Ryukin need your help please!


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First, thank you so much for approving my account so quickly. I'm a member of a forum on Axolotls and I'm not sure they'd know enough to help with Goldies (no offense to members of that site I just think salamanders etc are their forte).

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I’m just going to go on record right now and say I hate PetSmart. They have their niche (supplying pet products) but it will be a loooonnnggg time before I buy a pet from them again. My fish were perfectly fine before this.

Test Results for the Following:

- Ammonia Level (tank/tap): 0 (0.25 after adding last round of salt mix for salt bath at 1tsp/gallon) / 0.25

- Nitrite Level (tank/tap): 0 / 0

- Nitrate level (Tank/tap): 20-40 / 0

- Ph, KH & GH (Tank/tap) 8.2, 16 "drops", 19 "drops" (I list "drops" because the chart doesn't go that high) / same as tank

**tap readings vary when pipes are flushed by the city

Other Required Info:

- Brand of test-kit & strips or drops? API, drops

- Name and "size of the filter"(s)? Aqueon QuietFlow 20

- Water additives or conditioners? API Stress Coat

- Water temp? 69.6 (ranges from 68-71 throughout the year)

- How often change water & how much? 25%. Not as much as I should have. Every other week most likely.

- Last water change and amount? Yesterday then again today to remove some waste. 25% yesterday, 20% today

- Tank size (in gals.) and how long has it been running? 20L, 2 years (fully cycled before fish added)

- How many fish & their size? 5 total. 2 adult comets, 1 calico ryukin and 2 smaller comets. I’m not good with inches. All are less than 3” my husband says

- What do you feed your fish and how often? Every other day

- Any new fish? Yes. See more info below.

- Medications? Salt per “How to Use Salt” thread

- Previous issues? none

- Any unusual findings on the fish such as "grains of salt," bloody streaks, frayed fins or fungus? White eldest is covered in white spots, today I noticed Orange one is as well. The ends of orange and white eldest tails are frayed as well. Eldest white one has red streaks in his tail, others I can’t see any streaks. Littlest comet (Spot) might have a frayed tail but it’s always looked like that. Fricken Petsmart…

- Unusual behavior? White eldest is bottom sitting, Orange one started to but is much better since I started the salt bath

- Medication/treatment history for fish and tank. None except recent need for salt

I had noticed white one bottom sitting a couple of days ago. I did not see any spots (though I didn’t really look or know to look at the time). I bought a new fish (calico ryukin) yesterday and put him in my tank. Later that day, while watching them to make sure they were getting along, I noticed spots on white one. I panicked and started Googling which brought me to the opinion it was/is “Ich” and treatment of salt (i should add I live in remote Iowa, I can't just run out to the LFS without an hours drive into town so the salt bath was the easiest thing to at least try without doing more damage. I can go to the LFS tomorrow on the way home from work if you think I need something else).

To back-track, I initially started with 4 goldfish back in late 2011. I thought they died because of the extreme hardness of the water where I live. My 2 goldies (white one and orange one) were the “survivors” for almost a year. They are actually called White shark and Orange shark because they grew big FAST and next to the new little ones they look enormous. I know, we're odd.

Last week my husband bought me 5 new ones (feeder goldfish from Petsmart) and I didn’t even think to check them out for disease. 3 days ago I noticed that 2 of them had died, later that day a 3rd had died. 2 of them are surviving and today after work I noticed small white one appears to have spots on his tail (I swear he didn't yesterday).

Last night around 4.30pm, after much research, I added my first round of salt to my tank (0.1%.) This morning before work I added my second. Today when I got home I added the 3rd (then I did a 20% change to collect any waste remembering to add a salt to the bucket before adding to the tank to keep my concentration at 0.3%).

The others already don’t appear as lethargic, even large white one is starting to be more active, however I’ve now noticed that orange one has spots (not as bad as white one) and their tails are slightly frayed at the ends (I didn’t see it yesterday while taking photos so it’s much worse today).

I bought a heater for my tank today to raise the temp to treat the Ich. I just turned it up a degree. I’m not sure how quickly I should turn it up (or if I'm wrong and it's not Ich if i should just take it out).

Qns:

  1. Based on the attached photos, do you concur with my attempted diagnosis of Ich?
  2. Is it possible the fraying is causing by the other fish nibbling at the Ich?
  3. Should I treat for Fin Rot?
  4. If yes to #3, should I wait until I’m done with the salt (I’m thinking “duh, no”)
  5. Should I raise the temp, and if so how quickly?

