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StarSapphire22

Pearlscale injury...opinions appreciated!

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Hi all! Other than my introduction post, this is my first post here. I was directed here by a member of another forum I use, since there's not much for goldie lovers on there. Hopefully you guys can answer my questions!!! I'll just copy and paste it here, with some updates from today. :)

I just got 2 new fish from raingarden yesterday (birthday presents, yay!), one of whom is a pearlscale (the other is a ranchu, but he's doing just fine).

I got them in the mail yesterday morning, had enough time to acclimate them and monitor them for a little bit before I had to go to work. I came home last night, and the pearlscale had this:

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=199072&d=1342847830&thumb=1

It looks like 2 of his scales are pineconing almost, or got pulled up somehow and there's a red ring around it, maybe some minor bruising? He didn't have it when he got here, so he must have gotten stuck somewhere (he is VERY fat and clumsy) and hurt himself trying to free himself from wherever he was. I have melafix, but I'm not sure if I can/should put it in the tank. I have an aquatech 5-15 filter that I am reseeding for my ten gallon and it has carbon in it...can I run it with just the floss-y part? And will I lose much bb in it if I take out the carbon insert? I also added safestart today...will that cause any bad reactions or anything? And can I add it with my AC70&110 having purigen in them? Or am I just being an overprotective fish mommy and should I just let it heal on its own? He seems to be breathing a little heavy, but has been from being introduced to my tank yesterday morning, and I think he's just stressed as all my other fish seem just fine and my tank is super oxygenated, though he seems to be getting a little better about breathing today. It doesn't seem to be negatively impacting him, it just looks painful and angry...he's swimming around and having a blast exploring his new home and trying his darndest to get stuck in everything he can.

I wish I knew what he hurt himself on so I could take it out...but I have no idea, nothing is particularly rough or has super sharp edges or anything that I can tell...it must have wiggled really hard somewhere. If he so much as TOUCHES a plant, he automatically thinks hes stuck and freezes. I have to keep pulling him out of everything, even if he's not REALLY stuck. I tried to let him figure it out by himself and he stayed in exactly the same place for four hours. I want to make this tank a safe home for him and I took out one decoration I knew would be a pearlscale trap, but my other fish love to swim through all the holes and nooks and crannies, so I'd feel bad just having sand and plastic plants for decor. Even the pearlscale likes to hang out in the cave. I'm worried about him getting stuck in smaller spaces though, and getting more scrapes like this, though he seems to be figuring out where he can and can't go and is maneuvering much better today.

Here's a picture of my tank. I tried to create more space between decor and walls than before but.....I don't know if I did a good enough job. You can see the pearlscale hanging out in the cave on the left, and my new ranchu is next to him. Not sure where my moor and comet are in this pic...hiding somewhere.

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=199073&d=1342849129&thumb=1

So my questions are:

1) Should I add the melafix?

2) Is there anything else I can do for him?

3) Any decorating tips?

4) Any other general pearlscale tips? He's a regular pingpong, not a crown, but especially fat and rolypoly.

Here is some updated photos from today. The red seems like it might be spreading, but I am not sure.

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=199158&d=1342914234&thumb=1

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=199159&d=1342914278&thumb=1

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=199160&d=1342914298&thumb=1

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=199161&d=1342914338&thumb=1

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=199162&d=1342914380&thumb=1

Thanks everyone!!!

Edited by StarSapphire22

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what a beautiful pearlie :heart thank you for providing pics :)

i don't think we need the melafix as it's not an open wound. i would think more some salt minimize possible bacteria that may present from that surface blood. also, the fact that there appears to be some bruising, to me, indicates it could have been a bang more than a scrape. but that's just my opinion. lets wait till others chime in :)

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that is a beautiful tank Star,

I have learned with goldies, LESS is more.............they ARE clumsy as you stated. I do not have advice about the red mark, but I am sure others will help you soon !!

welcome to the forum and good luck with the raingarden fish..............absolutely beautiful.................. :clapping:

Deb

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Would you please post your tank parameters? I will answer all your questions a little later (when I get home), but I want to ascertain that you are wanting to treat him in QT?

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Thank you all for the compliments! His name is Bowser. He is pretty adorable, and an absolute character to watch. I am thinking of switching decor possibly, at the very least I will probably take out the grey formation on the right side of the tank...it's a diatom magnet anyways. Any tips on things that are goldie (and more specifically the pearlscale, lol) safe?

Do you think he will lose the scale, if it's just a bump? It looks almost like the pearls are squished, rather than torn, scraped, etc. though the worst one may be ripped up a little. It's hard to get him to stay still to look at it and I'm trying to touch him as little as possible for his slimecoat's sake.

My tank parameters are pH 7.4, ammonia 0, nitrite 0, and nitrates 40 (my cat unplugged a filter 2 weeks ago while we were away for the weekend, so I've been slowly working on getting them down...still a little on the high side though). The water itself is pretty clean though...just a couple flakes of gel food floating around from todays attempt at feeding (they aren't hungry yet) and a few cat hairs I can't get out to save my life. A water change was done thursday. I unfortunately don't have a qt available, so he will have to stay in this tank.