559845_10152733314115608_1894609231_n.jpg

Image 1: Orange one - frayed tail April 8, 2013

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Image 2: Orange one - white dots April 8, 2013

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Image 3: Eldest White One - frayed tail April 8, 2013

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Image 4: Eldest White One - white dots - 8 April 2013

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Image 5: Small white one dots on tail - 8 April 2013

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Image 6: Ryukin (Sushi) looks fine - 8 April 2013

Note: Taking photos of the little white dots on a white fish is really hard!

Thank you in advance for your help! I will work on my profile now :)

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Hello, I'm sorry you're having issues. Hopefully we can help. :)

First, some general comments:

- no matter where you get fish, they need to be QT'd before adding to the main tank. Outbreaks can happen even with the best of sellers, so instead of relying on them fully to be vigilant about this, you must as well.

- you said your tank is a 20L - am I correct in assuming that this a 20 gallon long tank, as opposed to a 20 liter tank?

- thank you for answering all the questions :)

Qns:

  1. Based on the attached photos, do you concur with my attempted diagnosis of Ich? I do concur.
  2. Is it possible the fraying is causing by the other fish nibbling at the Ich? It's possible, but ich and subsequent secondary issues are enough to see the fin fraying.
  3. Should I treat for Fin Rot? No. Let's just stick with salt right now.
  4. If yes to #3, should I wait until I’m done with the salt (I’m thinking “duh, no”) Salt alone should be sufficient.
  5. Should I raise the temp, and if so how quickly? Yes, bring it to 78 and leave it there for the duration of treatment, please.

Where are you at in the salting process? How much salt have you added?

Are you able to do water changes daily (about 50%)?

I'll have more to say once you've answered these questions. :)

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- no matter where you get fish, they need to be QT'd before adding to the main tank. Outbreaks can happen even with the best of sellers, so instead of relying on them fully to be vigilant about this, you must as well. Yeah i've since found that out :S (hoping my fish don't pay the price for my idiocy) but thank you for the reminder :) I'm not planning on any new fish for some time (until I get a bigger tank in the next couple of months hopefully) at that point I will most DEFINITELY do that!

- you said your tank is a 20L - am I correct in assuming that this a 20 gallon long tank, as opposed to a 20 liter tank? Sorry yep, 20gals long

- thank you for answering all the questions :)Thank YOU for answering!

- Where are you at in the salting process? How much salt have you added? I followed the "adding salt" thread and added 1tsp per gallon (20tsp for my tank each "lot") at 4.30pm, then 6am, then 5pm. Not exactly 12 hours but with work it was the best I could do. So I'm done (0.3% concentration)

- Are you able to do water changes daily (about 50%)? If that's what I need to do, I can certainly give it a shot. I have a 5gal bucket so that's only 2 of those

Edited by Sykadelic
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OK, great. :)

For the first week, I'd like for you to do 50% WCs daily. This will drastically reduce the number of the infectious ich in the water, helping the process along quite nicely. Make sure that each time you do a WC, to replace the amount of salt you took out. In the case of 50% WCs, that would be 30 level teaspoons.

What salt are you using? If you are using Morton's Canning and Pickling, reduce everything to 75% of the normal numbers, to account for the finer grains in the pickling salt.

The fish will need to stay in the salt for at least one week until the very last of the ich spots have disappeared. So the process, my take 2-3 weeks.

There is one other thing. With ich, it is almost a certainty that it will get worse before it gets better. So, don't panic. Hang in there. :)

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For the first week, I'd like for you to do 50% WCs daily. This will drastically reduce the number of the infectious ich in the water, helping the process along quite nicely. Make sure that each time you do a WC, to replace the amount of salt you took out. In the case of 50% WCs, that would be 30 level teaspoons. To explain the math (to myself and to make sure I'm right), the reason it's 30tsp is because there's actually 60tsp in a 20gal tank right now (60:20 or 6:2 or 3:1). That means if I remove 10gals and replace 10gals that 10x3tsp = 30:10 (3:1). Okay. Makes sense :)

What salt are you using? If you are using Morton's Canning and Pickling, reduce everything to 75% of the normal numbers, to account for the finer grains in the pickling salt. I'm using the only salt I could find (on a Sunday near the end of the afternoon) which is Sea Salt. I confirmed there was none of the bad stuff the salting thread mentioned, it's from Italy. Takes FOREVER to dissolve :S Hope that's okay!

The fish will need to stay in the salt for at least one week until the very last of the ich spots have disappeared. So the process, my take 2-3 weeks. That's fine. They're already looking/acting much better. I feel better knowing you agree with what I thought it was so i haven't totally screwed them up. Qn, I'm allowed to feed them right?

There is one other thing. With ich, it is almost a certainty that it will get worse before it gets better. So, don't panic. Hang in there. :)Thank you!

I'm thinking to expedite the process I could make little water bottles full of 15tsp (because I do 5gal buckets at a time). That way I could just tip the bottle into the pre-treated bucket water and pour it in, rather than spending 1/2 hour waiting for the salt to dissolve and I could just refil the bottle with the "solution" once I've used them... then i can just shake to dissolve instead of all the stirring that takes forever :P

New qn! I'm going to remove the gravel/sand stuff at the bottom of my tank, slowly, with each 50% change. That should be fine right? Then once everyone's all good I have some new plants (fake) and a cling backing and I'm thinking of putting new sand/gravel in the tank. is there any preference to sand/little rock things? I think I read the little rocks they can choke on...

Edited by Sykadelic
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You most definitely can feed them, if they are eating. :)

The other way of dissolving the salt is to put it in a nylon hose or pantyhose and hang it in the tank. It will take a couple of hours to dissolve, but that is fine.

You can also pre-dissolve as you had planned. :)

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Update:

About 10 mins ago I noticed Spot was finally out and swimming around. He's the smallest goldfish (no idea what kind), probably about an inch from tip to his little frazzled tail ( just looked at pics I took yesterday with him in them and he had more of a tail yesterday). Turns out he wasn't actually swimming around, he is/was dead and near the filter and was being blown around by the filter. When he got moved to an area with less of a current the other fish were nipping at him (though he was already dead thankfully).

So 4 remaining. Really hoping that because the others are bigger they'll have more of a chance. I wonder if he was being picked on or something becaues he never really spent time with the others and usually hid. Poor little dude :( RIP Spot

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I'm so sorry about that. :( RIP Spot.

Keep us updated daily at least please. I know that it's really tough to watch them like this, and thinking there must be some other (quicker) way of helping them. I guarantee you there isn't, so just hang in there, OK? :hug

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Update 6:30am - Got up this morning for work and all four are still alive. As predicted the spots are worse but they do seem more lively. White one has an appetite still which is great (he didn't before I started the salt). He's still bottom sitting occasionally but not as much as he used to, orange one isn't so much anymore, little white one is doing fine. No tails appear to have worsened.

The temp of my tank is now 76.8F. I have an 100W Aqueon submersible heater (up to 40gals) and it says "accurate to 1 degree" but so far I disagree with that statement because it's on 80 but my digital thermometer says 76.8. Is it not raising more because it's 70F in my house? I don't want my fish to boil while i'm at work so i'll just leave it there. Is that enough?

Pics from this morning:

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Image 1: Small white one

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Image 2: Orange one. His spots are worse but he's acting fine & hungry

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Image 3: Orange one, Sushi & Eldest white one. No spots on Sushi, the others have spots but their tails don't appear to have worsened

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Image 4: Eldest white one and Orange one together and spotty but searching for food!

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The temp is just fine where it is. Unless we have plans to raise it to mid-80s, a couple of degrees in this range won't make a difference.

I'm glad they are doing better. Hang in there!

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Update 4pm - All still living. I did a 50% change and I have to admit it was exhausting PLUS I'm a little worried about the temperature drop when I add so much new water so some questions:

1. Can I do a 25% change in the morning before work (6-7am) and another 25% change after work (4-5pm)? That should keep the levels down I think (and the bucket of water should warm up to room temp - see #2)

2. How bad is a "bad" temperature drop? I left the bucket in the living room this morning and when I added it it dropped 10 degrees. It's slowly going back up. Should I add it more slowly? Should I I add a little bit of warmer water and test the temperature before adding it?

3. Should I do chem tests before the changes and after? I did today and it was pretty much as expected (ammonia spike 0.25-0.5 (from the salt I read), no nitrites, 20-40 nitrates, pH unchanged).