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Lol. The only things goldy safe in my mind are live and silk plants. Goldfish are quite clumsy lol.

Let's help the healing along with some aquarium salt, or any sodium chloride without additives. The concentration I would like to aim for is 0.2%, which is 1 level teaspoon salt per gallon water, dissolved before adding to the tank. We increase salt by 0.1% at a time, every 12 hours.

I would go ahead and do another big WC to get more nitrates out, and then start salting.

Fins crosses for rapid healing!

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I just noticed he also has a small tear in his tail...also edged in red. It's white and doesn't go clear through the edge, it's more of a small slit. I couldn't get pictures, but you can kindof see it in the last two pictures above.

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I just noticed he also has a small tear in his tail...also edged in red. It's white and doesn't go clear through the edge, it's more of a small slit. I couldn't get pictures, but you can kindof see it in the last two pictures above.

I saw that but good new the salt will also help with that aswell, by the way your goldies are super duper cute :wub: and Welcome to Koko's :welcome

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The biggest bucket I have is 1.5 gallons...I can't lift more than that due to an old injury in my left hand (python water changer to the rescue! haha)...I'm not sure salt is a feasible option for me. Would the melafix not work??

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Haha. I just realized you have the other types of fish in the tank, which does complicate treatment plans with the salt.

I would at the very least do a mild salt dip (1.5%, 5 minutes) on the pearlscale.

Melafix is worth using; I just think salt is better. I do understand the situation, though.

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So how exactly do I do a salt dip? Can I fill up my bucket with Primed water and add salt, and then let him hang out for a few minutes?

And can I add melafix to the tank even with the fish that aren't hurt? I know I need to take out the carbon in my 10 gallon filter, but what about the purigen in my aquaclears?

Should I do one or the other, or can I do both?

I'm also worried that it will stress him out...he's had a hectic week lol. I'd like to do the least stressful option for him.

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You can do both! :)

Yes, fill a bucket with water, dissolve salt into it, and make sure the temp matches that with the main tank. 1.5% is 15 level teaspoons per gallon. I am certain he will be fine for 5 minutes, but if he starts to tip over, remove him, and put him back in the tank. Also, add a single dose Prime to the tank.

When using Melafix, make sure your tank is very well aerated, since the oil may reduce the amount of dissolved oxygen. Carbon needs to be removed. I don't think Purigen needs to be. :)

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Ok, so my plan of attack is this:

20% water change tonight, make sure the waters all clean, and all the food and poop is gone.

Salt dip in the bucket for bowser (tank water, or new water with prime?...Kinda hard to dose prime for 1.5 gallons.....it needs like...1 drop. I did a water change Thursday so the water isn't that dirty, if I use tank water.)

Add melafix to the tank (did some digging, Seachem wasn't sure about melafix being taken out of the water by Purigen, but recommended taking it out just in case so that's what I'll do. My tank has 3 HOB filters--an AC110, AC70, and an Aquatech 5-15--and 2 sponge filters running right now, so I have lots of aeration!)

My tap has high chloramines, so it reads at 1.00 for ammonia...so I normally do a double dose of Prime. Will this be ok with the melafix?

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Sounds great!

The fish is to stay in the dip for no more than 5 minutes, and removed if she/he cannot control balance and tips over without being able to get back up.

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With tank water, or new water??

Either is fine, assuming that you do not have ammonia or nitrite in whichever source you are using. If you are using new (tap) water, make sure to add de-chlorinator.

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Wonderful. Thank you so much!!! :)

Though, I just realized...it's 2 AM here....gonna have to wait until morning. EEP, it's past my bedtime!

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OK! Did the water change, and the salt dip. Salt dip was done at 1.5% for about 2 minutes...he was a little topsy turvy from the get go, and Alex, you said to watch out for that, so I thought 5 minutes would be pushing it. He doesn't seem to be negatively impacted by it, so I think he's ok...he's just been trying to get to a corner of a tank that's covered by a plant for the last 15 minutes. :tomuch:

As far as medicating, I have melafix, and I also have API Stresscoat (http://www.apifishcare.com/Products/Product.aspx?ProductID=43) that I found in my tank stand, both say they repair torn fins and damaged tissue. which should I use??? Or should I use both?

I rearranged the tank too! Pictures soon, I promise!

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Use one, but not both :)

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I've never used StressCoat, but have used Melafix many times. However, I've heard from several members who have used StressCoat with good results. So, either is fine, I think, and it's just a matter of personal preference.

The reason I suggested not using both is because together they may really make it hard on the gills, with Melafix potentially lowering dissolved oxygen and StressCoat coating gills. Make sure you have ample aeration, either way :)

How is the spot looking today?

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Same as yesterday....Angry. The white parts seem whiter though. The red hasn't seemed to have spread much more.

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Do you have any triple antibiotic ointment? This stuff is actually pretty good for external injuries. I normally don't use it because I favor using salt, but for floaty fish with dried out parts sticking out of the water, and for something like this, the ointment would work well. You would want to apply this at least twice a day, since it doesn't stay on for long.

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