4. I thinking about changing my sand stuff. Which is the best kind of substrate? (I was initially thinking a, but now i'm thinking for ease of cleaning c)

a. fine sand - http://www.aquariuml.../imagessand.jpg

b. beach sand stuff (this is what I have now) - http://1.bp.blogspot.../s1600/sand.jpg

c. small rocks - http://www.majedkhal...-A-Fishtank.jpg

d. big rocks - http://image.made-in...l/Fish-Tank.jpg

Edited by Sykadelic
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Hi there! your fish are beautiful! I'm so sorry you lost one :(

Update 4pm - All still living. I did a 50% change and I have to admit it was exhausting PLUS I'm a little worried about the temperature drop when I add so much new water so some questions:

1. Can I do a 25% change in the morning before work (6-7am) and another 25% change after work (4-5pm)? That should keep the levels down I think (and the bucket of water should warm up to room temp - see #2)

2. How bad is a "bad" temperature drop? I left the bucket in the living room this morning and when I added it it dropped 10 degrees. It's slowly going back up. Should I add it more slowly? Should I I add a little bit of warmer water and test the temperature before adding it? You want to keep the temp within 2-3 degrees when changing your water. Are you unable to control the temperature of the water at your tap? Do you have a second bucket that you could leave out overnight to bring to room temp if you are unable to control temp at tap. If neither of these are possible it would be better to do two smaller water changes a day to avoid the drastic temp change. Two 25% changes are not equal to one 50% change though. I think the single 50% change would be more ideal if you are able to get the temp thing figured out, if not go with the two smaller changes.

3. Should I do chem tests before the changes and after? I did today and it was pretty much as expected (ammonia spike 0.25-0.5 (from the salt I read), no nitrites, 20-40 nitrates, pH unchanged). Testing prior to the water change can give you a good idea of how much water you need to change to keep things safe. For example, if you have 40ppm nitrates before a water change, you know a 50% water change will drop this to 20ppm. I would pick up some seachem prime water conditioner if you are able and begin using this in place of the stress coat. Prime is a great water conditioner, particularly when you have a cycle bump as it will detox ammonia and nitrites for a period of 24-48 hours.

4. I thinking about changing my sand stuff. Which is the best kind of substrate? (I was initially thinking a, but now i'm thinking for ease of cleaning c)

a. fine sand - http://www.aquariuml.../imagessand.jpg

b. beach sand stuff (this is what I have now) - http://1.bp.blogspot.../s1600/sand.jpg

c. small rocks - http://www.majedkhal...-A-Fishtank.jpg

d. big rocks - http://image.made-in...l/Fish-Tank.jpg

Either of the sands would be fine. Small rocks can be ok depending on their size and the size of your fish. You want substrate that is either small enough to very easily be spit out by your goldfish or large enough that there is no chance of it fitting in their mouth (and you'd be surprised what they can fit in their mouth). I personally wouldn't go with (d) unless you only did a very thin layer because larger rocks that are layered have more chance of debris falling between the cracks and creating issues in your tank.

In general, your substrate should be no more than 1/4-1/2 an inch deep.

A bare bottom tank is another possibility you might consider ;)

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^ just a thought to add to the above

Because you are overstocked, going bare bottom (no substrate) would actually be the best choice right now, since this will increase your water volume :)

I don't think this has been touched on in your thread yet because the focus right now is really getting your fish healthy at this point, but once things settle down you will want to start thinking about either upgrading your tank, adding a second tank to the house, or rehoming some fish. Goldfish need 15-20 gallons per fish ultimately because they grow to be quite large and are big waste producers. Please know that you are in good company here, most of us on the forum (including myself) came here quite overstocked :)

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Hi there! your fish are beautiful! I'm so sorry you lost one :(Thank you! Most people are very "it's just a fish" (my husband included) but it still hurts to lose one, especially because you feel like you failed :( I'm thinking if they survive this (WHEN!) I'll have to rename my "big ones". I was thinking Hercules and Goliath :P Still need a name for little white one...

1. Can I do a 25% change in the morning before work (6-7am) and another 25% change after work (4-5pm)? That should keep the levels down I think (and the bucket of water should warm up to room temp - see #2)

2. How bad is a "bad" temperature drop? I left the bucket in the living room this morning and when I added it it dropped 10 degrees. It's slowly going back up. Should I add it more slowly? Should I I add a little bit of warmer water and test the temperature before adding it? You want to keep the temp within 2-3 degrees when changing your water. Are you unable to control the temperature of the water at your tap? Do you have a second bucket that you could leave out overnight to bring to room temp if you are unable to control temp at tap. If neither of these are possible it would be better to do two smaller water changes a day to avoid the drastic temp change. Two 25% changes are not equal to one 50% change though. I think the single 50% change would be more ideal if you are able to get the temp thing figured out, if not go with the two smaller changes. See below :)

3. Should I do chem tests before the changes and after? I did today and it was pretty much as expected (ammonia spike 0.25-0.5 (from the salt I read), no nitrites, 20-40 nitrates, pH unchanged). Testing prior to the water change can give you a good idea of how much water you need to change to keep things safe. For example, if you have 40ppm nitrates before a water change, you know a 50% water change will drop this to 20ppm. I would pick up some seachem prime water conditioner if you are able and begin using this in place of the stress coat. Prime is a great water conditioner, particularly when you have a cycle bump as it will detox ammonia and nitrites for a period of 24-48 hours. Will do! thanks for the advice!

4. I thinking about changing my sand stuff. Which is the best kind of substrate? (I was initially thinking a, but now i'm thinking for ease of cleaning c)

a. fine sand - http://www.aquariuml.../imagessand.jpg

b. beach sand stuff (this is what I have now) - http://1.bp.blogspot.../s1600/sand.jpg

c. small rocks - http://www.majedkhal...-A-Fishtank.jpg

d. big rocks - http://image.made-in...l/Fish-Tank.jpg

Either of the sands would be fine. Small rocks can be ok depending on their size and the size of your fish. You want substrate that is either small enough to very easily be spit out by your goldfish or large enough that there is no chance of it fitting in their mouth (and you'd be surprised what they can fit in their mouth). I personally wouldn't go with (d) unless you only did a very thin layer because larger rocks that are layered have more chance of debris falling between the cracks and creating issues in your tank.

In general, your substrate should be no more than 1/4-1/2 an inch deep. I just "borrowed" my small ruler from work so I'll double check but I think it's closer to an inch so I'll remove some over the changes

A bare bottom tank is another possibility you might consider ;) I have considered that actually. I don't mind the gravel stuff that I have it's just a LOT of brown things in my tank. Maybe once I add the new (fake) plants it will look better

So it's not confusing I put my answer to your comments about the temp change here :)

I actually filled the bucket this morning before work (up at 6am) and at 5pm so it had all day to get to room temp. I then had to do it straight from the tap when I did the change (5 gal bucket) but strangely, it was the "room temp" one that did the drastic drop. I can do warmer water from the tap no problem, I just wasn't sure if that was "allowed". I have a thermometer for testing baby baths that I could use. So for the next change I'll make it 75F so it's only a couple of degrees change (if that's what you think I should do).

I know the 2 x 25% isn't the same as 50% at once, but I had hoped that the frequency of the change would make up for it somehow (cleaning up waste more promptly etc). I only have the one bucket though and the temp thing was one of my biggest concerns (aside from how heavy a 5gal bucket is to lift over my head).. and how tiring it is to do after, excuse my french, a bloody long day at work!

Eldest white one (the most affected) is bottom sitting again. He swims around when I'm nearby, but he's still in a bad way. I took some more pics

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Image 1: Eldest white one looking very frayed

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Image 2: Eldest white one spotty still

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Image 3: Orange one, still spotty but tail looks better

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Image 4: Small white one looks good!

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Poor guys! :(

The best thing to do is match the temperature of the tap water straight out of the tap as close as you can to the tank temperature when you do your water changes. I typically just use a finger to go back and forth between the two to make sure they feel about the same, but a thermometer is even better if you have one :)

The other thing you might look into getting at some point if you happen to have some extra funds is a water changer. They are the best invention ever and probably the best thing I ever bought for my set up. You just hook it up directly to your tap so there are no buckets to carry. Not a necessity by any means, but nice to have http://www.petco.com/product/108265/Aqueon-Aquarium-Water-Changer.aspx?cm_mmc=CSEMGoogleAdExtProd-_-Fish-_-Aqueon-_-1217593&mr:trackingCode=52F5EB15-8381-DE11-B7F3-0019B9C043EB&mr:referralID=NA&mr:adType=pla&mr:ad=28820646835&mr:keyword=&mr:match=&mr:filter=51515436475

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It looks like from the picture you may have a hollow castle ornament? If so, you may want to consider removing this as well. Along with taking up valuable tank space/water volume, hollow ornaments can also trap stagnant water and be a breeding ground for bad bacteria. I don't mean to sound nit-picky :P just want to make sure we make the tank as healthy as we can, especially while your fish are fighting this.

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Poor guys! :(

The best thing to do is match the temperature of the tap water straight out of the tap as close as you can to the tank temperature when you do your water changes. I typically just use a finger to go back and forth between the two to make sure they feel about the same, but a thermometer is even better if you have one :)

The other thing you might look into getting at some point if you happen to have some extra funds is a water changer. They are the best invention ever and probably the best thing I ever bought for my set up. You just hook it up directly to your tap so there are no buckets to carry. Not a necessity by any means, but nice to have http://www.petco.com...ter=51515436475

We actually had a python back in 2009 when we were nursing a baby alligator back to health. We left it with the people that adopted him though... They're very handy! Especially as he was actually living in a pool, not a tank! Well technically he was living in our living room. He'd just wander around then hop in the water and eat in there too.

I didn't know you could add the water conditioner to the tank after (or while) adding the water to the tank so it never occurred to me that that would be safe (the water here is VERY chlorinated). I'll ask my husband about how many feet from our sink to the tank and maybe we can get that 25' one while its on sale. Thanks for the idea!

It looks like from the picture you may have a hollow castle ornament? If so, you may want to consider removing this as well. Along with taking up valuable tank space/water volume, hollow ornaments can also trap stagnant water and be a breeding ground for bad bacteria. I don't mean to sound nit-picky :P just want to make sure we make the tank as healthy as we can, especially while your fish are fighting this.

It's a colloseum :) Yeah I didn't know about the trapped stuff but it is sitting on part of my air line and bubbles blow out the top of it every couple of minutes or so... so I thought that might remove the stagnant water. Again one of those things I didn't know. I thought hiding stuff was good :S Don't worry about "nit-picking", you're helping, not being picky. Would it help if I take a vid of the bubbles and you tell me if that's enough or I'm just being stupid? Or do you not need a vid to tell me I'm being foolish?

Edited by Sykadelic
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Poor guys! :(

The best thing to do is match the temperature of the tap water straight out of the tap as close as you can to the tank temperature when you do your water changes. I typically just use a finger to go back and forth between the two to make sure they feel about the same, but a thermometer is even better if you have one :)

The other thing you might look into getting at some point if you happen to have some extra funds is a water changer. They are the best invention ever and probably the best thing I ever bought for my set up. You just hook it up directly to your tap so there are no buckets to carry. Not a necessity by any means, but nice to have http://www.petco.com...ter=51515436475

We actually had a python back in 2009 when we were nursing a baby alligator back to health. We left it with the people that adopted him though... They're very handy! Especially as he was actually living in a pool, not a tank! Well technically he was living in our living room. He'd just wander around then hop in the water and eat in there too.

I didn't know you could add the water conditioner to the tank after (or while) adding the water to the tank so it never occurred to me that that would be safe (the water here is VERY chlorinated). I'll ask my husband about how many feet from our sink to the tank and maybe we can get that 25' one while its on sale. Thanks for the idea!

It looks like from the picture you may have a hollow castle ornament? If so, you may want to consider removing this as well. Along with taking up valuable tank space/water volume, hollow ornaments can also trap stagnant water and be a breeding ground for bad bacteria. I don't mean to sound nit-picky :P just want to make sure we make the tank as healthy as we can, especially while your fish are fighting this.

It's a colloseum :) Yeah I didn't know about the trapped stuff but it is sitting on part of my air line and bubbles blow out the top of it every couple of minutes or so... so I thought that might remove the stagnant water. Again one of those things I didn't know. I thought hiding stuff was good :S Don't worry about "nit-picking", you're helping, not being picky. Would it help if I take a vid of the bubbles and you tell me if that's enough or I'm just being stupid? Or do you not need a vid to tell me I'm being foolish?

An alligator! wow! :P

Yeah, with the water changer you just add enough water conditioner to dose the full tank volume right before you begin filling it up :)

If you have a bubbler running in it and the bubbles are well distributed through the whole ornament that should be fine. I would still take it out though in order to increase the water volume in your tank until you are able to upgrade etc. Goldfish also generally do not need hidey ornaments. They are generally very social fish and typically only spend time hiding when something is wrong. So, ornaments are really more for aesthetics with goldfish rather than necessity.

Just fyi, most petcos are having their dollar per gallon sale right now, so it is a great time to upgrade if you have a petco nearby. You can get a 55 gallon for 55 dollars :)

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Just fyi, most petcos are having their dollar per gallon sale right now, so it is a great time to upgrade if you have a petco nearby. You can get a 55 gallon for 55 dollars :)

Oooohhhh I hate you right now! How can I pass up the $1 per gallon sale? I was JUST talking to my husband about it, seriously, I told him that when the sale comes around I wanted to upgrade... grrr. I just paid a LOT of money for immigration stuff just last week, and now with sick fish (bought the heater and other stuff I "needed")... /sigh.

Okok. I'll start with the new tank and get the rest slowly (stand first, then filter) then start the cycle. At least having a pre-cycled tank and some fishy water to speed up the process will help!

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Just fyi, most petcos are having their dollar per gallon sale right now, so it is a great time to upgrade if you have a petco nearby. You can get a 55 gallon for 55 dollars :)

Oooohhhh I hate you right now! How can I pass up the $1 per gallon sale? I was JUST talking to my husband about it, seriously, I told him that when the sale comes around I wanted to upgrade... grrr. I just paid a LOT of money for immigration stuff just last week, and now with sick fish (bought the heater and other stuff I "needed")... /sigh.

Okok. I'll start with the new tank and get the rest slowly (stand first, then filter) then start the cycle. At least having a pre-cycled tank and some fishy water to speed up the process will help!

lol, sorry! ;) It's possible your petco won't be having it right now, some stores seem to be on a bit of a different schedule than the national average. Let us know if you get one! The 55 gallon would be great for your 4 :)

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Happy Update: 5:30pm. Today is day 2 of the 50% change, Day 3 of the salt treatment.

Got home from work today and was very pleased to see this:

561457_10152739789405608_1543404436_n.jpg

Image 1: Orange one fins unclamped!! He was unclamped in the beggining (Sun/Mon) but was clamped yesterday as he got worse. Better today :)

5457_10152739789385608_2089009620_n.jpg

Image 2: Eldest white one unclamped!! He was/is the worst of the two. He's been clamped since I first noticed this so he's looking MUCH better :D

So proud of my little dudes :) They have an appetite (my Ryukin is a pig and likes to nibble on my fingers :P) and they all seem pretty happy swimming around

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Update 6pm: Day 3 of 50% change & Day 4 of salt treatment

Fins all still unclamped. Noticed a few grains of sand on Sushi (I'm talking maybe 4 or 5 total) but he's not clamping and he's eating fine. Eldest white one still looks raggety but he doesn't appear to have any spots anymore which is great :) Orange one still has some on his tail. Both tails (white and orange) do not appear to be rotting (one of my previous concerns was Ich AND Fin Rot). Small white one is fine :)

I did a chem test again to see how things are and they're a little "off" from normal

Previous Normal:

pH: 8.2

Ammonia: 0

Nitrites: 0

Nitrates: 20-40

Temp: 68-71

Now:

pH: 8.0

Ammonia: 0.5

Nitrites: 0

Nitrates: 10-20

Temp: 78.6

I have some other general tank questions but I'll post them in another area :)

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Just fyi, most petcos are having their dollar per gallon sale right now, so it is a great time to upgrade if you have a petco nearby. You can get a 55 gallon for 55 dollars :)

Oooohhhh I hate you right now! How can I pass up the $1 per gallon sale? I was JUST talking to my husband about it, seriously, I told him that when the sale comes around I wanted to upgrade... grrr. I just paid a LOT of money for immigration stuff just last week, and now with sick fish (bought the heater and other stuff I "needed")... /sigh.

Okok. I'll start with the new tank and get the rest slowly (stand first, then filter) then start the cycle. At least having a pre-cycled tank and some fishy water to speed up the process will help!

lol, sorry! ;) It's possible your petco won't be having it right now, some stores seem to be on a bit of a different schedule than the national average. Let us know if you get one! The 55 gallon would be great for your 4 :)

Well it turns out they WERE having a sale but I talked to my husband about it and we've decided to get a tank/stand combo and re-arrange the living room to put one in the corner. I'm going to do a little research before we invest (likely to be quite expensive) so expect many questions!

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